Yes, clearly.
As you probably could tell from my post, I am interested in shopping the retail that is safest in a pandemic for workers and shoppers. Is it retail that “falls in the space between big boxes and small local stores”? If so, could you say what type of retail you are referring to and why you think it is the safest?
You asked whether posters thought the over 80 death rate for the rest of the year would be lower than usual.
Many people who would have died Jun-Dec of other things instead died Jan-May of Covid. So fewer people will die of those other things Jun-Dec.
We aren’t through with Covid, but most states are doing much better jobs protecting Nursing homes. So Covid nursing home deaths should drop.
So the question is whether the
(reduced number of other cause deaths) will be greater than the
(increased number of Covid deaths) for Jun-Dec for the 80+ population
My expectation is that it will be. But that depends both on the virus and on human behavior, so it’ not a firm prediction, just my expectation.
I agree. In my own little world, just comparing the health of my MIL and Mom in their 80s to the health of my friends in their 80s is like night and day. So many health issues for MIL and Mom in their 80s. My friends in their 80s are in good health and still actively practicing yoga with me even though they are 15-20 years older than me!
Our under 65 death rate should go up greatly too. Those 40-50 million unemployed workers likely will lose their health insurance and those that retain it can’t afford copay anymore.
I’m going to set the flag right now that I think the death rate for over-80s for the rest of the year will be greater than usual. @MomofJandL, we can look at the numbers next January and see who’s right.
First of all, the majority of over-80s who died of covid would still have been alive on Jan. 1, 2021, if covid hadn’t happened, so their not dying in 2020 was expected. Secondly, we have not controlled the disease yet. I expect at least another 100,000 covid deaths in 2020.
^ I’m definitely one of the younger ones in my yoga class, too (it’s a 55 and over class.)
My mom is 91 next month, in excellent health, walks 15 min. miles and worked out at Planet Fitness twice a week (pre-Covid.) Her boyfriend is 76! She is working out at home now (online with PF) and doing chair yoga. It’s too hot to walk outside now (she’s in SFLa so in summer they would normally walk the mall) so she is riding her stationary bike.
My helpful hint - if you don’t use it as you get older - you lose it. Must stay active!
I don’t think that question can really be answered. How an individual store manages its safety can diverge from corporate policy. Size of the customer base, general fear level in the community, socio-economic breakdown of the customer base- all those come into play. Many rural stores don’t take as many precautions, but have none to very few positive COVID cases. Another store taking every precaution might have a cluster of cases due to one infected employee.
I am not aware of any national retailers- big or small- who are not taking this situation extremely seriously and doing everything possible to protect their employees and customers.
I agree @“Cardinal Fang”
The uncertainty is probably why political posturing and partisanship is high in COVID-19-related matters. When the information is incomplete, conflicting, or untrusted, people fall back onto their pre-existing partisan viewpoints and follow their partisan talk/thought leaders by default.
My hope for the silver lining is our country will finally get off its butt and provide health care for all - like pretty much every other first world country.
For the next pandemic -and everything in between - losing health insurance would no longer be an issue as it is now with health care reserved for those wealthy enough to afford it. Those wanting more than provided to all would still be able to pay for it.
If 9.8% of 85 year old males and 7.4% of 85 year old females die in any given year
https://www.ssa.gov/oact/STATS/table4c6.html
and the death rate from Covid for 80+ is 13% (lowest I saw from a quick google search), it’s kind of obvious that many of those dying from Covid weren’t going to die this year - esp since folks in that age group are still dying from the usual causes. Not everyone of that age has caught the disease.
https://ourworldindata.org/mortality-risk-covid#case-fatality-rate-of-covid-19-by-age
I agree, Creekland. In the meantime the economic destruction, in my opinion, will cause the preventable deaths of 100k under 65, as those over 65 have medicare.
Preventable by what, exactly? What is your policy prescription that would prevent those diseases?
And what are the main causes of these preventable deaths? Alcoholism, depression, inability to afford health care? How are these ameliorated by the policy prescriptions you prefer?
I’ve only posted bits and bobs from this article.
