<p>mountainlover earlier today mentioned the Q&A with the author of Crazy U. If you haven’t read it, or looked in the mirror lately, it’s worth it:</p>
<p>"The [college] industry feeds off a bottomless resource: the love (and anxiety) parents feel for their children, and the hopes they entertain for their future.</p>
<p>As you say, in one respect, at least, the process of applying to college is much improved from my day: the information available has greatly increased in quantity and (though less so) in quality. My experience of selecting a college was typical of the time. I wandered over to the local library, opened a plump book the librarian found, picked a couple schools near where I wanted to live, and, after checking with my parents that we could swing it financially, sent off for an application. When it came I filled it out and then waited, not very nervously, for a reply.</p>
<p>Such a simple, lackadaisical approach, if undertaken today, would strike many parents as criminal negligence. Everybody, including me sometimes, is in favor of acquiring more, more, more information. But it’s important to remember that the exfoliation of statistics, assessments, reviews, scoops, and rumor is in itself part of the general craziness. It springs from the mistaken belief that where you go to college will make a huge difference in your future happiness, so you better absorb every bit of information you can before you make your decision.</p>
<p>This is one of the foundational myths of the college craziness, and a vast combine – from publishers to book-writers (!) to private counselors and test prep companies and the schools themselves – has an interest in keeping it alive."</p>
<p>A time of high highs and low lows, late March through early April of senior year can be, amongst other things, disillusioning. The seamy underbelly becomes just visible enough you really can’t deny it’s there. ;-)</p>
<p>Take heart, the whole package only needs to come together at <em>one</em> school of choice for the young applicant.</p>
<p>Hang in there!</p>
<p>And if all goes awry, it’s just an unexpected twist in the road. Life carries on with a full spectrum of challenges and opportunities.</p>
<p>MDCISSP - Just my two cents…I would go with Towson. Another tidbit maybe to think about. The money saved due to paying in state tuition might allow your son to intern over breaks and summers where other students may “need” to earn money. Experience will most certainly afford employment upon graduation.</p>
<p>We’ve been considering Binghamton and the 3.5 requirement is a concern to us as well.</p>
<p>Thanks for your response, RVM…I’m still on the fence if I want to pay to see it or not. I’m figuring at some point I’ll see it if I don’t see it this time. Yes, our h.s. is very competitive, but my S2 is similar to your S2 and is a true B/B+ student. I’m okay with that for the most part, as long as he studies and tries his best. I will have to change my mindset, as you did with having a true A student the first time around, and back off a bit.</p>
<p>I’m also ok with him taking Honors instead of AP, something that wasn’t even an option when my S1 was picking his classes. Thanks for your perspective.</p>
<p>Mhc: good post, thanks for your perspective too! :)</p>
<p>chocchip - I am watching one of S2’s best friends coming close to a nervous breakdown right now and the incredible impact this is having on him and his parents. It’s all about school pressure and APs and parental expectations, etc. The parents are incredibly guilt stricken and upset - and this very bright young man is drowning academically. It’s like watching the movie come to life.</p>
<p>Frankly - I thank G-d for giving me a “B” student - would not want to deal with the pressure and stress of a top achiever again.</p>
<p>Oh, goodness, I certainly don’t care what’s discussed here and don’t feel excluded but I know I’ve heard mention of William and Mary, Duke and UVA, none of which are B student schools IMHO. Maybe I’m just off base because I steered my kids towards match-safety schools and apparently treated match schools as reaches because my now senior son has been accepted to more schools then we thought he would be. A good problem.</p>
<p>Deborah T: Great illustration of the Talmudic approach! I can remember living your words in post 6642 a few years ago. I second what you said, “the whole package only needs to come together at <em>one</em> school of choice for the young applicant.” I’ll also add that that makes it easier when the kid has to make a decision.</p>
<p>Deskpotato: I love your list. In fact I saved it to remind me about things to look into when looking at a college. Colleges don’t have to offer everything on the list but it helps to know some of the answers up front so that a student can be proactive and also come up with a plan B.</p>
<p>Mdcissp: I may have a similar question with different schools for my S2. For the moment we have decided to go with the sure thing. For many students there is so much adjustment freshman year I think that is too much pressure for something that could have a very lasting impact. Another benefit of Towson that is good for you is that it is close to home and therefore connections made through school are also likely to be closer to home increasing the chance of S finding a job closer to home.</p>
