<p>Muhlenberg’s size and percentage of Jewish students are pretty close to Swarthmore’s. Are they offering a Kosher dining hall or just kosher entrees?</p>
<p>My sense that the writer was orthodox could be mistaken. Given his preference for Chabad, a kosher dining hall and singing Jewish songs after meals, plus his envy of Illinois’ large modern orthodox population, he seemed unlikely to be reform, but could be conservative. I did not think his quote was suggesting that Hillel cater to the less observant, as so many of his complaints were that it was not observant enough and he was so negative about how some of the religious services did not meet his standards.</p>
<p>You are absolutely right that he seems not to have tried to volunteer at his Hillel, while sneering at their dinners, servbices, etc. </p>
<p>Separately, I think parents need to be ready for their kids becoming less involved with Judaism while in college. For many of them, part of the separation from living at home and moving on from high school will be dating nonJews, just as kids from Catholic schools often seize the chance to dress as they please and date Jews. Some who spent much of their free time in USY-type groups may think that shunning Hillel is a way to show they are no longr in high school. </p>
<p>As kids mature, many will realize that downplaying their Jewish identity was sort of a fad and find a happy medium, just as many kids who think they are showing their independence by drinking or drugging grow past it.</p>
<p>It seems to me that the author’s dissatisfaction with the Hillel at Swat has 2 causes:</p>
<p>first, of course,is the small size of Swat’s Jewish population…there is not a sufficient number of Jews on campus to have the critical mass needed have multiple successful options (religious, social and educational), especially as Hillel is not the only activity the Jewish students are going to be involved in.</p>
<p>Second is the fact that, as the author noted, Swat has a reputation for being somewhat anti-religious. In other words, a lot of students at Swat—Jewish students included__ are not looking for religious involvement at this time in their lives. In other words, a lot of the 300 or so Jewish students on campus are not at all going to be involved in Hillel.</p>
<p>This is something that maybe the author did not consider in terms of personal fit when selecting which college among his choices (whatever they may have been) to attend. If Jewish life/Hillel involvement was part of what he wanted in his college life, Swat might not have been the right choice for him, at least on this criteria. It may have been the right school for him on other criteria but not on this one.</p>
<p>For a kid smart enough to get into Swarthmore, it was a pretty stupid article! Obviously there are going to be more opportunities to meet different students’ needs at a large school. He doesn’t happen to like the atmosphere at Swarthmore. It’s not a fault of Hillel as an organization.</p>
<p>D1 and I toured Muhlenberg and Swarthmore, and got a totally different Jewish life vibe at each. The Jewish population at Swat might be 20-30% compared to the 30%+ at 'Berg, but they had a totally different vibe. The Muhlenberg Hillel is a stand-alone dedicated facility with a high level of activity, while the Swarthmore Hillel is a not-always-open room in a shared building. </p>
<p>Of course, Swat is not a school for a B student of any religion but it’s a good stand-in for smaller schools that have a seemingly significant Jewish population and a Hillel. Some kids might be happy with the level of involvement from a Swat-like Hillel; others will want more. I like that the article is essentially a “caveat emptor” written by a current student. </p>
<p>The kosher food announcement from the Muhlenberg site: </p>
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</p>
<p>I still think people are being a bit harsh towards the author. A few quotes from the article seem to show that he’s not a baseless whiner. “As an involved Jew at Swarthmore College” "This is what we try to embody every week at the Swarthmore College Hillel and it doesn’t work. " He mentions both the orthodox and liberal community at Penn and Illinois. As for Chabad, they really DO reach out across the ideological spectrum. I know lots of Reform and Conservative Jewish kids who regularly go to Chabad dinners because the rabbi and rebbitzen are so welcoming and the food is so good. :)</p>
<p>I agree that the guy didn’t do his homework, but he gets points in my book for a)trying to build community, and b)looking at Hillel’s shortcomings. The idea that smaller Hillels might want to try something other than being all things to all comers is worth considering at some campuses.</p>
<p>I cross-posted with SlitheyTrove, and interestingly, my S recognized that quantity should not be the deciding factor in his decision. A small, but engaged, community will fit his needs well.</p>
<p>I also am shocked at this description of Swarthmore. On paper, it sounded like the perfect place for my son in terms of Jewish life – website showed lots of Jewish-related organizations and they have this whole center devoted to study of Jewish texts. We never visited, though. Just goes to show you how important it is to visit. </p>
<p>I’m sorry this is getting off-topic. My S’s GPA was a bit low so that’s why I’ve been interested in this thread, but he had super high SATs, so that’s why Swarthmore for us. (he got rejected, and just as well!!)</p>
<p>Also, I still don’t think that the problem with Swarthmore is a Hillel problem – it’s that the particular leader and students just aren’t really doing a good job. I do agree that Chabad is welcoming and designed to bring out the joy in Judaism. That seems to me what the kid’s real problem was – the attitude at Swarthmore, not an organizational flaw of Hillel per se.</p>
<p>Just chiming in to say that I have really been enjoying this thread. So far, haven’t had anything of value to offer, but thank you to all the for thoughtful dialogue and advice (so far)!</p>
<p>SDon: thanks for the Grinnell post…just goes to show you that there is a place for everyone’s Jewish identity…it looks like the author from Swarthmore didn’t find that place, unfortunately…</p>
<p>The Grinnell student said “I accepted Grinnells offer with little hesitation, speculating that I would figure out the Jewish part once I got to campus.” Interesting to see that go-with-the-flow feeling working for some students, while others discover that they actually wanted something specific.</p>
<p>I thought that these articles were both very interesting.
