Considering Bates and College of the Holy Cross

Parent for C25:

Lehigh (College of Health - Global Health)
Bates
Bucknell (College of Arts and Sciences)
Lafayette
Skidmore
Tulane (Spring Scholar admit)
Santa Clara (I initially did not include this - an oversight, apologies)
Chapman (College of Health Sciences - Public Health)

Also accepted to:
CU Boulder
U of St Andrews (Geography or Sustainable Development)

Finances: We’ve been following other threads over time and we are aware and very appreciative of all of the great advice for undergrad/pre-med cost considerations and undergrad financial planning in general from the CC community. For the purposes of this thread, the focus is on the attributes/student preferences listed below, not on the cost of attendance.

Major/academic interest: pre-med. Areas of interest at the LAC’s above are mostly bio and/or chemistry, and Tulane is not declared until end of sophomore year I believe. C25 is interested also in pre-law and business

State of residence: Colorado

Student preferences -

  • “whole college” approach (high flexibility in changing majors/areas of interest)
  • social friendly campus
  • Collaboration over competition on campus
  • fewest barriers to business/engineering if student pivots to those areas
  • small class sizes
  • Excellent teaching for undergraduates
  • best environment for a reserved, academically inclined student
  • any school specific research experiences and/or internships (to set up themselves if necessary)
  • travel/distance from home is not an issue
  • Bates, Skidmore, Bucknell all are going to be visited on admitted student days or tours over April; other colleges (except for Chapman)have had tours/visits in the past month

Many thanks and lots of gratitude for your perspectives, thoughts, and advice.

I’d remove Bates and Skidmore. While you’ll have flexibility academically, you can’t pivot to business or engineering although Skidmore has some level of business.

Bucknell makes sense and to a lesser extent Lafayette.

Tulane should also work. Lehigh should too.

Most are cold but Tulane won’t be - is that an issue ??

I think all could work but Tulane is known as a major party school as is Lehigh and Bucknell. But many parents on here over the years have said those fears are overblown. And perhaps Lafayette, who has engineering, would be better suited. I don’t think kids discover engineering later though. It’s hard core. I think you know in advance that you want it.

I wouldn’t consider Chapman. Other than film, I’ve not read a lot of positive thoughts on here.

Good luck.

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From an academic interests perspective Lehigh checks a lot of boxes. The have an integrated business and engineering major, for example, and it’s apparently not impossible to change colleges. I wonder if it’s going to align with what your child wants culturally. How did they feel on campus on their recent visit? It’s big enough and prestigious enough that I imagine there will be a number of more academically inclined students (work hard/play hard reputation notwithstanding). Tulane probably would as well but the spring start sounds problematic, especially given that your kid hasn’t quite discerned their chosen path yet.

Some folks love Bucknell; our friend’s daughter (sample size: one) transferred out to Santa Clara. She didn’t like the party culture. They have a relatively high percentage of kids participating in Greek life, which may or may not appeal to your kid.

According to this list (From Pre-Med to MD: Understanding the Pathways to Medical School - College Transitions) Bates sends a higher percentage of students to med school than most of the others on your list (aside from Tulane). I think culturally they sound like the best fit (collaborative, academic). But if your kid really thinks they might want to do engineering, Bates is probably a non-starter. Still, glad you’re going. I guess there’s always the possibility of transferring or doing a 3+2 if your kiddo decides to definitely alter course.

Honestly, they’re all great schools for the right kid and they are pretty different. I bet the visits will be clarifying.

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My D23 is finishing her sophomore year at Bates and absolutely loves it. It seems to check all the boxes on your list except for business (see below): collaborative vibe, friendly students, lots of research opportunities, outstanding teaching, etc. My D is also a reserved and academically inclined student, and she’s made lots of like-minded friends. There is a minimal core (not really core) curriculum, and lot of flexibility to pivot as long as you declare your major during spring semester of sophomore year (D has changed her plans a couple of times and now has a double major plus a minor, and she will have no trouble finishing all of them on time for graduation, even with a semester abroad). Pre-med would require a bit of planning and foresight to navigate pre-reqs, but there are many people who are doing the same, and there is a lot of support for pre-med students and a very good record of med school acceptance. The Center for Purposeful Work is a great resource for finding internships and other opportunities in any field.