‘Spike in pneumonia deaths in Florida shows an earlier, deadlier arrival of coronavirus, experts say’
“It is likely that they missed some COVID-19 deaths and reported them as respiratory deaths,” said Amira Roess, an epidemiology professor at George Mason University who specializes in infectious disease research.”
Roess and other epidemiologists say that these coronavirus deaths likely contributed to the spike, which now appears, on its face, to be one of Florida’s largest rates of pneumonia and influenza-related mortality going back at least five flu seasons.
“Now, even as Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis ponders how to reopen the state, the sharp increase in March pneumonia deaths alters the fundamental narrative of the coronavirus outbreak in Florida: This pandemic started earlier and has been broader, deadlier and more rampant than previously known.“
‘Date of spike suggests undetected spread‘
“The surge came during the week of March 15, suggesting potential coronavirus cases could have been lurking in the state weeks before.
“Deaths take several weeks to happen,” said Mary Jo Trepka, who heads the Department of Epidemiology at Florida International University. “People get sick, then they get sicker, then they get a secondary infection and then they die.”
During the previous two weeks, about 250 Floridians per week had been dying from flu or pneumonia. The next week brought 283 deaths. The following week, 320 — mostly from pneumonia.
The flu season had petered off in mid-February as it usually does, according to data from the Florida Department of Health. Deaths from flu and pneumonia peaked the week of Feb. 9, when some 260 people died, according to data from the Centers for Disease Control.”
“My guess is that a good chunk of that death that you see there is due to coronavirus, and it’s not being listed on the death report,” Weinberger said.
“There seems to be a lot of unexplained deaths that weren’t classified as COVID-19 but were excess unexpected deaths,” Trepka said. “I agree with you that some of that spike might have been due to COVID-19.″
Have many of you seen people die of respiratory failure? As an ICU nurse, I have, and let me tell you, it’s not pretty.
No matter how one might feel they are ready to die, when you can’t breathe, pure panic sets in and people very much want to breathe. It’s just how we are wired.
I cannot be cavalier or even simply philosophical about anyone dying of a respiratory disease. Please God, give me the aneurysm or stroke while I’m asleep.
I’m pretty sure you live in a different world than I do. 
In my world I see articles in my newspaper how banks are helping restaurants and providers by donating money to the restaurants to send meals to different groups of people. I see a town offering interest free loans to businesses and finding out that fewer than half the available loans have been requested. I see churches saying they are getting more donations than before. Our health care places are open now that the rush on PPEs are over. We even have factories that have retooled to provide them for our state (perhaps elsewhere too, but at least for our state).
I’m glad I live in an area where community takes care of community. It makes me glad we chose to live here. From reading on cc I realize that must not happen everywhere.
This post is written by aibarr, who was a long-time user on CC. She got her bachelor’s degree in engineering at Rice and then her master’s degree in structural engineering at Illinois. So she and I have the same type of education (I got my BS and MS from UT-Austin). She gave me permission to share this on CC. It resonated with me. (I was fortunate to learn wood design from one of the best, my father.)
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I only had to see my mom endure it to know I don’t want it or wish it on anyone. You have my utmost respect having to deal with it on a regular basis. I wouldn’t be able to.
Maybe you need to expand your perspective, @Creekland. My town is lovely, but within 10 miles there is dire poverty and desperation, and I bet the same is true for you. In fact, you would be surprised how many folks within your own town are on the edge-food pantries do get customers from nice suburbs too. Regardless, surely you have some understanding, even if only through tv, that many of our fellow citizens are in dire straits? That deaths of despair will skyrocket nationwide, even if not on your street? That people without jobs and health insurance skip trips to the doctor they can not afford, for both themselves and their kids? Perhaps you should broaden your news sources.
In NJ, one public school district sent the kids home with chronebooks. Parents sold them to buy food for the hungry kids. They certainly arent making medical appointments. Volunteering at a food bank would be a good experience for all.
I’m not sure why people keep coming back to “if you don’t agree with me, you want everybody to die from something other than COVID-19” or “if you don’t agree with me, you want everybody to die from COVID-19.”