<p>My 8th grade son loves computers but is mostly self taught. The private school he goes to has NO computer classes at all. We are considering sending him to the local public school (for high school) for several reasons (including cost and the availability of computer courses.)</p>
<p>So questions for you all: down the road, if he wanted to study computer science, how important is it that he takes formal classes in high school? Is computer science usually an engineering major? Do you have to know that you want to study computers when you apply to college?</p>
<p>There are all sorts of varieties of computer science - engineering, programming, AI, robotics, etc.</p>
<p>If your son is interested in computers, you don’t want him to be behind the curve when he hits college. It is certainly possible to learn a lot on your own, but a formal course or two wouldn’t hurt. </p>
<p>If there is a robotics club at your son’s school, he will be able to pick up a lot by osmosis from the other kids. And have a heck of a good time. If not, a trip to the principal’s other at the private school might be in order - <em>why</em> are there no computer classes???</p>
<p>It is my impression that computer language and human aren’t so far apart: it’s easier to learn if you are exposed at an earlier age.</p>
<p>I work with nothing but Comp Sci graduates, Bachelors, Masters, PhDs. I don’t believe that any of them took actual classes in high school. But they all were tinkerers from the get go and taught themselves what they needed to know. Of course, they were in high school anywhere from 10-30 years ago:)</p>
<p>I think the issue is whether your son runs out of what he can teach himself well. You say he likes “computers”. Is it the hardware? Or does he love to program? Web pages? Databases? (eek). Depending on what it is he likes, I would maybe recommend he takes a class at the local community college. If he is a true Comp Sci guy he will follow his love of whatever part it is he likes and he probably doesn’t need theory or big-gun academics until he gets to college.</p>
<p>There are others on this board more qualified than I to comment and I hope they dive in. As I said, I just work with Comp Sci guys. It’s like that “I’m not a doctor but I play one on TV” commercial of years back.</p>
<p>An interest in computer science would be good if your son is applying to selective colleges. The interest could be demonstrated by taking computer science courses in highschool or by taking courses elsewhere. Computer Science is not an engineering major, as far as I know. It is oriented toward software and theoretical aspects of computer science which are mathematical in nature. There is also a major called Computer Engineering which is more engineering oriented and oriented towards computer hardware and how hardware and software works to make the computer run. There is a difference between the two but right now, your son being young, it probably does not make a difference to him. </p>
<p>In answer to your question “Do you have to know that you want to study computers when you apply to college?”, it depends on the college. For example, at Carnegie Mellon, which has one of the best Computer Science departments in the US, since the major is so much in demand, you would have to declare your major while applying. At other colleges, you could go in undecided and then become a computer science major later when you have developed an interest in the field. But high school is certainly a place to start developing an interest.</p>
<p>Alumother,
The younger people at our software company all took the AP Computer Science route into college, and feel that they would been at a disadvantage if they had not had that background. I like your suggestion of a community college class or two - excellent alternative.</p>
<p>First S took no comp sci classes in high school and then took a couple at the local CC after he graduated high school, did fine, got good grades. Second S took a comp sci class in high school and felt it was a waste of time (he had learned a lot on his own). He decided not to take the APcompsci class but to self study instead. He did great on the AP test.</p>
<p>Achat is correct, computer science is software and computer engineering is hardware, though Compengineers do usually take a few compsci courses.</p>
<p>In my opinion, it is an advantage to take some computer science/programming classes during HS, it is by no means necessary. The big advantage is that it would give him an idea if it is an area he would be interested in majoring in. Once a student decides to major in compsci there are many areas to specialize in: AI, robotics, data mining, bioinformatics, dbase systems, parallel computing, computer visison, networking, etc. Most students do not determine what specialization interests them until after they enter college.</p>
<p>If the lack of computer courses is the ONLY reason you are considering changing schools, perhaps you should reconsider. Many people can learn computer languages on their own and perhaps you could encourage your son to learn an entry language such as C+ or Java. I believe that the AP exam is now based on Java and if he learned that he could take the exam at an area hs offering it.</p>
<p>Around soph or jr year give him a junior membership in the Assn. for Computing Machinery. They have a magazine geared toward hs/college age students which my son enjoyed a lot. It guided him toward a multidisciplinary AI dual major.</p>
<p>Thank you all for your ideas and opinions. Different people have touched on many things that I’ve been thinking about (mainly for hours in the middle of the night, but you other parents know about that!).</p>
<p>ohio_mom says “…you don’t want him to be behind the curve when he hits college.” and “The younger people at our software company all took the AP Computer Science route into college…” Good things to think about.</p>
<p>And originaloog has a somewhat different view point: “…it is an advantage to take some computer science/programming classes during HS, it is by no means necessary…” and really hit a nerve with me saying “If the lack of computer courses is the ONLY reason you are considering changing schools, perhaps you should reconsider.” (this school change decision is a complicated one, and he is not just about computers.)</p>
<p>I really appreciate (and will follow up on) everyone’s suggestions for other ways to learn about computers. As I said, he “messes around” quite a bit. (software not hardware) (html, javascript, visual basic) I AM concerned that he learn the fundamentals, good programming techniques etc. I wonder if the structure of a class will irritate him but be good for him. I wonder if he has the maturity to do a serious self-study of a language. </p>
<p>And having just gone through the college application process twice in two years with my other kids, I worry about him getting in. Getting in somewhere where he will have the opportunity to further explore all those exciting areas that originaloog describes!</p>
<p>A contrarian view about the need for or importance of comp sci classes in HS: My son did not have any computer science at the high school level, yet he was accepted into the computer science program at CMU, Brown and Cornell. At Cornell he took the intro comp sci class, aced it, and had he opted to continue in comp sci he would have been at a par with those who took it in high school. Instead, he opted for computer engineering which offers a mix of software and hardware - with a slight emphasis on hardware. I echo the suggestion that if availability of comp sci is a major reason to change schools - don’t.</p>
<p>mdparent - I think the question here relates to preparedness for a college computer science curriculum. Acceptance to a respected CS program would obviously benefit from demonstrated interest in the field. AP courses are great but community college courses are good too. Self-taught works fine if one can demonstrate expertise, but doing that is a lot harder than getting A’s in a few CS courses. Once in college it would be enormously helpful if your son were already familiar with both programming and hardware. The workload in CS tends to be brutal.</p>
<p>Also, I’m with Alumother and Ohio_mom: I and every Computer Science graduate I’ve worked with had an interest in the field from a young age. I don’t think you’ll have to push your son into courses. It will be enough to make him aware of opportunities.</p>
<p>If your son gets as good a background as possible in math, he will be way ahead of those students who didn’t pay attention in math class but “know” all these computer languages when they enter college. It is not hard to learn computer languages; what usually brings the computer science aspirations of kids to a screeching halt is when they realize that computer science is truly about math. AP Computer Science involves a lot of math, too, but just taking math courses in high school will work at least as well in terms of preparing your son if he wants to study computer science. </p>
<p>In my experience, computer science tends to be offered by the engineering school of a university rather than the College of Liberal Arts and Sciences or equivalent. And I believe that it is a lot easier now than it was a few years ago (when there were more, and more lucrative, jobs for computer science graduates) to get into a computer science major. Enrollments are WAY down, but it may be different when your son is in college.</p>
<p>My experience is that I avoided computers not only all through high school but all through college as well. After getting my bachelor’s degree in math, I sort of discovered computer science and started taking courses in it. I was never “behind” anybody because everything in computer science is far easier to pick up when you have a good understanding of math.</p>