I agree - D just went through Ivy recruiting with another sport. All schools did a full academic pre read long before the offer stage. I would be shocked if they pulled an offer for academics after that process. And as explained to us by all Ivy coaches, the pre read is done prior to OVs and offers for that reason. Coaches don’t want to waste their time or the recruits time if there is little chance of admittance.
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It does happen. Hopefully not often but it does.
I know of a team at Brown last year where late November the kids were told that the recruit class AI was low and if it could not be raised with some testing retakes some offered kids would be dropped and replaced by others with higher stats to raise the AI. LLs were delayed until this was sorted out.
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Another update: Got an offer with the highest level of support for admissions from a 3 letter school in Boston. DS is elated, but I had to remind him that an offer from this school improves his chances of admission from low single digit % to ~30-50% based on what I’ve read elsewhere. Nevertheless this is huge. HC from the nearby FCS or D1AA school wrote to us saying he is unable to support with an admissions spot, but recommended applying restrictive EA; if we can get in on our own, then he’d love to have him on the team. Not sure what to make of it. Other than that, we’re still waiting to hear from few other T20 D3s as their process is known to move along a little slower.
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You shouldn’t guess on this, your S should directly ask the coach what the chances are/the success rate of past recruits with the highest level of support. Does the coach require an EA app? Is there a deadline on the offer?
Again, your S should ask if he is getting any kind of coach support at all (Some schools offer ‘soft’ support). Did he have a pre-read at this school? Obviously if he applies REA to this school, he would not be able to apply EA at the school that is offering support (if he verbally commits), or any other school if he verbally commits. And if he wants to for sure play his sport and has at least one acceptable offer to do so as a supported recruit, then he shouldn’t apply REA.
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[quote=“westwave, post:24, topic:3690823, full:true”]
…from a 3 letter school in Boston. DS is elated, but I had to remind him that an offer from this school improves his chances of admission from low single digit % to ~30-50% based on what I’ve read elsewhere.
…HC from the nearby FCS or D1AA school wrote to us saying he is unable to support with an admissions spot, but recommended applying restrictive EA; if we can get in on our own, then he’d love to have him on the team.
…still waiting to hear from fewT20 D3s as their process is known to move along a little slower.
[/quote]
I can only guess at the 3-letter school in Boston and the FCS/D1AA school nearby (the 2-that I am thinking of are essentially in Boston but technically not in Boston. I am familiar with both).
From my perspective, it comes down to which school is the better fit, including without playing football. So you will have your top choice, and then I would continue to work that and apply to that school EA or ED over the other T20 D3s.
Your son can still maintain contact with the T20 D3s schools and visit to determine what is his best fit and top choice of those. He can also keep that coach in the loop.
My thinking is that it is worth going after these top schools, assuming they are a fit including cost. And, if he is a candidate for these 2-top schools, the T20 D3s schools will probably be there for him, especially for football which has larger rosters, if he does not get into the 3-letter or FCS/D1AA.
Thank you Mwfan1921; as you suggest, we’ll ask the coach about the success rate of past recruits with the highest level of support. This coach did not bring up EA app, but I’d think they would prefer that we apply early. Having said that, speaking to a current player (with stellar academic record, class valedectorian, two start-ups, father works for the school) who had applied early, we learned that he was deferred and only knew he was in very late in the regular decision process. While this player did have coach’s support, I’m not sure if it was the highest level of support (high, med, low).
W.r.t the other school (FCS), there was no official pre-read, but we did send in transcript and test scores to the HC. Thank you for bringing up “soft” support; never heard of that term before. In the view of Admissions Office, I wonder how that is different from “hard” support? Does AO give any weight to soft support from the coach? If yes, that is something we can definitely check with the coach.
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Your S has to ask the coach these questions, but my guess is there is no support available since there was no formal pre-read (and not sure the HC of football at the school in Cambridge gives soft support.) So, if the priority is to play one’s sport, I would not counsel your S to apply REA (based on what I know right now.)
It’s not uncommon for recruits to be deferred at this school, I would absolutely expect that to be the most likely outcome. Do you know it is the case that there is high/med/low support there?