<p>RVM, I found what you wrote,“Our hs is similar to what was shown in the movie - extremely competitive - tremendous pressure to take as many AP classes as possible, while maintaining perfect grades, having great ECs and doing community service.” really interesting. When my S1 was in HS he and the HS were not all that competitive. S1 is by nature an academic superstar and he really wanted to attend a college with rigorous admissions criteria. Within his school S1 seemed to be all that, but by CC standards, not so much. I pretty much pushed him towards service activities that were unrelated to school because the school didn’t offer this bridge. Leadership opportunities were more limited than I thought they could or should have been. When we were suddenly looking at schools that were on the national stage rather than local, I found myself wishing he went to a school like yours that seemed to me did a better job to prepare students to be competitive for those super reach schools. The grass always looks greener doesn’t it. Now, without seeing the movie but after seeing what so many of you have said I still wish our school did more to facilitate service and leadership but although S1 is diligent he is one of the most layed back people I know. He probably would have hated that pressure and may not have done as well. I can see that now.</p>
<p>kathiep - Agree with you that Duke, W & M and UVA are not schools for “B” students. Sometimes we digress a bit as many of us have another child who is a stronger student. Sometimes it is useful to describe what you are looking for in the context of schools you liked with another child - but would be too reachy for a “B” student - for example - I have used the phrase Wake “lite” to describe what I hope to find for S2.</p>
<p>And I agree with you regarding match/safety schools - as I wrote a few pages back - my son’s GC was concerned that he did not have any reaches on his list and suggested Duke - which we all agreed was absurd.</p>
<p>Our focus is finding great colleges with some Jewish life for our “B” students - but if we wander off the beaten path once in a while (get it - wandering Jews) - that’s ok too, and you are always welcome to wander with us.</p>
<p>Rockville Mom: I don’t think you need to worry about reach schools. It sounds like you have some schools you think are a good fit for your son. With his high ACT score plus all the other great things your son has to offer, I think it better to focus on finding schools which will give him a stellar merit package. Also, your son should qualify for honors programs that have perks.</p>
<p>spectrum - one of the differences I notice between my two sons is that S2 is having fun. He’s a happy kid. He has a busy social life and in any given week is out 3-4 nights. He is relaxed and calm. There is no doubt in my mind that he could work harder and bring some of those B’s up to A’s. But he chooses not to do so - and I am finally ok with his choices. He’s a very average kid at our ultra-competitive hs - and I am very comfortable with that scenario and where that leads us in the college process.</p>
<p>mdcissp - I agree. And I although I like to research schools and I like to think out loud on this thread - I can tell you unequivocally - that this second time through the process will be calmer and happier.</p>
<p>Race to Nowhere: I did pay for it and thought that it was worth it. The most valuable aspect to me was the discussion afterward. Apparently, the filmmakers require this or they will not release the film to that sponsor.</p>
<p>Rockville Mom: I think your son would find a great fit at Towson. The kids generally appear easy going, down to earth and social. They look like they really want to “fit in” with the group.Honors program at Towson would give your son extra perks plus he would probably like the Hillel and Business school varied clubs. With the high ACT score, I think you should also re-consider an application to U. Maryland College Park. If your son gets the honors program, he will get some smaller classes and various perks. I suggest you consider your son applying to Smith Business as a freshman. Why not apply? I think he will enjoy the social life and rah rah spirit. Jewish life is excellent at College Park and you get the in state tuition. You should be pleased that he is happy and has a great social life.</p>
<p>Hi - thank you for the compliments - we are keeping Towson on his list. The problem we have with Maryland is that he is not 100% committed to being a business major and they do not offer a business minor - so that makes it a little more complicated. He is more interested in schools where he can major in either psychology or sports mgmt - and minor in business. We are in agreement that a business major might be too math-focused for him - the accounting, finance, quantitative analysis type courses might just be too much.</p>
<p>One thing that I think is really going to help will be the Elon program we will be attending in April where they will he will have a chance to attend a business school specific presentation and a sports mgmt specific presentation and try to get a feel for what he might want to do. We also plan to attend a business school presentation at Virginia Tech in April as well. If he were to commit to the idea of majoring in business - then yes - I agree that he should apply to MD and see if he can be a direct admit to the Smith school of business - but I don’t know if he is strong enough to be accepted.</p>
