Comparing school culture

College Majors Music Majors
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Is there a good resource for comparing music school cultures virtually? We won’t be able to visit in person until auditions, and we’d like to get a feel for the schools to try to shorten our list. We will start applications this summer. We are aware that the professor (and ultimate school price) will be the biggest deciding factors.
Current plan is strings with chamber music focus.
Current schools on the list:
Peabody, Bienen, Oberlin, Eastman, Thornton, Colburn, University of Ottawa, University of Victoria (BC), Nuremburg Univeristy of Music

Have you been to some of these schools and are able to offer a comparison of what an undergraduate experience would be like at them?

Happy to hear suggestions of other international schools to consider for cello as well.

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When my son compiled his list of schools two years ago, his main source of information were his friends from various activities (all-state orchestra, NYO, summer music festivals, etc.). Actual students attending those schools and who knew my son gave him extensive and valuable information. Does your cellist have such friends who are a year of two ahead of them?
Of the schools you listed, we know something about Peabody, Bienen, and Eastman. Among these three, Bienen is more flexible to accommodate dual degree students. Eastman and Peabody both offer (and expect the students to take on) extensive opportunities to musical growth. All three have great chamber programs. From what we heard, Bienen chamber program requirement is less demanding; however, the students can be very serious and put in great effort to improve. Generally, Northwestern food is nothing to brag about. Many Peabody students feel left out by the general JHU community.
Overall, the “vibe” of the studio is the most important perspective (setting aside the cost if it’s possible). Other ways to observe the culture of a school include following them (official accounts and real student accounts) on social media, watching livestream events, talking to current students and professors, etc.

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You might check Lawrence out too. People seem happy with it.

We drove from the east coast to Oberlin twice, and stayed with a community member through a church host program we were told about- this was before airbnb! We liked how integrated the conservatory and college were in many ways, and the level of student support for performances. But that was quite awhile ago.

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I can confirm that at Oberlin the culture is very much as described by @compmom. Lots of cross pollination between the Con and the College and so so much support for fellow students.

My S22 was looking for a “college” experience while studying music. Eastman and Peabody fell off the list of applications due to both of their conservatories being physically separate from their main campuses and he knew he wanted to mingle with non music majors and take non music courses. But they are obviously both fantastic schools. It was just that situation that made them not as appealing to him when he was applying.

A close friend of S goes to Northwestern/Bienen. It really seems like there are lots of opportunities there to explore things other than your main performance major. Bienen also has more gen ed requirements than other music schools, although there is no foreign language requirement (Oberlin requires a semester each of Italian, German and French before taking diction in each of those languages). If the student applies to the Honors program, there is a foreign language requirement added, along with some other requirements.

Oberlin has a Double Degree program that about 1/3 of the Con students do- it takes 5 years- but is well defined and part of the system if desired.

It might be helpful to dig in to the degree requirements at each school to get a sense of the differences.

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Really great ideas above for researching schools.

I just wanted to add that it can be a good plan to apply to both university based programs and free standing conservatories. I know mine applied to 3 of each and really would not have been able to determine which setting was best for him until he had completed all of his auditions and seen the programs in person. By the end of the audition season his choice was obvious.

Of the programs you list for your son, we have some experience with Colburn and Thornton/USC. Colburn is a small population, the facilities are fabulous. Students seem to have great opportunities to perform and the program seems to adapt to individual student goals. It is of course free which is hard to pass up.
Thornton is a large program, has the advantage of the USC larger community with exposure and potential interaction with other genres of music and art. I will say that Thornton tends to prioritize graduate students with opportunities to perform (at least our experience with woodwinds) and with merit money.

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My cellist’s friends and other local cellists go to University of Ottawa. It’s where my cellist’s teacher generally sends students. DS is going to participate in an American summer music festival this year, but I haven’t been able to find anyone to talk about it yet - can’t even find where I heard about it anymore. I think it was on here and it’s Sun Valley in Idaho. He will be playing with college students there in the chamber program, so he can definitely ask them about their experiences, but that’s in August.
Generally, Canadians don’t go to the US schools because of cost, but as a dual citizen my son is eligible for federal aid and such and I’d personally like him to have the opportunity to live in the US for a while as well to see if he wants to live there as an adult (if we can find an affordable option).
I will pass on the details you’ve shared and see what he thinks. I know the cello teachers at Northwestern, Rice, Curits, and U of Ottawa have a solid enough reputation for our local teachers to know good things about them. However, Curtis fell off the list for some reason I can’t recall, and my son doesn’t love heat, so Texas doesn’t seem like a great match. I’ve started following various schools on facebook, but that isn’t the modern social media and my son doesn’t use it. We will have to make some sort of schedule of livestream events if we can find any available this summer.