They don’t offer a BA in business, though they do have Econ, and they offer some short-term classes in business. Econ is not the same as a business major, but arguably a business major is not as important as applied experience coupled with a broad academic background (and perhaps a future MBA). There is a club for students interested in business, and the Center for Purposeful Work also has a lot of resources for students interested in business, including help finding internships and jobs. Some of the business-oriented resources include:

As for engineering, Bates has a number of options for combined plans in partnership with other schools (which is often what you’ll find at LACs): Engineering | Physics & Astronomy | Bates College

And, FWIW, we also live in Colorado and have found transportation between Denver and Lewiston to be quite doable (though it is a long day, and once or twice weather has delayed a return to school after a break).

Skidmore has a similar dual degree engineering program, and does have a more robust program in business than @tsbna44 suggested. – when we visited before D23 applied to college, they made it sound like business was one of the most popular majors on campus, and they were putting a lot of resources into it (which was actually one of the reasons she didn’t apply, but someone looking for business at a LAC should look hard at Skidmore).

I can’t tell you much about your other choices, except that I would take Tulane off the list, if only because a fall start is much preferable to spring – so many friendships form during that first semester. I imagine someone who starts in the spring would take longer to get their bearings. And I would take Chapman off the list as well. From what I’ve heard, other than its film program, it doesn’t measure up to your other choices.

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ooooh - I misseed Tulane Spring - yeah, that’s not a good thing.

Here is Skidmore’s business curriculum - it’s generalist and per what I read has an international additive - but when I say some level, I don’t see that it has focus areas like a normal business undergrad.

But again, I was going for the LACs that have both - which is really Bucknell (has a 5 year bus and engineering program) and Lafayette (engineering…but not business…but has econ and does very well placement wise.

I’ve attached the Skidmore placement report - not broken out by major, but overall salaries seem low. It’d be nice to know and you can ask them - where do the business students fall?

Thanks

Management and Business | Skidmore College

2024-First-Destinations-Report_pdf.pdf

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ooooh - I misseed Tulane Spring - yeah, that’s not a good thing.

I can’t tell you much about your other choices, except that I would take Tulane off the list, if only because a fall start is much preferable to spring – so many friendships form during that first semester. I imagine someone who starts in the spring would take longer to get their bearings.

Tulane probably would as well but the spring start sounds problematic, especially given that your kid hasn’t quite discerned their chosen path yet.

Thank you for this guidance - this was also communicated in replies to an earlier post when I asked about the spring admit aspect of Tulane. Both replies echoed your collective advice.

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Thank you for this post and your post above, super helpful! I’ll have C25 check the links for Skidmore as well, thank you!

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Great insight and information, thank you!!

Lehigh - seems to be their favorite currently; I’m asking them to see the colleges they have not toured, to compare to what the Lehigh impression has been so far. @WayOutWestMom or maybe another CC poster had mentioned in another thread that schools have medical admissions committees who might only recommend the highest MCAT/GPA students, and mentioned Lehigh’s high med school admissions rate might reflect that they tend to recommend a small number of students, so C25 is going to ask about that process for med school recommendations (and also law school recommendation process - they definitely need a flexible first year or so to figure out their path).

Tulane - loved Tulane campus and flexibility of the majors/divisions/classes for the first two years, but the spring start has just been deemed a deal breaker for them.

Thank you for the anecdotal experience on Bucknell - I had missed including Santa Clara above. C25 was accepted to Santa Clara, so I’ll share that with them.

Bates - I just watched a zoom session on Bates alumni in science and medicine (it’s on the Bates College YouTube website), which highlighted varied and really interesting career paths for the alums. It’s great to see those stats that you’ve included as well, thank you! I’ll share these with C25.

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Thank you so so much for the info and all of the links on Bates, and for sharing your student’s experiences there. So glad they are having a wonderful experience at Bates! I’m the designated “B roll” camera person for C28’s Spanish cooking video tonight, so I may need to take a look tomorrow at the links and reply back with any further questions on Bates.

Tulane - I agree; I think C25 is letting that choice go at this point.

Chapman - C25 feels Santa Clara would be a better fit for them than Chapman at this point as well, if they decided to head west.

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Lehigh’s website notes this:

The Health Professions Advisory Committee (HPAC) provides a committee letter to those applying to medical, dental, optometry, and podiatry programs. The HPAC process consists of milestones throughout the year of application to help prepare students for the application process and culminates in the letter.

Prospective Pre-Health Students | Career & Professional Development

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Feel free to ask any time! It’s a stressful period between acceptances and decisions.

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Thank you for this link, much appreciated!

