<p>in general, the SUNY’s haven’t had a lot of OOS – i think part of that is lack of name recognition and being located in some more remote areas of the state. eg. binghamton, the most selective university center, simply isn’t a thriving metropolitan area. geneseo, the most selective liberal arts college, is very rural. even a school like albany, located in the state capital, probably just won’t have the appeal of a UMCP which is a metro ride away from dc. people often refer to stony brook as being “near NYC” – but “near” means a 2 hour train ride and possibly even longer if you try driving it. also there hasn’t been a SUNY flagship to draw the focus of OOS attention.</p>
<p>but with the budget situation, the SUNYs have apparently been making more of an effort to attract OOS. and binghamton i think benefited by being named a kiplinger top value for OOS.</p>
<p>latest figures on binghamton’s website – 14.5% OOS, another 10% international. <a href=“http://www2.binghamton.edu/admissions/pdf/premier-public.pdf[/url]”>http://www2.binghamton.edu/admissions/pdf/premier-public.pdf</a> which is an increase from what it was just a couple of years ago. realize many of those OOS are from NJ and other nearby states, but it is starting to draw attention from students further away as well and it is becoming less “unusual” to find students from further away states – the SUNY OOS tuition is a real bargain – there is always talk about raising it.</p>
<p>mdcissp: To clarify, it is my older S who had a problem with UT not S2. He had his own unique criteria for schools but seemed content to call UT his safety. That is up until decision time, and that created some stress. S2, at least for now is quite happy with the idea of UT, only thing is, while because of the unique laws in Texas we will know by the end of Junior year if it is or isn’t a safety (its all a matter of class rank), right now it is definitely not a sure thing for him. I was just suggesting, based on our experience it might be a good idea to have more than one safety unless the student really loves the safety school.</p>
you’ve been talking about your s being interested in business - binghamton’s school of management (SOM) has an excellent reputation and is significantly harder to get into than its other schools. so just bear that in mind when you look at admission stats whichlump together the stats for all of binghamton. you might want to go to the suny binghamton forum and search “SOM” to get more info about how admissions for SOM were.</p>
<p>I did a doctorate at Pitt and lived in Squirrel Hill, the traditional jewish neighborhood, joined the jewish community center, put my son in a jewish daycare etc but we are not jewish. It just was a community that I felt comfortable in and was very welcoming to everyone. </p>
<p>Coming from the south, I had never really been exposed to a large jewish community but our time in Squirrel Hill was made very special by the community we lived in. However, I didn’t really feel that Pitt, as a university was particularly friendly to Jewish students rather just being in Pittsburgh provided a lot of community support to out of state jewish kids at the various universities in Pittsburgh (CMU, Pitt, etc). After being at Duke as an undergrad where the Hillel was extremely active, Pitt actually seemed very low key interms of on campus visibility…but I am obviously not an expert and it was a while ago. Sometimes, jewish students are more active and supportive of each other on campuses where they are more of a minority or there is less community support (southern campuses, for example)…just an observation. I miss Pittsburgh and my links to the squirrel hill community which was so welcoming to everyone. During our time there, some friends from Chicago who are conservative jews came to visit us and were just astounded and jealous of what a great community was there and how the community was just a fluid and pretty harmonious mix of such different jewish and non-jewish residents…but pitt students on campus won’t really experience this unless they get off campus occasionally. You aren’t far away…go to visit this september, make a weekend of it …make sure you stay at a hotel or b and b in squirrel hill and walk around, go to the community center, wander through the stores as well as do the usual tour of the univeristy etc. If you become a fan, there is the southside, northside and downtown (oh my the Italian food!). Great city, truly great city…my son will start at CMU in August …back to where he was born…I am more excited about parent’s weekend than anything else!</p>
<p>I apologize about my comment regarding merit aid being denied to ED students. I was referring to colleges in general, not Elon. I have no knowledge of Elon’s policy.</p>
