Asking because I don’t know…can WI (or any state) prohibit homeowners (taxpayers) from using their home?
Or prohibit those with leases (signed contracts) from moving into their rental places? Thinking about the 20,000+ UWisc Madison students who will be heading to their off-campus places in August.
Washington State didn’t even shut down until March 23rd - well past the time of the outbreak in Kirkland.
Here is the list of every state and the dates the mandatory SAH orders issued.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-stay-at-home-order.html
In the beginning of a March the Federal government was still saying it was no big deal and it was going to go away. The President liked the numbers where they were. Larry Kudlow said the administration had it all under control.
As I reported on the first Covid 19 thread I was very distressed about the Bat Mitzvah. I was the only one who refused to kiss, shake hands, or hug anyone. I reported back here that if my family was any indication of the greater population’s behavior we (the collective we) would be in big trouble.
Fortunately, no one who attended came down with the virus. It was the last bat mitzvah held at that temple.
This may have been covered elsewhere, but I have a question about the places such as prisons and meat packing plants and nursing homes where presumably 100% of the people in such places get tested because there is an outbreak. @“Cardinal Fang”, I think, mentioned the women’s prison where 100% tested positive. From places where an entire “community” is tested, is there data available about outcomes from those particular communities? The results of the testing, numbers of those who never became symptomatic, numbers who did, numbers who had serious cases, numbers who had mild cases?
It seems like that could be helpful information???
The women’s prison in LA link is here, 75% were asymptomatic: https://apnews.com/f31d0a19272193a0f461eb96e5c3d23d
Edited to add, this is the link I meant to attach: https://www.theadvocate.com/baton_rouge/news/coronavirus/article_2c551b72-8fbb-11ea-849a-e390bbc57059.html
That’s correct. Now everyone who comes near him is tested, but on March 9th, anyone could come close and shake his hand. So blaming NY for the spread in NY is ridiculous. People were pouring into NY from international and domestic airports through Mid March. Spread was already happening and continued. Those people left NY and spread it everywhere else, etc…
https://s.abcnews.com/images/Politics/trump-fla3-ap-ml-200309_hpMain_16x9_992.jpg
President Donald Trump shakes hands with supporters upon arrival at the Orlando Sanford International Airport, March 9, 2020 in Orlando, Fla.
@Mwfan1921 , I don’t know the answers to your questions.
What’s driving this is the unknowns regarding the potential for permanent damage from the virus (from the article):
The military demands a high level of physical fitness, and this virus appears to have the potential to permanently undermine that requirement.
But DQ’s are potentially waiverable:
This edict is being discussed on serviceacademforums.com where Larry Mullen, Deputy Chief of DoDMERB, who monitors DQ issues for the board had this to say:
The military uses DQs to trigger further investigation of potentially service-limiting conditions on a case-by-case basis. It’s hard to get through DoDMERB even for healthy applicants. Our son estimates that more than half of his West Point class was DQ’d for SOMEthing before finally getting cleared for appointment. That’s just how this works. I suspect that what will eventually happen is what Mr. Mullen indicated. Any military applicant who is COVID positive/recovered will face a dead stop with DoDMERB until further guidelines determine what conditions need to be met for waivers to be issued.
I understand this notion, and it sounds true. But I’m not sure it IS true, or that it is true for every case. There was an outbreak caused by a church choir practice in Washington. This was in early March, before Washington closed, but the singers reportedly tried to practice social distancing, yet many were infected and several died. There wasn’t a gregarious infected individual identified, who went around slapping backs and getting into everyone’s space, but as it was a choir practice everyone would have been vigorously singing. I didn’t see any discussion of this, but maybe the choir venue was poorly ventilated.
In Japan, experts talk about the danger of the three C’s:
Closed places with poor ventilation
Crowded with people
Conversations, talking (and presumably singing) that cause people to expel air more forcefully than they would if they were silent
A person on Twitter (this is just supposition) hypothesized that Japanese people on crowded trains didn’t spread covid-19 because (this is a claim and I don’t even know if it’s true) Japanese people are socialized to sit quietly on trains. Maybe superspreaders talk more? Maybe these gregarious gabbers are yapping and yapping, spreading the virus into the air with every word?
Just talked to friend who’s a doc at one of Boston’s big research hospitals. He mentioned the covid focus is having unexpected and negative consequences on other illnesses. They do 1500 colonoscopies per week. 10 percent are problematic for cancer etc.
