Diversity and meeting my mate at Penn

Colleges & Universities University of Pennsylvania
41

<p>

</p>

<p>In all fairness, I don’t think it’s offensive if a Jewish person says that he or she is looking for a critical mass of other Jewish people to date / potentially marry in college. So I’m not sure what’s offensive about him wanting to date a Christian as well. </p>

<p>The OP is sweating this too much. If your faith is that important to you, you’ll join a group or church at Penn that caters to members of that faith, and you’ll find someone there. Or maybe you won’t, and you’ll find that special someone at your first job. Or through mutual friends. Or any number of ways.</p>

42

<p>BTW, the US divorce rate is NOT 50%. That’s an oft-repeated but false canard, calculated by some non-genius who took the # of reported divorces in a given year and noted that it was half the # of reported marriages in a given year. But the base isn’t the marriages occurring that same year, it’s all married couples. The real divorce rate is in the 15%-20% range, not the 50% range.</p>

<p>Other countries’ lower divorce rates are nothing to crow about, because many of them represent cultures where women are trapped and have no way to get out of bad situations.</p>

43

<p>^^^ I’m curious, too; why avoid Penn girls?</p>

44

<p>However you look at the numbers…they are not good.</p>

<ul>
<li>8.1% of coupled households consist of unmarried heterosexual partners, according to The State of Our Unions 2005, a report issued by the National Marriage Project at Rutgers University. The same study said that only 63% of American children grow up with both biological parents – the lowest figure in the Western world.</li>
<li>As of 2003, 43.7% of custodial mothers and 56.2% of custodial fathers were either separated or divorced.
[Divorce</a> Statistics, Marriage Statistics: Divorce Rates in America, Marriage](<a href=“http://www.divorcemag.com/statistics/statsUS.shtml]Divorce”>Divorce Rate in America: 50+ Divorce Statistics [Updated 2024])</li>
</ul>

45

<p>Pizzagirl, that is the very reason I questioned the OP’s use of race, not religion, as a selection criterion. I agree that it is not offensive for someone who is part of a faith community to want to limit his search for a mate to other members of that community. I’m not certain I understand why the OP is focused on finding a mate at 17, but I figure that will take care of itself.</p>

<p>At the same time, I think some faith communities make too much fuss about “inter-dating”. I heard many a warning against it growing up, and the result was that it took me a long time to be willing to date INSIDE my religious group.</p>

<p>Pizzagirl is right, too, on the divorce rate. I think if you look at the research you will see that divorce is as prevalent among Christians as it is anywhere else in this society. Catholics and non-religious people seem to do a little better, but only a little. My experience, looking at my friends etc., is that there are five main reasons why people get divorced: (1) They got married too young. (2) One of them is gay but wasn’t out to him or herself (or wasn’t willing to be out to other people) until after they were married. (3) One of them is more successful stopping drinking (or taking drugs) than the other. (4) Something major happens – great success, great difficulty, a serious illness or death of a child – and the couple finds that their ways of dealing with it are too different to stay together. And of course the ever-popular (5) one of them feels compelled to have sex with other people, and the other one minds. That, however, is often as much a symptom of one of the other reasons as it is an independent factor on its own.</p>

46

<p>to add some appropriate humor to this thread…</p>

<p>How to be politically correct:
<a href=“http://harmful.cat-v.org/pc.jpg[/url]”>http://harmful.cat-v.org/pc.jpg&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

47

<p>One last comment. I just wanted to remind everyone that one of the key reasons I got into Penn is that I am a double legacy and child of employee. Without this I was low/borderline and would not have gotten in. I am getting a free Ivy league education due to my family and its ties. A long family tradition and we are all white Christians I am sorry to say. My grandparents and parents met at Penn before the huge focus on diversity in the past 30 years. In addition to my immediate family there are also several uncles, aunts, cousins as grads or employees. It’s a huge part of my influence. I wonder of the majority of international students will seek great diversity and marry a Penn classmate or if they will complete their education in the US then turn back to their own countries for marriage (and even bring their spouses here). That is why I excluded them from my possibility pool. Thanks again for the discussion.</p>

48

<p>Pennboy, you’ve been given a great opportunity to study free at one of the best universities in the world. To take full advantage of what you’ve been given, open your mind. You’ll learn as much, if not more, outside of the classroom as inside it. That’s what college can provide – experiences, not just a degree.</p>

<p>I’m eager to hear back from you in four years to hear what you’ve learned.</p>

49

<p>

Why are you sorry?</p>

50

<p>I respect pennboy25. He realizes he has accepted his parents’ views and opinions on acceptable mates. It sounds like he comes from a few generations of happy marriages and wants to replicate what seemed to work. The mating pool at Penn has changed since his family met their suitable spouses so he wonders if he will be able to do the same.</p>

<p>If he knows he needs his parents’ approval and what that requires, I would caution him against dating outside those criteria. He might fall in love, triggering a cascade of heartache that could last, well, decades. </p>

<p>My Jewish boyfriend could only marry a Jewish woman. He asked me out, hoping I was Jewish. I wasn’t. He couldn’t stay away. Neither could I. We fell deeply in love, and spent almost six years together during which time I converted. I still was not acceptable to his family, so I could not be fully acceptable to him. As an individual, yes. But without his parents’ approval, not completely. He was in an impossible bind. I relieved him by refusing to see him. I would not be a divisive role in his family. </p>