<p>RM - I am glad that you are not seriously considering WVU for your son (although it may be a fit for some students) - but I agree that if it even crossed your mind you should go up the road just one hour and fifteen minutes and check out Pitt. I think that the Hillel has changed since fineartsmajor was there - and there are good connections between students and community - which Hillel also fosters. I agree with those who are suggesting that there are certain advantages to large schools. Would you consider just visiting a large school or two to see what your son thinks?</p>
<p>“western PA is worse than eastern PA in terms of weather”: I really do not think that this is true. Western PA had the same storms that DC had this year, but Pitt (not the city, actually, but Pitt itself) coped well. </p>
<p>Pittsburgh’s Jewish University Center gets a lot of financial support from the local community, and therefore it is staffed extremely well, with great people. But I have a question - how do Hillels in locations with few Jews get financial support? I know that Penn State Hillel is supported by the Jewish Federations in Philadelphia and Pittsburgh. The Hillels will hit up the parents for donations. But how do these small places with small Jewish populations, without Jewish alumni, survive financially?</p>
<p>Wow - sounds like we have more visiting to do! And I have to learn how to spell Binghamton. I guess it’s not related to the Hamptons? Or maybe I’m spelling that wrong as well.</p>
<p>fineartsmom - thanks for joining in - I have never been to Pittsburgh - but you have made it sound quite inviting.</p>
<p>Regarding Pittsburgh: We visited Pittsburgh when our older son considered Carnegie Mellon. It is an old city. The downtown was small and limited-not at all like DC, Chicago, or Manhattan. The neighborhood around Pitt was full of solid brick buildings and felt like a return to the 50’s. I have heard very favorable feedback about the neighborhood of Squirrel Hill. I think Rockville Mom’s son would be very comfortable at the Hillel-medium size, pleasant modern building, student oriented. It is worth a visit, athough I like Towson better.</p>
<p>funny but Pitt reminds me of Chicago and NYC because of the strong ethnic neighborhoods/communities but of course is not as large…yet…great arts --ballet, opera, theatre, …it is a good place to grow old and also raise kids. You get a lot of the benefits of a metropolis without the traffic or size. The weather is awful in the winter so fantasy retirement would have my son settle down in Pittsburgh as a successful artist with a studio on the southside while husband and I would shuttle between Pittsburgh and a nice apartment in Buenos Aires…really, my two favorite cities–could it be the great italian food in both cities? Anyway, Rockvillemom, you are close enough to give it a try and make a weekend of visiting the various universities there and make some stops to see other schools along the way.</p>
<p>“And I have to learn how to spell Binghamton. I guess it’s not related to the Hamptons?”</p>
<p>SUNY Stony Brook is closer to The Hamptons, and now has a satellite campus in the Hamptons. Binghamton (the city) is about as unrelated to The Hamptons as you can get!</p>
<p>Thanks for posting the article about Squirrel Hill in Pittsburgh, PRJ! As an example of what this community is like, I know every single person quoted!
I agree with fineartsmajor; this is an exceptional community (maybe it is like Buenos Aires, which I hope to visit someday:). I have lived many places in this country, with large and tiny Jewish populations, and I keep telling my kids that they have a very, very special community.
One aspect of the universities that people may not appreciate at first glance is the incredible sense of cooperation that exists within and among departments and universities. Unlike some universities, where a culture of competition exists, there is a lot of sharing, interdisciplinary work, joint ventures, partnerships, public/private cooperation, etc. at the universities here. This attitude truly permeates the culture.
In terms of the cultural events that finartsmajor mentioned, students get great deals on these, and they ride the bus for free with very frequent service to the downtown cultural district. Of course, the student and faculty performances and exhibits right on campus are also great, and the Carnegie art and natural history museums are next to the Pitt and CMU campuses.
When you visit, take a stroll through the strip district and the south side to get a little more flavor of this charming city.</p>
<p>OK, I admit to commenting on this thread sometimes just so it gets bumped up. I love this thread!
