It would appear the shooter did not share his plans with his therapist in this case. Therapists note it is unlikely that they can detect or prevent these incidents often.
However if therapy can help young men feel better before their obsessions/self victimization turns murderous, all the best. There’s a story online (don’t remember the publication) about a gentle 13-year old Jewish boy enthusiastic foray into the alt right, for instance. Teenagers change very quickly. Saving them from the self they’ve adopted for a time, so they can grow into another self a few months/weeks later, is an essential job.
I only saw this story earlier because our former pastor’s wife shared it on facebook and said that the marine recruit that helped disarm the shooter was a friend of her son’s from their time in Colorado. Otherwise it hasn’t seemed to be big news, which is sad to me.
Our school has taken measures in recent years to be safer, though there is still plenty of opportunity for someone who wished to do harm. I know that there are certain teachers and administrators that have undergone training and are allowed to carry a weapon, though it is not made known who those people are for safety reasons. If you will notice, most mass shootings seem to occur in areas where it is less likely that there will be someone with a weapon to stop them. I think that is one reason that areas like mine haven’t seen much in the way of these types of shootings, there is a good chance that there will be someone there who is armed. We have volunteer teams at church that patrol the building and grounds during services, but even before we had that, there are a few people that I know are always carrying. It is not obvious, just some that never go anywhere without a gun.
I having considered renewing my permit, especially for times like trips and such, but don’t feel confident that I can trust my kids around a gun or be vigilant enough to always keep things locked up. I am not really able to control their access though because they go to their grandparents(father’s side) and they have told where all of the various guns are kept. They are loaded and not locked away and when they are with their father for visitation I have no control over things. When I filed a protection from abuse order against their father(we were married at the time) he was barred from having guns, but though I didn’t realize at the time, our divorce agreement dismissed the order so I guess he is free to own guns now. He has been under psychiatric care for years and a few months prior to our separation his parents began proceedings to have him involuntarily committed, the determination was made but they failed to sign the final paperwork so nothing was done.
I have no problem with restrictions on domestic abusers and those mentally unstable, though it could have the effect of causing even less people to seek psychiatric care if it could mean losing their right to own a gun. As far as “assault rifles”, I’m not sure that it is legal to own them now. Many of the guns commonly termed as assault rifles are not technically in that category, such as an AR15. Fully automatic weapons like the military uses are not readily available to the general public, though just like drugs there is always a way to get something or the means to convert one to a fully automatic gun. I have family members and friends that own a vast array of guns and none of them have felt the need to go shoot up a public place.
Honestly, the only gun violence that I have known of in this area is directed at a family member or perhaps someone involved in an affair, something of that nature.
@MWolf Apparently you are used to a different school district and training than the one I work at. Here students and staff were taught about Safe2Say and it’s nothing at all similar to your post. It’s a tip to try to prevent suicide and/or shootings and it seems to be working pretty well at this point.
We’ve had students commit suicide. There have been students who had an idea beforehand, but didn’t want to “tell” on their friends or thought it wouldn’t come true. Now they have a place they can safely check on it. We have students we watch, but it has a lot to do with depression or obsession and nothing to do with the way they dress or the music they listen to.
Checking on things saves lives. Who knows how many? I, for one, am glad my state started this.
I’d be for decent gun control if it were possible in this country, but it’s pretty easy to see that’s never going to happen.
Ideally I’d like to end the current way gun culture has evolved - the whole idea that it’s ok to just shoot someone (including themselves) as a response option when something, anything, happens, but I don’t see that happening here either. It’s impossible to close Pandora’s Box, so doing what we can do to try to save lives is what needs to be done.
Addressing any particular post would denigrate the many that are just as deserving, so I won’t bother. No use singling out someone, when their only mistake was being one of many.
Firearms fulfill many purposes: from hunting, to sport, personal protection, to equalization or more. Cops carry them because they deal daily with people who may kill or hurt them badly, just as citizens want them for that life-changing moment when they meet one of those same people. The Second, along with Court review, confirms their ability to do so. That guns are misused is simply irrelevant. Live long enough and you’ll eventually tumble to the fact that one restriction begets another, even for the things that are important to you.
Because of numerous instances where school shootings turned out to have been committed by those who’ve been on anti-depressants, I did a quick search for studies and stats to date. Surprise: there simply isn’t much there, except on websites that look like they also carry pieces about the dangers of vaccines. One thing from the LA Times, which spoke confidently about a Netherland’s study that disproved anti-depressants as a trigger and suggested anyone repeating that lie was intent on stigmatizing the mentally ill.
I’ve yet to see a public safety/health issue that wasn’t funded/researched to the point of suppressing the gag reflex but… new things are part of what makes life interesting still. Research might not matter anway, though - these day’s, people who feel bad about themselves are steered toward drugs to take care of that. Not much chance of finding causation when your sample pool is almost uniformly medicated.
A suggestion would be to cut back on the victim culture. Being bullied/excluded was part of growing up in the past - unfortunate and reprehensible - but didn’t seem to be an excuse for gunning down some of your class. Maybe if your problems don’t merit being considered a serious victim, you won’t feel justified in taking serous steps?
I guess there’s no button to vehemently disagree with a post, so I’ll just say “Wow”.
It’s baffling to me why Americans think they’re psychologically special in some way. They’re not. Having lived in other countries I can tell you that everyone struggles with toxic masculinity, racism, violence, etc. etc.