<p>I’m a little leery of anything that forces him to commit to a particular major right away - as he is so unsure of what he wants to do.</p>
<p>If your son can get acceptance to B-school right off and not have to apply later, I think you have a much better scenario. Can always leave B-school (such as Smith) for a different area on campus. It is harder to get into B-school after starting college.</p>
<p>My other best advice is to apply early. Not early decision, but just apply early. I think one of the reasons my son got 4 university acceptances is that he applied early. Don’t wait to the last minute.</p>
<p>Thanks, Levirm for letting me know you paid to see the movie…yeah, there is a discussion afterwards…</p>
<p>RVM: I would go to see the movie if you think it’ll help me ease up on S2…it clearly had an impact on you and maybe that’s what I need too?! My S2 is also very happy go lucky…he has made a small group of friends, which has been hard for me to watch since S1 has a large group of friends and actually several groups, where S2 is happy with the few close friends and that’s enough…he’s still a freshman, but I do see him picking activities he’s really enjoying and that are totally different than S1’s…and he is pursuing the Robotics now too, which will be a big committment starting in Sept!</p>
<p>Yeah, RVM…S1 worked on his ED app. the whole month of August last year…in-between working…I think he had a total of 4 essays (?) for this one app. and kept re-writing them over and over again until he was very pleased with the results. It paid off for him!</p>
<p>chocchip: From what you have said I don’t think that our kids are really similar but they are similar in that they are tremendously different from each other. S1 is a few friends type, S2 is a many friends and several groups type. S2 often has several friends over for the night on weekends. S1 told me over break that he can’t understand why he would want to do that. My point is that having a small group of friends can be great. Different people need and want different things. Sometimes I wonder how two boys raised in the same house can be so different. I know that happiness means something different to each of my boys. They have different syles so I try to support them differently. It sounds like your S2 is evolving just fine. I find that after getting into a groove about what was good for S1 I often have to remind myself that S2 is different and doing things differently is what he needs. My point in all this, don’t feel bad about your S2 being a small group kid. It sounds like he has freinds and interests and he’s happy.</p>
<p>As for the movie no clue. I’d love to see it but it doesn’t sound at all like our community.</p>
<p>Again I will say both my boys are more mature than I am. My S2 told me a few months ago…In essence he was saying, Don’t worry about me, mom, I’m fine. I prefer to have a small group of friends…now I need to listen!</p>
<p>As far as the movie goes, that describes our h.s. and community. I’ll figure out if I’ll go watch it or not. Thanks for your suggestions and advice!</p>
<p>A naive question or maybe I am thinking too simplisitic:</p>
<p>B school or not?? At smaller schools is it that you just apply to the school and then declare a major? Larger schools you have to apply to the B school? e.g. At JMU, you have to take all the required level 1 & 2 classes then apply to the B school and hope you get in, but at Elon and C of C you are admitted and then declare your major.</p>
<p>on another note, i woke to snow on the ground in jersey. i am sooooooo supporting my son’s want to go south for school :)</p>
<p>samtalya - the business school issue is indeed quite confusing. Some schools - you simply declare your major to be marketing or whatever towards the end of sophomore year. Others - you have to take 10 prereq courses - have a certain minimum GPA - and you are still not guaranteed admissions - JMU. Some you aply directly into the business school from your initial application - UMDCP - and if accepted - you just have to maintain a certain GPA - but you are a “direct admit”. To generalize - it seems easier at the smaller schools and more complicated at the larger schools.</p>
<p>I think this would be confusing enough if one was sure they wanted to major in business - if you are not sure - even more so.</p>
<p>One comment on the issue of friends - I watched both of my boys’ friends situations change 100% during hs. Go back a few years - pre-hs - and S1 had a very large circle of friends - mostly Jewish - from school/soccer/hockey. He went to about 30 Bar Mitzvahs. S2 had a tiny group of 4-5 friends that he had since elementary school. I felt really sorry for S2.</p>
<p>Then we get to hs and things completely changed for both. S1 started being so focused on schoolwork and less on socializing. The soccer team disbanded - he lost interest in hockey. I would say his circle of friends and his social life declined during hs - again having a lot to do with issues raised by the film. He sacrificed socializing to pursue the perfect GPA. S2, on the other hand, joined BBYO and his circle of friends expanded tremendously and he became a social butterfly. I never expected that!</p>
<p>So - just saying - don’t assume that where they are socially in 9th grade will correlate to where they are socially in 11th or 12 tth grades - it did not for either of my sons.</p>