<p>“ED is a way for the rich to jump the line”</p>
<p>Huh?</p>
<p>I don’t remember seeing anything on the ED application restricting who could apply based on economic status.</p>
<p>At my S’s school, the ED applicants were distinguished more by their across-the-board higher academic achievements and goals than by their economic status.</p>
<p>Dizzymom, Patuxent is pointing out–correctly–that it is a bad idea to apply ED if one must weigh financial aid offers <em>at all</em>. D was accepted at four schools and the amount of aid offered significantly. If she had applied ED, she would have had no leverage whatsoever over the amount and structure of the aid.</p>
<p>Informed and ethical applicants will not apply ED if they will make a decision based upon their aid packages. Ditching Princeton for TAMU will probably not bring any penalty of a practical nature–though I’d forget about appying to Princeton for grad school–but ditching Princeton for another elite school like, say, U/Chicago, Columbia, etc. would bring some well-deserved nasty repercussions. Applying ED gives you some advantages…in exchange for those advantages, the applicant is surrendering other options. To try to have your cake and eat it too is an extended middle finger to every applicant who plays the game by the rules. Personally, I hate the ED system and I wish it were abolished…but its merits or lack thereof are beside the point of how you play the game.</p>
<p>Which finger is Princeton extending to those who cannot afford full fare? My guess is an institution with Princeton’s avaricious nature has a short memory. Distinguish yourself as an undergraduate and they will quickly forget what you did to them as a senior in high school. Win a Rhodes and they wouldn’t care if you were a cross dressing Scientologist if you would choose Princeton over Yale. They have the morals and avariciousness of a Philadelphia pimp. That is why they are (almost) on top.</p>
<p>Patuxent, you misread: applicants who renege on the ED system are extending a finger to everyone else who plays by the rules as they are: right, wrong, or indifferent.</p>
<p>The only rules that count are the ones we all have say in writting. If Princeton wants to write rules to suit Princeton then Princeton can have the bother of having them flaunted.</p>
<p>Patuxent,if you are interested in the middle class, why are you slamming Princeton, which is known for generous aid? I agree that college financial aid for the middle class is tricky, but if you are considering selective colleges, Princeton for middle income kids is darn good–often considered the benchmark for aid at “elite” schools. For the misinformed or uninformed,there are no loans in the aid pkg. “For those who can’t afford full fare,” the financial aid package is all grants and work study. I feel truly fortunate that students can graduate from Princeton with no debt. What is so avaricious in this policy? At least from my own experience, a middle class kid from a public high school can get in, the doors are open. Sorry if your experiences have been otherwise.<br>
I didn’t write the rules, but there was a choice to apply or not to apply.</p>
<p>For a better aid explanation, see Northstarmom’s post #443 on page 23.</p>
<p>Cricket, the student doesn’t have loans. That is a good thing. What about the parents?</p>
<p>Dstark, there are no loans in the aid package. Whereas most financial aid packages are broken down into grants, loans, workstudy, Princeton does not use loans to meet need. I am a parent, I have no loans.</p>
<p>Because you can afford what Princeton said was your contribution, you have no loans. What if you can’t?</p>
<p>My aid was calculated using all of my financial data. What was needed was what was granted. I’m frugal, I have saved for my child’s education, I’m glad to contribute what I can, and I am grateful for the aid that Princeton awarded. I know that if I choose to buy something extravagant, say a Mercedes, I’d likely need a car loan. But I have no desire for a fancy car, just for a fine education for my child.</p>
<p>Well Valdez, who started this discussion, has a family with different circumstances. The cost of the school is $4,000 a year more than they calculated using Princeton’s calculator.
It looks like the parents will need loans.
The parents aren’t comfortable with loans.
You’ll have to ask Valdez, but it appears that the parents thought there would be no loans, including parent loans.