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Good luck! That’s an amazing list of acceptances! Mine also looked at Bates, Skidmore, Lafayette, Bucknell along with additional SLACs. All of these schools are difficult to get into through RD so huge congrats! Mine did ED to Bates and got in. Happy to answer questions about Bates. It’s very popular for pre-med. Also for psych/neuro (which is what my kid is doing - now a junior). Professors are awesome. Great opportunities to collaborate with professors and get experience in the community. There’s no business degree but there is economics, and also a short-term program with Dartmouth-Tuck business school. A lot of kids get recruited for finance and consulting in Boston, so that’s also a business tie-in (there is also NESCAC recruiting, which Bates is part of for jobs/internships). Although mine is a psych major, it’s looking like she will work in marketing, so that’s another business route. All the best!

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Agree that Tulane should be taken off of the list due to the Spring start date for freshman year. Will miss out on too much bonding with classmates.

Lehigh, Bucknell, & Lafayette are great options, but need to be aware of the very real party culture on each campus.

Skidmore is a good choice if LGBTQ+ and want an open accepting environment in a beautiful location. Saratoga Springs is an attractive tourist town.

Does the student have any strong preference with respect to weather ?

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Thank you so much for your advice and input!

Tulane - many discussions over the spring admit feature (they chose the Spring admit option knowing it would help with admissions potentially-they seem to be moving away from this choice as we’ve discussed that this option is optimal for the school’s metrics, not for the student experience).

Skidmore - Thanks for this info and I’d love for a visit to happen over the next few weeks here.

Bucknell Lehigh and Lafayette - these two schools dropped in C25’s eyes after visits, with Bucknell’s location being less central and Lafayette did not resonate the way that Lehigh did for C25. C25 liked campus, town, and program’s outreach. The culture of all three is a parental concern, but less of a concern to C25.

Bates - we plan to visit next week or week after depending on C25’s schedule

Santa Clara - also hopefully will visit

Thanks!!

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I forgot the weather :slight_smile:
They like warm weather (which is why Tulane has still been in play as well as Santa Clara) but between the Poconos, Saratoga Springs, and Lewiston, they will have to figure out what their cold to very cold tolerance is.

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The most common issue folks report with Bates College is the location (cold, damp weather & the town itself). Not sure, but I think that many select Bates due to the financial aid offered or because it was their reach school. Other posters know more about Bates than I do.

Have you asked Tulane if you can be switched to a Fall admit ? (Only do so if Tulane becomes your true first choice school.)

Lehigh’s integrated engineering & business major might, as poster @goldbug noted, be of interest. Over the past several years, many MBA programs have shifted toward an integrated approach incorporating technology/STEM skills in response to the demands of major employers.

I have many friends and acquaintances who have attended Lehigh, Lafayette,and Bucknell over the past 5 decades. They all appear to have done well in life professionally and all enjoyed their college years.

Additionally, I have spent a substantial amount of time in Boulder, Colorado (CU-Boulder). Gorgeous community. Strong tech industry. High priced housing.

Re: Bates and location – I guess it depends on what part of the country you have ties to. There’s a large California presence at Bates and I suspect the New England colleges are attractive to a lot of families who also studied in New England back in the day. People are just more familiar with the NESCAC (New England) colleges than they are with those further south (Lafayette, Bucknell). When we meet other parents at Bates during parents’ weekends, it’s interesting how many of them studied at Bowdoin, Colby, Dartmouth, Middlebury, Brown, etc, or have other kids at these schools. Boston is the hub (2-hour drive) and I’ve also met parents who were at MIT or Tufts, etc. Yes, Bates is a top 20 SLAC, but students don’t seem to choose it based on ranking – it’s usually on the “visit list” when students are doing the New England college road trip. For my kid, it was also one of the few colleges that offered a very personalized tour (coming out of COVID) and the academics and culture just seemed like the right fit for her. If you visit in January, it might be a harder sell, but we visited once in summer and again in fall and it was amazing!!! (As far as winter goes, there is a long February break - Feb 14-24 this year for my student).

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Lehigh has some amazing academics. They also have a fraternity/sorority culture which has been a serious problem in the not too distant past. I’m not current with the state of affairs there in this regard, so I’ll simply suggest that you check it out and make sure that you’re comfortable with that aspect of campus life. :slightly_smiling_face:

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Thank you so much for posting and offering to answer questions on Bates, much appreciated! It is the one school C25 has less knowledge about as far as geography/area, so sharing first hand knowledge on the Bates experience and campus is very helpful. For your junior, @westcoastfam, and for your sophomore, @Shelby_Balik, how has the size of Bates impacted their college experience so far? Thank you!