Nearly zero have been done in 5 weeks. That’s 750 undiagnosed serious Illness. For that one hospital. In one city. One test. One set of problems. It’s exponentially worse. The math nationally is pretty staggering.
I hope this can ramp back up quickly.
Have they tested everyone though at those places. ? If you hadn’t tested everyone at that pork processing plant you’d have certainly thought they were “ doing well” because NOBODY was sick…but HUNDREDS had the virus and were asymptomatic.
A few days later, my family was all slated to travel to NJ for my son’s wedding (DDIL is from there). People started cancelling right and left, including some who went down and then left before the event itself - and we had a tiny affair with no physical contact, sanitizer and wipes everywhere. Also no related infections that I heard about.
Although we (immediate family) attended the wedding, we cancelled all hair/makeup people, curtailed nearly all photography, and left really quickly after the ceremony and a tiny part of the reception, without eating any of the food. It was very upsetting. Not as upsetting as weddings planned for the next weekend (20’s of March) which had to be cancelled altogether from what I heard (on the CC weddings thread).
We are never going to catch all the people who are asymptomatic. If they have no symptoms, they are highly unlikely to be willing to test, even with possible exposure.
I am very torn around states opening up at this point. I have been firm in locking down for my family and groceries are the only reason I have left home for 2 months now. My business is 100% operational and we are almost all able to work from home, that said we have been given a 20% pay cut for an undetermined amount of time, most likely until 2021. The company has lost little revenue during this but can envision our clients either not making it back from lockdown or looking to reduce costs in the recovery which will cost us revenue down the road.
On one hand, the sooner everything opens up and business is as close to back to normal as we can get the less likely we will see a significant drop in revenue meaning I could get back to full pay sooner. The fact that I can continue working from home and keeping my family locked down makes this appealing in a selfish way.
The other hand is continuing the slow opening which will certainly cost us clients and revenue and delay getting back to full pay for me. This is the unselfish approach but is not without personal pain.
I know the right answer but the selfish approach is sure looking attractive since I can still be as protected as I am today but also receive my full paycheck.
I’m skeptical that all the workers who tested positive at the pork processing plant in Missouri were truly asymptomatic. If this plant is like other plants, many of the workers don’t speak English or don’t speak it well. Meat processing is a grueling job where workers will come to work even when they’re sick, and where being in chronic pain is normal. So “asymptomatic” here might just mean “not sick enough to have to stay home.”
In other prisons and meatpacking plants with widespread testing, a lot of inmates/workers test positive, but typically a third to a half have some symptoms, mostly mild ones.
In my opinion, those should have been opened up 2 weeks ago, nationwide.
That’s pretty much the way it went when we did the same exercise in my high school youth group.
That’s a fair point- Chorus rehearsal is actually a known epidemiological thing, apparently (told to me by a relative in the biz). For some reason (perhaps forced air expulsion as you note), choral events are known to cause disease spread more than proportionately for the group and the space.
Why would they refuse to be tested?
I think you might be unwilling to be tested, but I certainly would not only agree, but willing would want to be tested.
I don’t want to knowingly think I could be the cause of anyone getting sick from this or dying from it.
So 100% of the people who attended the bat mitzvah have since been tested for the virus and tested negative? Otherwise, you can’t know no one who attended came down with the virus.
My state is “opening up”.
Right now that means more types of retailers are permitted to have curbside pickup (in store shopping still not permitted). You can visit a jewelry store by appointment only.
You can get cosmetology services, also by appointment only, but there can be a max of 2 customers at a time, waiting areas cannot be used, entrance doors must remain locked to prevent walkins, 15 minutes must be allotted between appointments for sanitizing. Masks must be worn.
At golf courses, most which have remained open in our state (with pull carts only, provided by golfers), will now be allowed to provide golf carts, but there is a limit of one person on each cart. They must be sanitized after each use. Masks must be worn if social distance cannot be maintained, generally not an issue with golf.
Drive in movie theaters are allowed to open, but patrons must stay in vehicles (did not even know there were any of those left in our state).
Restaurants and bars are still closed for dining, allowing takeout only. Essential businesses must still limit the number of patrons to a percentage of capacity, and masks are required, unless unable to wear one for medical reasons.
So although we are technically “opening up”, it is a very cautious approach which is being coordinated with regional leadership. Personally, I don’t plan
on getting any cosmetology services, or buying any jewelry right now. I will continue to limit my grocery and other essential shopping trips as much as possible for now.