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I will look into Lawrence again - I don’t recall why it dropped off the list. I’ll admit I don’t think rural Wisconsin will be a big seller to my cellist - so maybe it was me wanting him to have a more urban US experience (although I know a school like Oberlin is rural as well). When I first heard about Oberlin it sounded like a fairly excellent fit for him, so I am glad to hear you felt favourable about it.

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Thank you for your perspective. My son feels a conservatory experience is what he is looking for, so it’s good to know Peabody and Eastman really are similar to that. He doesn’t mind if there are other types of students and a broader school, but he isn’t looking for it, if that make sense.
Do all music students take the languages at Oberlin? Not just singers? We will need to dig more into the courses at each institution. I’ve looked at a few of the schools. I can see how useful many lanugages would be. That’s actually part of the thought of Germany - what better way to learn German?

We’ve read the Double Degree Dilemma and he’s thought about it and he really just wants to do a performance degree for undergrad.

@anotheroboemom good to hear your impressions of Colburn and Thornton. Not sure if Thornton is affordable, but his one orchestra conductor/violinist went there for his doctorate and the environment does seem pretty unique.

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One of my son’s friends holds dual citizenship and is at Bienen. I believe he is a violinist. There is an instagram account for Bienen cello studio. It’s called practicemindbook.

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I’m sorry- I’m a dummy and I was just thinking about voice majors! Instrument majors don’t have the foreign language requirement.

It is helpful to see what various schools require for their performance majors if you can dig around websites to see sample curriculums.

Another thing that my S22 was certain about was performance opportunities in undergrad; that knocked out schools with grad programs like Northwestern and BU. I’m not surprised to hear that USC prioritizes their grad students. That school is local to us so was never on the list to begin with though Thornton is a wonderful music school.

Oberlin and CMU were the top contenders for him and ultimately he chose Oberlin for his studio teacher and the larger conservatory (CMU has a small music school comparatively). He did not apply to any standalone conservatories either.

While Oberlin is rural, it’s a lovely town with lots going on and it’s 40 minutes from Cleveland. Easy trip into the city and very easy to get to and from the airport.

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Agree 100%. My son thought he wanted a stand alone and came to find out through visits and auditions that he really did want a University. This was a 180 degree turn for him that we never expected. It was the “vibe” he was looking for (another word these kids us that is so important to them) that he didn’t get at the standalone’s. Ultimately, for him, it came down to the studio and the professor. Good luck on your journey…mine is a rising sophomore now and I am starting it with #2 (non-Music major)

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Two comments to add:

When in doubt, spread it out: My D thought that she was going to do a small LAC and we had only one big U with a music conservatory. By the end of the process, the small LACs (which she at first loved) started feeling waaay too small. She ended up at the big U. She realized her preference after auditions so…it may be worth it to have some variety in your school list.

Lawrence: it is not in a “rural” area. I grew up in Appleton…and only wanted to leave…so I’m not hurt when people don’t like the area. Still Appleton is really a small city. It is part of the Fox River Valley and a string of small towns all the way up to Green Bay (Packers)…including Kimberly (that probably makes your toilet paper and paper towels - Kimberly Clark). The paper and printing industries are quite large there. Appleton is considered the “big city” in that area and has a performance arts center, a charming downtown with lots of bars (no one does bars like WI). My D did audition there…but decided against a small school LAC…just felt the student body was too small with limited diversity (she is POC). Still, many students love the small school vibe. My D’s best high school friend went to Lawrence and loved it.

Edit: Lawrence and Oberlin would be similar in vibe…imo. If he is really unsure of the “small” (rural) school in a small city/town…you may want to have only one or two of these schools on his list. I really struggled to get my kid to put a big “affordable” U on the list. She was interested in schools in cities…but unfortunately…in researching many of the schools in cities…they just weren’t affordable to us (no financial aid available to us…eventhough we felt needy after seeing the tuition!!).

Good luck…it is a learning experience.

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Really good point! I feel like my son ended up so far from what he thought he wanted. Im starting the process now with my daughter (Nursing) and our first visits are to one very big and one small school bc she has no idea what she wants…maybe seeing one of each can narrow our path forward? Maybe not!

