Daughter working at a camp- my concerns

Parent Cafe
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<p>SO my D is working at a camp- a regular summer over night camp</p>

<p>Her first session, well 20% of the campers were from foster care, and other state programs. Many have serious emotional and behavioral issues.</p>

<p>My D went to this camp when she was younger, and it was well run, busy, organized and had lots of support </p>

<p>This time, her first time as a counselor, all the counselors are new, the leadership is knew.</p>

<p>There is not one person there who is trained to deal with kids with issues- ie past abuse, drugs in the family, etc. and the counselors- mostly 18-22 year olds are expected to deal with the daily outbursts, manupulations, tears, and all the other issues that generally require someone with special training beyond just your normal counselor orientation. As well, there is not enough to do at the camp, so there is too much downtime.</p>

<p>My D has called me, just a couple of times, and though she is making the best of it, I can here the stress in her voice. She says that the tantrums, throwing things, etc is getting under control…oh goody</p>

<p>I am concerned about the camp, the leadership, and the position my D and other counselors have been put in- legally, safety, and otherwise, as well as the other campers having to be there with kids with such serious issues and no support whatsoever. Its like sending kids with cancer or diabetes to a camp with no doctors.</p>

<p>My D says she is “fine” but I don’t want her last summer, one she was trained and expected to be, like the camp she went to- with normal issues- homesickness, lost towels, girls arguing, etc- not one with kids with serious behavioral and emotinal problems.</p>

<p>Am I wrong to want to remove her and have her find other work? I don’t want her going to college totally burnt out, I don’t want her in a place, where at the last session, 80% of the campers will be coming from foster care, shelters, and others sorts of programs…</p>

<p>If the camp had good resources and much more staff to help work with these kids that would be fine, but they don’t…I am glad the camp is there for kids from the “system” to go to, that is wonderful, but to have a camp that is so poorly run is not good…</p>

<p>sigh…I think my D will be mad, but I am concerned for her safety</p>

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<p>even if daughter is planning on social work as a profession, get her out of the camp ASAP and contact whoever’s in charge. no camp should be run like that. it’s bad for the counselors and the campers.</p>

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<p>She sounds like she’s fine. She’ll probably learn a lot if you leave her be.</p>

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<p>cgm - I don’t blame you for being concerned. Years ago, I performed the annual audit of two youth authorities (girls and boys) in the state of Louisiana…these would likely be the sort kids sent to such camps in the summer. Security protocol was pretty tight when untrained people (like auditiors :wink: ) were on site. My clients not only had trained psychologists and counselors available to diffuse any bad situations, there were also people trained in security and law enforcement available as well.</p>

<p>If you feel the situation is one that is ‘waiting’ to go out of control, I don’t think it is wrong to intervene.</p>

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<p>Is 20% 3 kids or 30 kids? How experienced or credentialed are the counselors who we not “mostly 18-22 year olds” ? Can you find out what the official policy/promises are regarding supervision of kids, counselors, and program and encourage your daughter to make sure that happens? If she can do that she’ll be way ahead of people who work in similar settings!</p>

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<p>That is shocking, actually, CGM. Most camps, servicing the types of kids you are describing, have professional staff members. It is absurd (not to mention potentially dangerous) for high school or untrained college students to be expected to deal with emotionally volatile children. At the very least there should be psychiatrists there to administer and monitor medications (since I assume most of that 20% is on some med or another), psychologists, social workers, etc. Usually there are behavioral plans to monitor.</p>

<p>Even a day camp with emotionally challenged youngsters is run entirely by a professional staff.</p>

<p>I would definitely want to know more, and also potentially intervene.</p>

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<p>"At the very least there should be psychiatrists there to administer and monitor medications’</p>

<p>I believe this is not reasonable to expect. Maybe you’ll get on LVN to administer medicine but an actual MD, let alone a Psychiatrist on sight would be unreasonable to expect. Again, even that depends on how many children we we talking about.</p>

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<p>It isn’t unreasonable at all to have someone with medical training on site 24/7 at a residential camp like this. Perhaps it would be an LNP, but there would likely still be a psychiatrist on call. In fact, I would bet on it.</p>

