I was reading a post here and it raised a question in my mind. Is it going to raise a red flag for elite colleges if a kid skips physics or just gets credit by exam for regular physics. I ask as Physics department at our school is a disgrace and has only two teachers so it’s difficult for most kids to fit those classes in their schedules.
When I was in high school, there was only one physics teacher, but that physics teacher taught physics for enough class periods that there was no scheduling issue. With two physics teachers, it should be easy for students to find a class period when physics is offered.
There are lots of ways to take physics. (And it might help to know that even at elite schools, many kids who did AP Physics and got 5’s on the exam in high school, still take first year physics in college…)
Our school had one physics teacher who had just had twins. During class, he went into another room and slept. I kid you not. There were only 3 students in AP physics. They banded together and got a textbook and studied together and all got 5’s on the exam. No teaching! Mediocre high schools can be motivating for some!
In schools with scheduling problems, or for kids who are out of school at times, for whatever reason, or for kids with certain learning styles, online classes can be excellent ways to take classes that are otherwise hard to access.
Here is one we used: http://thevhscollaborative.org/programs-courses Look up physics and you will see two AP classes. Community college on campus or online is a possibility, as are any number of universities’ online courses. Since physics is a lab science, though, there may not be good options online unless the school’s online program has virtual labs. VHS does.
For self-study for an AP exam, here is a good resource:
https://www.khanacademy.org/science/physics
This is another way to go, depending on the student’s motivation and work habits. Kahn has a brilliant, clear way to teach.
You can advocate for better scheduling at your school, perhaps with other students.
In the end, the guidance counselor can write that AP physics was not offered at your school and/or scheduling problems made it impossible to take physics. Or study for a CLEP or AP exam. Or take it online or at a post-secondary school. All of these options can work out and admissions will be fine with it. If your son wants to do STEM in college, it would be good to take physics one way or another, knowing, though, that he may retake it in a better version once at college.
My high school had 6200 students and only two physics teachers. No AP physics. I’m not sure how that is a disgrace…
But yes, the GC can explain the situation.
Count your blessings. There was a poster on here from a rural area in Illinois where they only offered physics every other year or some such. The poster’s child wound up attending a public math and science academy.
I would be a bit concerned about credit by exam for a lab science… would student have enough other lab sciences during HS? Credit by exam may not fulfill the lab requirement.
Is the purpose just to “check the box” of physics for a kid who isn’t otherwise interested and will likely major in something else, or is this for a kid who is going to pursue science at the college level? Because those are two entirely different situations, to me.
I tested out of physics at my high school. I think it was a bad idea as far as learning physics is concerned, because I never did any labs, but my transcript just showed the grade without indicating how it was obtained.
Testing out of physics (via AP, for example) will not be a red flag for elite colleges. But don’t expect AP sciences to necessarily be accepted as a substitute for basic intro science classes, especially lab classes, at college. I know at D’s school, it varies by department. But passing an AP test, even with a 5, may mean placement in honors intro rather than general intro in biology, chemistry, or physics rather than moving into the next course in the sequence. Calc may be treated in the same way—placement in an honors calc sequence that is more theoretical rather than the basic calc class that is more computational.
I don’t understand how with 2 physics teachers that scheduling would be such a big problem. Our school also has only 2 physics teachers, as did my own high school.
If your school doesn’t offer AP physics that may be a blessing in disguise. A decent honors physics class may be a better option for many students as it only takes one year instead of two and the non-calculus based Physics 1 and 2, which is what most high schools offer, is pretty worthless for a college STEM major anyhow. (And I’m not sure why a non-STEM major would want to take 2 physics classes in hs). Our school, like some others, has done away with their honors physics class, in favor of this 1 and 2–ignoring the fact that many students don’t have time to take 2, so they are getting more of some topics and none of other important topics. But calc based physics in college can be hard and I would strongly recommend taking a year of physics in high school.
Also, even if the teacher isn’t that great, that leaves your kid having to work more out on their own. But that’s a lot better than having to work everything out on their own. Plus, in a structured class, they can make a study group with friends.