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I know this thread was started a few months ago, but I just stumbled on it and thought I’d chime in. Specifically, with regards to Eastman and Peabody.

My D (soprano) applied to both and was accepted at both. They do have a similar setup as a standalone conservatory a couple of miles away from their main campus. Both have a similar reputation. We traveled to both for auditions. In the end, she chose Eastman - in large part due to how she felt the culture was different at each. We both felt very quickly that Eastman seemed to have a very supportive environment. This was confirmed by chatting with a student from our hometown who was a rising junior there. Peabody felt, somehow… just a bit stand-offish and less warm. Add to that the voice faculty at Peabody made it clear that undergraduates very rarely get cast in operatic productions. At Eastman, undergraduates do get opportunities to be on stage and, in fact are required to sing in a certain number of productions.

Both cities have positives and negatives. Not sure there’s a clear winner there, but my D wasn’t super comfortable in Baltimore (Peabody).

Her decision was difficult because initially Peabody offered the (much) larger financial package. In the end, after appeal, Eastman’s offer was similarly competitive.

During audition season, my D was accepted to 9 schools (out of 11 applications). Eastman was consistently the one that inspired and excited her the most, and that’s where she is now.

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I just saw this and the recent response, might be too late for the OP, but maybe can help someone else. Just based on my son’s experience and the members of his group, there is a big difference between stand alone conservatories and music schools in university setting, sometimes really it isn’t so much about academics but simply being within a university. My son went to a conservatory undergrad (NEC) but for grad school went to Rice University (which I’ll talk about in a bit). He really liked after being in the stand alone conservatory being in a university setting, having a campus hangout and so forth. At a place like Northwestern you take classes with non music students, and that can be huge. Same would hold for USC and the other schools in a university I would guess.

Again, depends on the student. Okay, on to the schools (even if this won’t help the OP), o only talking about the ones that I know of through either my son or people around him, if it isn’t on my list, it is simply I don’t know.

Colburn is a very small school, and they have limited faculty. Obviously it being free makes a big difference (I am still crying, my S got in their undergrad). As such you are with the same small group of people and for some that can be a problem. Likewise, with limited faculty, if the teacher isn’t a match you are kind of out of luck, and that can be a problem given the nature of music teaching. My son knows people who went there, and he said that they all said they tend to be very strict there with the students, it is more like a strict summer camp than a typical college environment (and knowing the person running it, not surprised entirely). It does have gorgeous facilities and with the Disney Hall across the street there also is the influence of the LA Phil as well. With chamber, from what I have heard, because the program is small it is kind of a limited group of people you can play with, and from what I know it isn’t emphasized.

USC I have heard, at least in strings, is grad centric. I have heard mixed things about the strings faculty, even though they have had names there (midori was head of it at one point). Culture wise the music school from what I know is integrated into the broader school, so it feels more college like that way.

My son looked at Oberlin. They have decent faculty and it is a competitive school to get into, so you will be playing with relatively high level students. It is in a rural area so the school town is really it. Oberlin from what I know encourages music students to be part of the broader community, and the vibe is , at least according to my son, on the hippy side of things (to date myself lol).

Bienen is part of Northwestern . There are strong academic requirements, the program itself is also known as one of the golden locations for dual degree kids, and they do have good faculty there. It is not distinct from the rest of the school like some music programs in universities are.

Eastmen from what I know (I don’t have that much experience) is the music school is very supportive of their students and they have good faculty there. It does have Rochester in winter , which like much of upstate NY can be cold and snowy. Eastman is kind of standalone from U of Rochester if I heard right.

One school not on the list (which I know won’t help the OP, but maybe others will see it) is Rice University Shepherd. There are a lot of pluses there, they have good faculty, it is a really pretty campus and if you want to be part of the university the music school feels like that from what i can tell (my son went there grad school , not UG, but a member of his ensemble went there UG). For voice students they built an incredible theater for opera, and I have been told they have great faculty. For instrumental students they are a bit unique IME, they are ensemble oriented, unlike most schools that emphasize solo performing, they put a lot of emphasis into their orchestra and chamber music, and if you are thinking of heading that way , it may be a good stepping stone into getting into that world. They have chamber music faculty that are first rate as well. From what I have been told Rice is pretty good with aid as well, both merit and need based.

Again folks these are my impressions, nothing set in stone.

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