Comment on weather in western PA: southwestern PA weather is much, much different than northwestern PA weather. Northwestern PA gets the “lake effect”. There is a line of demarcation probably about an hour and a half north of Pittsburgh, maybe somewhere in Mercer County, where a different weather zone starts. Then, you get into Meadeville and Erie, where there is some serious weather!</p>
<p>levirm - I am so glad you - and many others - are enjoying our thread. I had no idea it would go on for so long and be so interesting.</p>
<p>On the weather issue - we are not big fans of snow and cold weather. DH is from Buffalo and I grew up in north/central Jersey - so we have both “done our time” in cold climates. I appreciate the fact that various posters have suggested Ithaca, Binghamton, Pitt, etc., but S2 wants warm weather and so do we! It might sound selfish - but I was reading another thread about the weather at Ithaca - and I’m sure it is beautiful - but - it’s just not the right fit for us. I’m not sure how bad the weather gets at some of the PA schools we have on our list - Gettysburg, Muhlenberg and Susquehanna - but those are only 1-3 hours from us - can’t be that much different - I think.</p>
<p>Perhaps we could broaden the geographic focus, which seems pretty mid-Atlantic (with occasional forays to Charleston or Florida to the South and Binghamton to the North) to draw in others to what has been a valuable thread. Anyone interested in California, Midwest (I think we’ve had a few discussions about Kenyon and some other Midwestern schools), the Southwest, the Rocky Mountain states, the Northwest, the deep South (Tulane, anyone?) or Canada (a big interest of my daughter’s)? Maybe I missed it as it is hard to fully follow a long thread.</p>
<p>We’ve got Colorado College on my daughter’s list (though it may drop) but I have no idea about Jewish life there. What about Oxford College of Emory?</p>
<p>shawbridge - I agree completely. I’ve got a good working list for S2 - would love for others to feel free to use this thread as their resource to explore colleges elsewhere in the country.</p>
<p>I think Tulane would be a wonderful choice for a Jewish student who either lived closer to that area or was willing to travel further from home. It’s probably more of a reach for a B student - but get up to a B+/A- - say with a 30 ACT - and you would have a good shot. They give wonderful merit aid to strong students. I also like their fast app thing - whatever they call it - where you do not have to submit an essay or app. fee.</p>
<p>From our large public hs Naviance - in 2010 - 41 applied, 22 were accepted and 1 will attend. Everyone who had at least a 4.20 weighted GPA was accepted. Pretty much everyone with a GPA close to that and either a 29 or higher ACT was accepted (or a 1250 SAT). So, these are not really B students - but more in the B+/A- range.</p>
<p>Very few students from our hs have applied to Oxford/Emory - I know next to nothing about that school.</p>
<p>RM, how many schools does the average student at your HS who is not a lock to get into and go to UMCP apply to? From the low percentages of admittees enrolling that come up with every school you cite–Tulane’s 1 in 22 being the latest–my sense is that kids are applying to over a dozen schools and getting into 10 before choosing the lucky winner.</p>
<p>I know a lot of counselors suggest 4 reaches, 4 matches and 4 safeties.</p>
<p>I think applying to 12 schools is ridiculous. The applications are a stressful process-each essay needs to answer the questions and asking 12 teachers for recommendations-sounds like asking too much. Also, you have the 12 fees for SAT and/or ACT scores, AP scores and possibly SAT subject scores if taken. All of these fees (applications ,test scores, etc.) could easily add another $500-$1,000. I ask why stress so much?</p>
<p>Right now, my son plans on 4 applications. I think this is plenty.</p>
<p>Also, Rockville Mom: I hate the summer weather in Pittsburgh–very humid. Do not know if the weather is any better the rest of the year. As far as Florida is concerned, I hear the only really nice weather is in the winter. Otherwise, lots of rain, thick humidity and bugs.</p>
<p>If you want GREAT weather, Jewish population, B plus sounds good, why not apply to San Diego State University? Should be reasonably priced for OOS. San Diego is a beautiful place to retire.</p>
<p>I think 8 - 12 is the norm. One of the things that might skew the numbers at our hs is that because of the sheer size - 650 kids per class - it is hard to request last-minute transcripts be sent out. Our registrar’s office has a very firm schedule allowing 6 weeks turnaround time - so kids are more likely to apply to many schools early. Let me give an illustration:</p>
<p>Say “Billy” applied ED to his dream school and finds out on December 15th that he was deferred. If Billy attended a smaller school, he could request more transcripts be sent out during the following week for schools with January deadlines. That won’t fly at our hs - instead, Billy has to think ahead and request those transcripts in October or November at the latest. True, if he gets in ED he wouldn’t need to actually submit the applications, but the transcripts have been sent out and reflect in the total number in Naviance. So, I feel that some of the Naviance numbers may be off in that the data points that are there are valid - but if you add up the total number of applicants and the total number of data points - they do not match - as some kids never followed through on the applications or never informed the GC of their results.</p>
<p>I think the other factor here is that every year, without fail, the Washington Post will run one or more horror stories about a great applicant who did not get in anywhere. This freaks people out and they think they need to apply to more schools. I don’t want to be nuts about it - but I would rather S2 apply to more schools than he needs to than find himself in a situation where he has only 1 or 2 acceptances to chose from and feels disappointed.</p>
<p>mdcissp - I don’t think 8 - 10 is unreasonable - 12 might be stretching it a bit. If most take the common app - that saves a lot of time right there. At our hs - you just ask 2 teachers to write for you - they copy the recs and mail to the schools you have requested - so not too big of a problem and some schools don’t even want recs anymore. When we were at JMU - they made a point to stress that recs are completely optional - and if you do send - only send one - they won’t look at more than one. With 22,000+ apps - they have no time to read more than that.</p>