I’d also question why you think the physics teachers are a disgrace. It’s true that it’s hard to find good physics teachers. Most people who are good at that sort of thing can find better paid jobs. But it’s also true that kids tend to evaluate teachers heavily by personality. They tend to dislike teachers with high expectations and/or strict discipline. And physics being a difficult subject for many students means that the students have to work hard at it to be successful, and students really do need to engage in a certain amount of intellectual struggle with the problems to learn it well. Those who want to just follow recipes may not appreciate that.
Same student who is chasing class rank (and thus wants as many AP courses as possible) and wants to avoid physics?
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/19881091/#Comment_19881091
if this it the same kid who “wants to keep engineering as a future option” I’d say not only should he take physics, he should impress the heck out of his physics teacher and get a strong letter from him (or her). If I were in admissions, to me, ducking physics would look bad.
I think this obsession with valedictorian says that he needs to broaden the horizons of his life.
We’ve said that numerous times to the OP. OP is still very concerned with kid’s Val status. Someone in OP’s life lied to their family that the road to success is only possible through Ivy Lane and the OP, despite living here for years, still hasn’t realized it’s a lie.
College admissions officers do NOT look fondly on students who HAVE the ability/ option of taking an AP class , but only take the AP test.
Submitting AP tests for classes that were available at your DSs HS , but were not taken, is going to make him look like a slacker. Unless there were compelling extenuating circumstances that his GC is willing to mention in his LOR.
TEACHER recommendations are MUCH more important to college admissions offices than AP test scores.
Physics is by far the worst course (and teacher) at my kids school. It is, frankly, an utter disaster. It is disappointing to say the least. We have struggled with what to do. D1 took 1 semester AP Physics C (during which they not only used no calculus, but teacher yelled at her for looking things up on her own initiative), then she dropped it with our blessing. S2 is in honors physics now–they dropped AP option this year since no one was signing up. AP Chem and Bio are full to overflowing BTW. So far in three weeks they have not yet gone beyond “speed”; teacher is hoping next week to introduce "velocity "! S was told that the teacher will not be telling them if they have the right answer.
I was hoping maybe S could do online course to actually learn some physics; sad to hear that would be a “step down” from college perspective.
While not having 3 or more years of lab science can be an issue for admission to respectable/elite colleges, this is a very YMMV depending on the college, one’s intended major, and/or one’s legacy/developmental status.
For instance, one older undergrad classmate was admitted to our LAC and 2 Ivies…including one as a legacy through a grandmother who was a notable alumna who donated millions to her alma mater over the decades despite only taking 2 years of science WITHOUT LAB. They were basically your “rocks for jocks” or “physics for poets” type science classes.
Even though his lack of taking any lab science courses in HS didn’t pose an issue with admissions, it did cause serious issues when he had to fulfill our LAC’s science and quantitative proficiency requirements.
He never had any experience conducting scientific experiments in a lab setting or even keeping detailed science notes. And it showed when he kept asking me for help with an intro CS course for non-majors. A course which only covered programming/lab content equivalent to the first 2-3 weeks of the first regular intro CS course for majors I took.
I sometimes still marvel at how much he struggled through a class most non-majors regarded as manageable or even a gut science course.
Not necessarily.
Many HS classmates took the AP test without taking the AP course because they were prevented from doing so for not having a minimum qualifying overall GPA to take any AP courses or a minimum GPA in the subject one intended to take the AP in.
None had any issues being admitted to respectable/elite colleges…including the Ivies/peer elites.
^what HS graduating class year are you referring to cobrat?
Its a lot tougher these days to get into Ivies/ peers elites with sub par GPA’s than it once was.
^ Cobrat started undergrad in the mid-90s. So… early-mid 90s.
Literally more than a generation ago.
that’s what I thought…
a long long time ago, when college admissions was “relatively” a walk in the park, especially compared to these days.
It’s really not that helpful to be posting info that is over a generation out of date, especially when the people asking the questions may not understand how obsolete these anecdotes are.