<p>We went on to marry and have children with others. We never stopped loving each other, even 20+ years later. It has caused untold pain, spanning three generations. In retrospect, it would have been better if he had not asked me out in the first place. </p>

<p>In general, sharing the same faith makes for an easier marriage, especially if is important to either partner. By no means is common faith or background required for everyone, or the only attributes that matter, but I understand why the OP and his family feel as they do. I admire pennboy25 for knowing what he requires and wanting to find a girl as his father did.</p>

<p>Once he is at college, he may change his mind about lots of this. He may decide there are many paths to marital happiness besides the one he knew and saw. His parents’ approval may cease to matter. Still, I don’t fault him for feeling the way he does.</p>

<p>More than anything, I hope our young OP finds that lovely, ideal wife and has a long, happy, fulfilling marriage.</p>

51

<p>je<em>ne</em>sais:</p>

<p>What a painful, valuable lesson! (Painful for you, valuable for others, I suppose.)</p>

<p>However, I think it’s pretty clear in your sad story: First, that the boy’s parents were horribly misguided, and managed to hurt their son and lots of other people too with their attitude, in addition to not quite accomplishing the goals they had. Second, that a number of people’s lives would probably have worked out better had the boy stood up to his parents rather than obeying them.</p>

<p>I have seen a number of situations like this. The people in the parents’ position almost never get what they want, long term. Never. They are often successful in attaining their short-term goal (getting their child not to marry Person X to whom they object), but almost never their real goals (having a happy child who continues the family traditions;having a good relationship with their child’s spouse and their grandchildren; the child having a good marriage).</p>

52

<p>

</p>

<p>Now, now, JHS, it’s not always appropriate to take the removed, analytical approach. This is no fictional story, mind you.</p>

<p>To the OP:

  • Don’t worry about finding a mate in college. If you find someone who you think is the one, you’ll know - so don’t get mixed up in probable calculations excluding all kinds of people you have yet to meet. Have faith you’ll find someone; that’s the whole idea of faith, right? Trust that God will show you the person you will someday marry. Your primary concern going in should not be to find a spouse but rather to find your niche, get “into” your classes [they can be very interesting if you immerse yourself in them], and explore yourself through dedicated introspection.</p>

<ul>
<li><p>Penn is a great place to learn, indeed. And with the learning you will surely broaden your perspective. You won’t be the same person when you graduate, I can assure you; how different is up to you. Engage in as many philosophical discussions as possible - Penn students are eager to discuss. The way I look at it - I’ll argue - if I come away thinking about something more deeply, excellent; if I haven’t then I likely have given them something to think about. Either way I am joyful that knowledge has been generated.</p></li>
<li><p>Whether you like it or not, you will be far away from your parents’ views and approval. You’re going to have to adopt your own views and lifestyle - there’s no way around it. You can choose to see the world the way your parents see it, or you can attempt to see the world for yourself. If you’re confident you’ll stick by your values, then you might as well explore other values without hesitation. Who knows what you’ll find? You just have to open your eyes. Strive to meta out of your own habitual thought processes, no matter how far you think you’ve come; there’s always something new to find when you truly see.</p></li>
</ul>

<p>I hope you take some of this advice; I was temped to make a biting remark and be done with it, but I didn’t.</p>

53

<p>Pennboy, I, like some other have said, respect the fact that you acknowledge what you want in a woman… that said, it would most likely be a mistake to come into college looking to find a girlfriend/wife. There are a couple things wrong with your calculations (I didn’t read all four pages of this… just two of the four, so someone else may have said this already). First, I would imagine that one of your bigger reasons for listing “white” as a requirement is that you are attracted more to white girls than any other race… that’s completely legit, but remember that many people choose not to list their race, others list a minority race to help their chances of acceptance, even if they are only, say, 25% that race. Second, while there are 3,000 undergraduate Jewish students, there are also 2,000 undergraduate Catholic students and plenty more Protestants. Third, your raw calculations don’t take into account the number of girls who are not looking for a boyfriend upon entering freshman year and the girls who already have boyfriends. Once you eliminate all of those people, you are looking at very few.</p>

<p>Why I wouldn’t fear is that if you have requirements (be them hard requirements or soft ones) for girls you date, that reduces the number of mistakes you could make. After all, you only need to meet one person to fall madly in love.</p>

<p>That said, I wouldn’t worry. Nobody in my rather large family (dad’s one of eight, mom’s one of five) met their spouse in college, and although many people do meet their spouses in college, it ain’t the end of the world not to. Trying too hard is a major mistake, though…</p>

54

<p>Anyone who views potential college relationships as a numbers game probably has a dismal chance at ever experiencing one.</p>

55

<p>the op is stupid</p>

56

<p>Has to be a freshman, white, catholic… anything else you need? Height? Hair/Eye color?</p>

<p>What if you become interested in somebody outside of the box? Have you EVER considered that? Why not stay in touch with admissions to get all 145 names that you so desire?</p>

57

<p>This explains why my caucasian christian daughter has lots of dates at Penn… mostly with nice Jewish boys…</p>

58

<p>

</p>

<p>Be prepared that your caucasian christian daughter may become a caucasian jew. :)</p>

<p>Mine might.:(</p>

59

<p>cbreeze why are you not being denigrated on this board for making a frown face at that comment? don’t you know anything goes?</p>

60

<p>Pennboy: I laughed my ass off reading your logic. And no you wont get a date if you keeping thinking that way. Get a life. Anyway Jewish girls can be really hot spoken from a nice Lutheran boy.</p>