This is our story:
Our children all grew up in a kosher home and attended a Jewish day school through grade 8. The oldest continued to attend services weekly through high school and was involved in USY and our local Hebrew supplementary high school program. She became involved in Hillel at college, along with Chabad to a lesser extent and the local Jewish community to a greater extent.
The next two questioned everything about Judaism, attended services rarely during high school, and would not be caught dead participating in youth group activities and dropped out of the supplementary Hebrew high school program after the program directors tried everything under the sun to get them to stay. They both became involved in Chabad in college. One, who incidentally was at Penn, MUCH preferred Chabad over Hillel.
These three kids have each been to Israel at least three times, and one of them has also been on community service trips with Chabad to other countries. The two younger ones have taken courses through Chabad and have been paid a stipend to do so, have also recruited others for these courses and have been paid stipends to do this. I know that this is a controversial aspect of Chabad’s activities. But, my kids genuinely enjoy the Chabad activities, say that the kids who participate are “mostly reform”, love these kids and come home very enthusiastic and ready to discuss many aspects of Jewish history, law, etc. They also say that the Chabad rabbis are extremely funny, personable, relate extremely well to college students, encourage them at their level of observance, and seem genuinely interested in them as people.
I don’t see any sign at all that my kids are going to become Lubavitch.
But, I think that Chabad is doing something right!
And, I think that Hillel, in many places, is also doing something right. But, it all comes down to the leadership, and, to some extent, the resources.
For example, I am sure that the Muhlenberg Hillel director is doing a fabulous job with excellent support from her institution. But, to reiterate a question that I asked earlier, how do these small places with small local Jewish communities and few Jewish alumni find funding?
And, does this Grinnell article indicate that Grinnell wants to recruit Jewish students? Just wondering! A Jewish B student that I know was admitted there, but he chose to attend elsewhere.</p>
<p>SDonCC - thanks for adding the Grinnell piece - what a wonderful counterpoint to the Swarthmore article I found. The takeaway for me is that I may have been focusing too much on how many Jewish students attend a particular college and whether or not it has an “active” Hillel - when once again - it all comes down to fit. Seems to me that if Hillel is of any level of importance to your student - a lengthy visit - perhaps an overnight - perhaps a Shabbat dinner - is in order.</p>
<p>For an initial screening of a Hillel, check out the college’s Hillel website photo gallery. When were the photos posted (how recently)? What kind of acitivities are portrayed? And take a look at the kids in the pictures – are there just the same few faces in every picture?</p>
<p>SDon–thanks for the great Grinnell article! She went for "fit’, assuming that such a place would have studnets, Jewish or not, who would make it a great 4 years. I think it fit is crucial and the right fit will yield Jewish kids well suited to your child. </p>
<p>If they are only a small number, remember that, at any school, your child will likely focus on a small group of good friends.</p>
<p>Re Muhlenberg vs. Swarthmore, I think the kids at Swarthmore are–on average–more intellectual, less religious and less interested in a Jewish social life. Muhlenberg, a Lutheran school which relies on attracting a large percentage of Jewish students, has strong motivation to build an attractive Hillel for recruiting purposes.</p>
<p>Re whether Jewish applicants have an advbantage at Grinnell, I do not know, but I suspect liberal schools in Iowa work hard to recruit a more diverse student body than most Iowa schools attract.</p>
<p>The Grinnell article was just one piece among many written by students about various aspects of Grinnell life. I pulled it from the collection.</p>
<p>In the article, the girl did say that she attended a Shabbat dinner before she decided to come, so she didn’t wing it entirely.</p>
<p>Regarding the advice above to check out the Hillel website – I found that schools don’t always update the websites, so I wouldn’t necessarily look at that as an indication. You really need to kick the tires!</p>