DS is thinking Engg/Business/CS as possible majors. 3-letter school is the best if not one of the top 5 in these areas. This is DS’s dream school, and we are willing to apply EA. This’d allow us to also apply EA to the school in the windy city; we are waiting to hear back on their pre-read.
I’ve advised my son that he has a better chance of playing at a D3 than at an FCS school (if he manages to get in on his own) that would be happy to have him on their team if not for anything but to boost the team’s average AI, which in turn can help the team recruit another player with lower band AI.
We’re all presuming this to be MIT, correct? In which case, they do not have REA. Just EA or RD. So applying EA absolutely makes sense. And if deferred or rejected, there’s still time to pivot to another school which may offer ED2 or support in RD. And in the case of MIT, strong support is what they can offer, but they cannot give you a definitive answer on whether or not you’ll be accepted. At best, they can give you a best guess based on past recruit admission success. It’s not as clear cut as it is at other schools.
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In that exchange, I (and OP) were talking about the FCS school where the coach said he won’t offer the kid coach support but the kid can be on the team if he gets in on his own.
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He can’t verbally commit to both.
Ok, that makes sense then. Thanks for clarifying.
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W.r.t the other school (FCS), there was no official pre-read, but we did send in transcript and test scores to the HC. Thank you for bringing up “soft” support; never heard of that term before. In the view of Admissions Office, I wonder how that is different from “hard” support? Does AO give any weight to soft support from the coach? If yes, that is something we can definitely check with the coach.
I know of multiple track/XC student athletes who have been offered “soft support” by a coach from the FCS school that I think you are referring to. As far as I know, it is the only school in its league that has any sort of mechanism for soft support from coaches (outside of coxswains for crew, apparently). While soft support at this school would be better than no support, it is a huge step down from being on the coach’s list of preferred admits in terms of help. In this league, you are either on the list of preferred recruits or not. There is no high-medium-low levels of support for those on the list.
I’ve advised my son that he has a better chance of playing at a D3 than at an FCS school (if he manages to get in on his own) that would be happy to have him on their team if not for anything but to boost the team’s average AI, which in turn can help the team recruit another player with lower band AI.
Based on my understanding of AI, the number that matters only considers the coach’s list of preferred admits, and this list has a hard limit of how many applicants can be on it. Your son being admitted on his own (or with a LOR from the coach) would not affect the AI for the recruiting class.
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That is my general understanding as well.
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It’s is probably worth mentioning that soft support admits at said school are often otherwise hooked (ie legacy).
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This is a valid consideration. Would he be happy as a practice player? I think walk on experience is overwhelming positive in the league but it’s important to understand the culture and practices of each team and coach regarding such players.
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While I firmly believe in accepting offers in good faith, the process at MIT is murky and not quite the same so…. I’d make an argument for proceeding with EA and, should he get in and is still interested in FCS, applying there RD. There is no advantage for REA for an unhooked (making an assumption here) applicant. They will probably at best get deferred, loose their small edge at the offer school, and have to apply to a bunch of schools to cover their bases. With EA to the offer school at least there is a chance things get mostly sorted by December.
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Could you please clarify what you mean by “He can’t verbally commit to both”? My understanding is that since both schools are D3, and their offers—namely a roster spot and admissions support—are non-binding and do not guarantee admission, applying EA to one shouldn’t preclude also applying EA to the other. Am I missing something? I thought the only commitment here was to go through each school’s admissions process. Given that admission is not guaranteed at either school, it doesn’t seem to make sense that applying EA to one would prevent us from applying EA to the other—especially when both options are still technically open.
Your son should NOT be verbally committing to more than one school. Accepting support through admissions is basically “committing to the application process” at the school and they should stop communicating with other schools. If they are deferred or denied, the recruitment can open back up. This is not legally binding at D3/Ivy schools, but he should be considered committed at that point.
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To add to momofthree’s fine post…coaches want something in exchange for full support, and that’s typically a verbal commitment, agreeing to/accepting the slot and committing to the admission process. And often an early application. If your S did get an offer from Chicago, the coach very well might say it’s only good for the ED round.
It is not ok to keep recruiting open once a student has verbally committed to a coach.
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