The difference is that these other countries have stricter gun laws.
@OhiBro - To clarify your statement that “a suspect hating Christians” seemed a bit strong for what the actual situation was: a student who “hated” Christians who hated gays. Even that was just from a rant on facebook. I wonder if there was more substantial evidence that he actually “hated” Christians.
Depression is an illness, it is not kids being weak. Parents who put their kids on antidepressants are saving their lives. Please do not endanger the lives of children by spreading the false idea that school shootings are because the kids are on antidepressants.
I am a combat medic with multiple years of front line action, and have been under fire, and I have treated wounded under fire. I have buried friends. Every time I had to go back, I did so. Every time I was called up for active duty, I went without a problem. I am not a weak person.
I also struggle with depression, and take antidepressants regularly.
According to your post, I take them because I feel bad about myself. Depression is not somebody “feeling bad about themselves”.
Please learn about antidepressants and depression before posting on the topic again.
School shooters are neither kids who were bullied, nor are they kids on antidepressants.
Here’s the thing with the link to anti-depressant use. Yes, there are black box warning, indicating that they can cause some pretty serious side effects, including psychosis. But in most cases those side effects pop up pretty quickly, and treatment is changed. They types of bizarre behavior that accompanies these side effects would be noticed, and I don’t recall seeing any such reports (except with the movie theater shooter, but those symptoms were not due to the drugs, but the underlying mental illness. I pose that the use of medications is a sign of the severity of the problems these people were facing, not a trigger. If they were under treatment, then they were trying to get help. If we further stigmatize mental illness, we push more people away from treatment, and in my mind, that increases the risk of these kinds of activities. What we have is a systemic failure. If these kids believe they’re been bullied, and everyone turns a blind eye, or tells them to toughen up, what do we expect? In the age of “zero-tolerance” if they fight back, they are the ones who end up facing punishment, and the bullying continues, because it becomes a game of how much trouble the bully can cause for them. If they don’t fight back, they end up snapping, and doing horrible things. If school administrators keep hearing them complain, it suggest one of two things: either the bullying is real, and not being addressed, or the student might be delusional - and needs treatment! I find it hard to believe that in every case nobody “saw something.”
Parkland showed that any sense that “it can’t happen here” is a false sense of security. Parkland, a prosperous, quiet suburb, was deemed one of the safest communities in that region, and many people there have guns and can use them. Neither fact saved the 17 children who lost their lives that day, nor the trauma that hundreds others feel.
And this is NOT normal.
Nobody needs an AR15 for defense. No civilian needs an AR 15 for anything. These weapons were created to mow down as many people as possible, as fast as possible, in a war zone. Some people may want one but it doesn’t mean they should be able to get one. (Some people also want tanks. Some products are regulated, for a reason). .
Do we know more about the shooters?
A vigil was held last night to honor the student who died.
Students and families walked out in protest when they tried to make it all political rather than honoring the hero student, and not allowing the STEM students to speak.
I saw a reaction like “This student is a hero, now it’s our turn to do something” and I was disgusted. The student died because adults have failed teenagers. It shouldn’t be up to teenagers to protect their classmates by getting killed themselves.
I really hope something will be done, but teenagers shouldn’t have to die for adults to realize that.
Even worse: that it seemed so matter-of-fact (“another school shooting”) to some people.
MODERATOR’S NOTE:
I’m failing to understand on which part of my earlier message, " let’s move on from discussing 2nd amendment, what the Founding Fathers meant, current/proposed laws, etc." was unclear.
Several posts deleted.
Just to state a fact, a modern day AR!5 is a scary looking semi-automatic rifle, offered to the American public since the early 1960’s. It was styled after a fully auto weapon of war, but modified to semi when offered to the general public.
The United States has a handgun problem, not an AR-15 problem.
CNN is reporting that there have been 15 “school shootings” thus far in 2019. Of those 15 there were 2 (UNCC & Highland Ranch) that were horrific mass casualty tragedies representative of the traumatic mental image the term “school shooting” engenders. None of the 2019 school shootings involved an AR-15…all involved either a handgun, or a pellet gun.
1/7/19 - CA: A 17 year old was murdered outside an elementary school.
1/25/19 - AL: A 17 yr old and a 20 yr old got into an altercation outside a high school and shot each other.
1/30/19 - GA: An adult non-student running on a high school track was shot when he attempted to stop someone from stealing his car.
1/31/19 - TN: A 14 yr old ROTC student was shot with a pellet gun at high school(training incident).
1/31/19 - TX: A 16 yr old student was shot by a 17 yr old student during a drug deal.
2/8/19 - MD: A high school staff member was confronted and shot by a member of his family.
2/12/10 - MO: After a fight a 15 year old was targeted and shot outside a high school basketball game.
2/26/19 - AL: A 17 yr old student was shot in the gym by a minor.
3/7/19 - LA: A gun accidentally discharged in a dorm at Grambling State University.
3/27/19 - MS: A 10 yr old was struck by a stray bullet while riding the bus home from school.
4/1/19 - AR: An 8th grader shot another 8th grader in their high school.
4/30/19 - NC: UNCC mass shooting.
5/4/19 - OR: A 21 yr old non-student was murdered outside a U of O fraternity house.
5/7/19 - CO: Highlands Ranch mass shooting.
Thank you. ?
According to the CDC, firearms are the second leading cause of death for American children 19 and under.
would you list the link for that, doschicos?