<p>I just wanted to say that this discussion about the variations in Hillel is one of the great things about this thread. When S1 applied to college it seemed we invented the wheel all by ourselves. While it occurred to us to look for Hllels at various colleges it didn’t occur to us to probe and speak to people and get a feel for the specific Hillel communities. I was just happy to know that there was a place available if S wanted it. Fortunately he found just that at the college he attends. He isn’t an active member but when it has been important to him to find Jewish activity, as on holidays he has found it there. I expect that Jewish community will be more important to S2 than it was to S1 and I am so thankful for all the discussion about how so many of you are exploring campuses to assess the Jewish life fit. There are so many components of the college search that bombard a student, it is easy not to do “all” of the homework. Thank you to all of you who have shared your concerns and searches. This adds a dimension and layer to the college search that we didn’t previously consider. Perhaps that Swarthmore student would be happier in college today had the author had this thread to read when applying to college!</p>
<p>Adding to the theme of how to explore Hillels - yabeyabe had previously suggested looking at the Hillel Facebook page. I’ve only had time to check out one so far - but this is quite illuminating - as you can see how many members the FB group has - are they all girls - how often they have events, etc.</p>
<p>Rockville Mom and others: Have you recently visited colleges/universities mentioned on this thread? Can anyone provide recent feedback about these visits pertaining to the concerns of Rockville Mom (B plus student, B-school, Jewish activities). We are particularly interested in Towson and would love to hear from others about their reactions to this school (and other schools mentioned as well).</p>
<p>I think you can look at FB pages without being a member. It may require, however, looking up the page on Google (e.g., “Elon Hillel”) and then clicking on the link, rather than just going to facebook.com and using its search feature.</p>
<p>FB now has over 500 million members worldwide, which is the 21st century in a nutshell. I hesitated before joining, but have enjoyed getting back in touch with very old friends and former coworkers, in addition to the value of checking FB pages for class of 2014 and Hillel.</p>
<p>As someone else noted, do not put too much reliance on Hillel FB pages–colleges, especially small ones, have so many ways of getting news out to students that Hillel pages may not list all events and, unless some member is dedicated to it, updates can be scanty and photos nonrepresentative.</p>
<p>“As someone else noted, do not put too much reliance on Hillel FB pages–colleges, especially small ones, have so many ways of getting news out to students that Hillel pages may not list all events and, unless some member is dedicated to it, updates can be scanty and photos nonrepresentative.”</p>
<p>That’s true, but if there are lots of recent photo albums of well-attended events with many different smiling faces, that should be quite reassuring.</p>
<p>Hanna - I agree - an active FB page is a good sign - but I also see yabeyabe’s point in that a less active page is not necessarily a bad sign.</p>
<p>mdcissp - hoping to get up to Towson very soon - our recent plans were derailed by the weather. I will post impressions once we return. My feeling today is that S2 will apply to Towson as a safety school. From what I have heard/read/researched - it meets enough of our criteria to be on the list. It is harder to measure the quality of the academics - but my impression is that the business major is one of the better departments. Certainly the location is convenient and the price is right. Jewish life seems to be very active. If we like what we see this weekend - we will keep it on the list and try to do another visit for an open house or other event in the spring.</p>
<p>Just looked at the Towson Hillel website again and their calendar shows many activities planned beginning August 21st. There is something pretty much every day. It seems like getting involved at Hillel at Towson would be pretty easy.</p>
but it’s a good stand-in for smaller schools that have a seemingly significant Jewish population and a Hillel. Some kids might be happy with the level of involvement from a Swat-like Hillel; others will want more. I like that the article is essentially a “caveat emptor” written by a current student. </p>