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=26449[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=26449</a>
PS I would choose an education at Princeton over a Mercedes too.</p>
<p>Cricket, it is wonderful that you have done well in your financial life. It is a difficult thing to do and most of us are not so successful. My financial picture was catastrophic some years ago, and I was largely to blame. Yes, some things I can defiantly defend, but there were many things that were carelessness and really lack of discipline. All parents are not so perfect. Many of us fully knew we should have been saving for college and living frugally, and we did not. I look at some of the famiies whose kids work with me and I marvel at how they put their children’s educational opportunities so high on their priorities that they are willing to live in cramped, unsafe housing and work themselves to the bone. But when it comes time for college, that is often the wake up call for many of us. We finally suck it in. And if we are willing to take out the loans, the loans are available at pretty favorable terms, so we do. I am thinking about taking them myself next year, as it is going to be a really big spending year, and I am going to retire my business so the income is not going to be there. For some of us, we have put ourselves in a position where it would be painful for the family to sell the house and move to something smaller. And when I say “we” , I don’t necessarily mean myself. Having lived in sub paar housing in dangerous neighborhoods, I would be loathe to return to such arrangements with 3 little boys, as I am getting older. I did it when I was younger, and well know what it involves. We really enjoy our home, all of us, and I am not sure if it would be worth it to take a significant step down in order to pay for one kid’s college especially if we can take out a loan. And my other kids have pressing needs that I don’t think I want to ignore to pay for the best college option for one child. We all have to weigh priorities.</p>
<p>And I don’t agree with those families that work themselves to the bone to pay for an expensive college. I truly would not want any loved one to do that for me. For a bone marrow transplant, yes, for a selective college, I don’t think so. There are some values in life that are more important, noble as those sacrifices sound.</p>
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<p>Patuxent, you are looking at the wrong end of the issue. The school does NOT have to take the student to court to prevail if a dispute should arise. The school cannot force a student to attend or a family to meet the financial aspect of the contract. They’ll consider the application abandoned and make another person ecstatic in the RD round. What they can ALSO do is making sure that your remaining RD applications become null and void. </p>
<p>Do you know many schools that would show a keen interest in an applicant who not only need substantial financial aid but also clearly violated the terms of a binding contract with a competing but well-respected institution and, probably, lied on the RD application? Playing games with the ED contract could land an offender in the dire situation of having no school to attend in August coupled with a huge handicap for next year’s application. </p>
<p>As far as testing this issue in court, do you know a single case where a family was successful in extractng a release from an ED contract through a lawsuit? </p>
<p>If you want to find some guidance in understanding this issue, you could read the ED pages of Columbia -they are black on white. They are very clear that releases of ED contract are very rare but negotiable. Columbia will release a student from his or her ED contract for financial reasons, but only to attend a lower level and cheaper school. As TheDad said, Princeton will have little issue to release an ED applicant if he decides to attend a State school such as TAMU. This is very different from comparing financial packages from similarly selective schools.</p>
<p>If Valdez’s family’s financial circumstances changed, the aid would reflect that, so I will venture a guess that an error was made on the calculator or that the $4000 actually represents the student contribution from summer work and work study. But who knows without looking at all those figures? The bottom line here is, Valdez didn’t say he couldn’t pay, but that he’d rather go to A&M and not. Generally, where there is a will there is a way. Just my opinion.</p>
<p>cricket - no bad experiences with Princeton here, indeed no experiences at all and no special axe to grind. Princeton is no worse and may be better than some others. To me they are just a type - a highly selective school engaged in the nefarious practice of trying to get family A to pay for family B’s kid. For that is what this game is all about. Determine if you can the real price of a Princeton education - it is an impossibility since they don’t have just one. The $35,000 or $40,000 sticker price is just there to suck in the maximum free federal aid money available or as a luxury tax on the truly wealthy. You can only know the true price of a Princeton education if you knew the true discount they end up giving. The sticker price is about as real as the the alleged price of that Popiel Pocket Fisherman and all the free stuff you get with you hear advertised on late night TV - “A $69 value yours for only…”</p>
<p>Xiggi, if I go to any school in the country, and say I can’t afford it, I don’t know of any school in the country that would say “we are not going to let you out of your ED commitment”, or “RD commitment”. Until I read this thread, I thought financial considerations were a reason to get out of an ED commitment.
Jamimom, there are many reasons to send a kid to a very selective school. One reason is for a kid to be able to eventually get a good job. Then buy a great house. I find it ironic that people go deep into debt and risk their nice house so that someday, maybe, their own kid might be able to buy one.
I agree with you that there are more important things than going to a selective college.</p>
<p>Cheers, it was really pi**ing me off that I was a junior member. I guess this thread rasied me to a member. (I would put a smiley face here, but I don’t know how).</p>
<p>It ain’t that exclusive, D. Just need 300 posts in the new forum. Don’t know what the senior threshold is…</p>
<p>Hit colon, then parenthesis for smile–the parenthesis over Zero.</p>
<p>Hit colon, then lower case ‘p’ for stick tongue out face.</p>
<p>Does “last page” mean that’s it? Or will it continue?</p>
<p>senior is 1K</p>