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<p>With all due respect, Psychiatrists in many necks of the wood, are pretty hard to come by, and unless they are volunteering, paying one to be available 24/7 is something even most public health systems struggle with. But that’s a different thread on a different forum.</p>

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<p>I think what Allmusic is saying is that if certain restricted drugs are being distributed, qualified medical staff would have to be available to make that distribution, and physicians available, at least on an ‘on call’ basis, for any issues with those meds. If the state has custody, those requirements should be funded with public monies. It is very possible, some of the kids at CGirl’s camp, may be in the custody of the state. </p>

<p>We have several psychologists here who, I’m sure, know more about these circumstances. I know, from my end, I was tracking authorizations and treatment protocols to make sure they were legit and properly reimbursed by the state. That involved making sure a physician was monitoring treatment and the meds were dispensed by licensed personnel.</p>

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<p>“We have several psychologists here who, I’m sure, know more about these circumstances”</p>

<p>I sure don’t mean to derail this thread, but where exactly is “here”? I’m sure I’m overeacting but this is a subject near and dear to my heart. It is so hard for “these kids” to get the resources they need. If “here” means the camp, I think we could all use some info about how many kids we we talking about, and of those, how many are actually on medication. Although I work with a lot of foster kids (I’m a Child Psychiatrist), I don’t think all foster kids or kids in state programs are on medication.</p>

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<p>cgm, I think you are right to be concerned. It sounds as though the camp you knew is not the camed that now exists in its place. Do you know if it still has ACA accreditation? There may well be health risks and safety risks involved for both staff and kids if things are as you describe them. One has to wonder about liability, too, I suspect. Is it possible for you to pay an unannounced visit? I have read so many of your posts on CC that based on the impression I have of you it seems to me that if you feel this way you are probably justified. </p>

<p>It is all very well to talk about learning experiences and how a kid will come out of an experience like this stronger, but I don’t know if that is always true. Follow your instincts and act if you feel you should. (And what about the campers, who are at mercy of what sounds like a very poor administration? silence does not serve them well either.)</p>

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<p>^ VERY good point mattmom!</p>

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<p>Often, for my kids, the missing link as they began difficult jobs was to understand to whom they could go to find out answers. </p>

<p>There is no problem too big as long as your D can bring her list of 5 “what do I do when this happens…” to someone after her shift to get policies, advice, and on-the-spot answers.</p>

<p>It’s not impossible to work well at a camp for underpriveleged kids, but she needs to be able to get a clear answer to a question such as this, “What do I do when a child throws something at someone?” There should be a disclipine plan, somewhere that says, “First time, warn. Second time, send to camp office. Third time, …” or something like that. </p>

<p>If there isn’t enough to do, is she very clever to take long strings and teach the kids to make cat’s cradles, or double-dutch jump rope with long elastics.
She needs to be very much in-charge in her tone, pass out materials, say what we’re doing with them, and collect (count) them when done. If she can structure and conduct a small activity, pulling in the leader-girls first, the others will join in. </p>

<p>Generally, camps program activities but, just as in public schools, it’s the TRANSITION times that are most difficult, walking to and from activities, waiting for meals to begin and so on.</p>

<p>If she can focus on little distracting activities to preoccupy them during transitions, it might help for the near future. Are some girls able to do stomp-clap-drills; if so let them lead the other girls, while waiting in lines and so on. Tell one girl, in advance, she’ll be trusted to teach the group while your D stands right beside her. </p>

<p>Please suggest that she tell kids what to do and not just say, “Hey, guys, now we’re gonna swim, okay???” Those rhetorical questions are a big mistake; gives them a chance to disagree or argue over whether to do the activity. </p>

<p>If she can’t make any inroads based on these kinds of suggestions, the situation might be out-of-control or at least beyond her ability to work with.</p>

<p>At her age, it’s fine to ask her on the phone, “How can I help? Do you want me to just listen, back you up, or get in the middle, here?” In a way you have to figure out whether the best message to her is, “It sounds tough but you can do tough – as long as you know who to consult on camp staff for advice” versus “It sounds impossible, do you want me to bail you out here?”</p>

<p>The camp obviously isn’t what it was when your D attended, but perhaps there are systems in place to manage it that the D doesn’t yet know of. That’s the piece to focus on for right now, I believe. If it’s hopeless at that level, then the situation is hopeless. Otherwise, it’s just a tough job and she’ll learn tons from it.</p>

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<p>shrink - ‘here’ means the CC community. </p>

<p>No one said EVERY foster kid is on meds and no one said EVERY (or any) kid at the camp is a foster kid. We are just exploring the possibilities of the situation. Given the rights to privacy enjoyed by everyone including foster kids, it is likely CGM’s d may not know the background of her charges, but is merely observing a potential problem. That, in itself, is an issue of concern especially if the administration is untrained or inexperienced.</p>

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<p>No one said EVERY foster kid is on meds and no one said EVERY (or any) kid at the camp is a foster kid.</p>

<p>I understand that. That’s why I’m asking how many problem kid’s are we talking about. I’m kind of new here. Perhaps I am doing something offensive. Sorry.</p>

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<p>To clarify</p>

<p>Currently the camp has about 150 kids, so we are talking, currently 30 that have obvious serious issues, with acting out, yelling, crying, lying, etc, 2 or more per cabin</p>

<p>They also have others that have issues, but are on the more shy, subdued, afraid side</p>

<p>There are two young adult, novice counselors for every ten kids, with 1 counseler in training type</p>

<p>They told my D that the first of the sessions, the current one, was the guiniie pig, or learning session or whatever, as as the camp progresses, by the end of the summer, up to 80% of the campers will be from foster care and other programs</p>

<p>Currently and no change is foreseen, there is no professional staff person on hand who is trained to work with kids with these kinds of special needs</p>

<p>On top of that, there are a few serious ADHD kids who have to be medicated, and as my D says, others that should be</p>

<p>My D has worked at other kinds of camps- soccer, and has gone to this camp and others in the past</p>

<p>At this point, I have little faith in things improving, as the # of kids with serious issues will be increases, there is no further training planned, nor is there any more staff people with training expected.</p>

<p>When my D applied for the job, none of this was mentioned, though it is clear now the head staff knows, as they I am guessing have seen some of the records for the kids</p>

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<p>My D expected to work hard, etc, and to make an impact on kids lives, that is why she signed up in the first place</p>

<p>However, she is not quailifed, nor it seems is anyone else at the camp, to deal with kids with serious life, and emotional and behavioral issues…</p>

<p>After talking to a friend, who is training to be a social worker and trainiing in therapy, she was appalled</p>

<p>Oh yes, the age range- from about 7-16 years old</p>

<p>I do have concerns about her physical safety…the camp seems poorly run, with way too much down time, and with little support for the counselors, and with more and more kids expected to come with issues, I am, much to somes dismay, to by best to get her not to go back</p>

<p>Yes, she made a commitment, but that was to a well run, safe, place, not a place that is poorly run with so little support</p>

<p>My D has been there over a week, and there are no systems, no group discussions for counselors, nada…</p>

<p>As for toughing it out, this is not about that, this is about safety and working at a program that is potentialy dangerous- legally, emotionally, and physically, and if it is this difficult and not managed well with only 20% of the kids with serious behavioral issues, what will happen when its 80% and its older kids, and there is no professional</p>

<p>Oh yeah, ALL of the counselors working and staying wth the kids are new to the camp, and about 30% have worked in a camp before</p>

<p>After hearing from my D, that after even a week, some of the kids are just still behaving terriblym, with just a relative few #, I can’t imagine later when it 4 times as many kids with issues for untrained people to deal with</p>

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<p>That’s very helpful, thanks. Usual disclaimers about medical advice,yada- yada-yada. IMHO,with those numbers, if you’ve got physically or even verbally aggressive kids there should be somebody trained to de-escalate using a specific protocol (i.e. Pro-act). If kids need hands on for people to feel safe you need someone certified to do restraints.</p>

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<p>citygirlsmom – It sounds unsafe. If you feel it is unsafe you gotta do what you gotta do. No adult there trained to work with kids with issues like this? Is there a camp nurse or doctor (since many kids apparently are on meds?) at least? </p>

<p>And by the end you’ll have over 100 kids at an over night camp with serious issues? I think you need to follow your gut instinct and try to get your daughter out of that situation.</p>