<p>Re: #19. That’s not my understanding for UVa. UVa made a concerted effort to boost USNews ranking. One way to do this was to increase the percentage of alums who give. To do that, UVa instituted a preference for OOS legacies whose parents have donated to UVa for some # of years. I may be out of date, but I think that’s still UVa’s policy.</p>
<p>I heard that legacy only matters if you apply ED/EA.
D’s BF is legacy with both parents at UPenn, he has great SAT/PSAT with lots of AP/IB but not so good GPA, did not get in.</p>
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<p>Interestingly, this statement is totally inconsistent with a reasonable body of actual research on the topic. See “The Early Admissions Game” for example. Or “The Chosen” It is also funny how many of these places go out of their way to tell alums how it matters (Harvard’s “thumb on the scale”) while they tell the general population that there is no difference, like the quote above. </p>
<p>In general, it seems that legacy status matters, if at all, at highly selective institutions. After all, if a middle tier LAC admits over half its applicants, how much boost is needed? Few public institutions count it (for instance U. Cal system disavowed legacy preferences about 20 years ago).</p>
<p>Most importantly, it is not well known that at many elites, legacy status is only a boost if the parents were undergrads. I can guarantee that this was the case at Harvard 6 years ago.</p>
<p>Thanks for the replies. I guess I’m just curious because you see so many comments on CC in which people state outright that the spots for kids who fall beneath the 25% are “reserved,” if you will, for athletes, legacies and URM’s. I was just wondering if there is data to support this.</p>
<p>At one of our admission sessions, (not HYPMS but at what most on CC would consider to be an elite private university), there was an additional meeting for legacy applicants. The counselor made a few things painfully clear to the three families in attendance:</p>
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<li>Legacy was helpful only during ED with an acceptance rate nearly 2.5X higher than RD.</li>
<li>Even with that boost, more than half of legacy applicants get rejection letters.</li>
<li>We don’t view the legacy portion of your application as a tipping point in any way during the RD round.</li>
<li>You need to be around the 50th%-tile academically to be a viable candidate; 25th%-tile isn’t going to cut it.</li>
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<p>In other words, if you had a reasonable chance of getting in anyway they’re willing to give you a big boost during ED, but if you don’t love them enough to make that commitment, don’t expect any help later. If you’re not “viable” they aren’t suddenly going to lower standards just because you’re a legacy. </p>
<p>The counselor also made it clear that the university was extremely thankful for my past gifts but they hoped I understood that they did not want to “disadvantage” the legacy applicants of less fortunate alums, so my generosity couldn’t be considered as part of the application process. I of course countered in a fairly loud conspiratorial whisper that if my son’s application met with a favorable outcome that I might be inclined to increase my annual donation to the 3-figure range. Enough said ;).</p>
<p>^lol. that made me laugh.</p>
<p>I think that 25% is more for athletes and URMS than it is for legacies.</p>
<p>Jonri,
I am not sure I agree with you at all. USNWR has had UVA at the #2 spot, and it’s lowest was #5, for Public U’s.</p>
<p>We have a friend who had donated for yrs (since they graduated 20+ yrs ago). Their child was a triple legacy…Grandparent, Father and Mother…all donors. The DD got a thin envelope, even though their stats were in line and above in some aspects. </p>
<p>It should be noted, that they were from NoVA which is incredibly competitive because UVA doesn’t want every student from NoVA, thus, diversity probably played into the equation. I am sure had she been from Newport News, she would have gotten the BFE.</p>
<p>That is also my point, colleges look and want diversity, especially State U’s your geographic location can be the reason for the Thanks, but no thanks letter and being a legacy didn’t help at all.</p>
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I do wonder about this–I suspect that rejecting a legacy applicant (at least one who’s the youngest in the family) would probably cut off a future stream of giving.</p>
<p>Of course rejecting legacies cuts off a stream of giving, or reduces it. But they can’t accept all the legacies. Having a legacy preference induces 20-30 years of giving from many alumni families, and if the disappointed ones (like me!) stop giving or dial back their giving considerably, there are always new alumni coming down the pipe to replace them. It’s in the college’s interest to have the strongest alumni corps possible, and you can’t get there by accepting every legacy.</p>
<p>Hunt, It may make a difference in the level of giving. At some price point the legacy applicant becomes a development applicant. Then they’re in a different bucket altogether. Legacies without a fairly large gifting history probably aren’t given too much of a tip at the most selective schools.</p>
<p>B&P: You missed the part of my post which said OOS–out of state students. Again, my understanding is that being a legacy doesn’t give a boost for in-state students. However, in choosing among OUT OF STATE students, legacy is taken into account.</p>
<p>OOPS!! Look like I’m wrong. Legacy helps in-state too.
<a href=“http://www.alumni.virginia.edu/admission/liaison/faq/default.aspx[/url]”>http://www.alumni.virginia.edu/admission/liaison/faq/default.aspx</a></p>
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<p>Funnnnnny. :D</p>
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<p>What a big shot YOU are! You meant three figures BEFORE the six zeroes, right?! </p>
<p>I think the hardest part about having a legacy kid apply (and believe me, we worked to actively dissuade him from that choice, but at the end of the day it had to be his decision) is that a rejection will have a different sting versus a rejection from a school with no emotional association.</p>
<p>This stuff really does vary by school. At Brown and MIT, siblings get legacy preference. (They may at other colleges too; I just know about those.) At some schools, e.g., UPenn, legacy only helps if you apply ED. At Stanford, even if you haven’t given a dime, your kid gets legacy preference if you have an UNDERGRADUATE degree from Stanford. </p>
<p>Bottom line: check out the rules of the particular college. </p>
<p>And the fact that someone who is a legacy doesn’t get in doesn’t mean there isn’t a legacy preference.</p>
<p>Maybe this is where our lines are getting crossed.</p>
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<p>It appears to me even UVA is stating legacy is not always going to be a factor in the decision process.</p>
<p>OOS and IS are very separate issues. I’d be the 1st to say, UVA legacy living in Idaho will probably have a better edge than the UVA legacy in MD. The reason goes back to diversity. The school wants to recruit applicants from across the globe. Every school has certain geographical pulls.</p>
<p>UMiami FL has a lot of NY/NJ/CT applicants. So does UMDCP. That means these areas are more competitive.</p>
<p>The UNCCH applicant will most likely apply to UVA due to the caliber of the school. UVA doesn’t want a majority of their OOS come from NC who would be IS for UNCCH, and vise a verse.</p>
<p>I do agree, there is no blanket answer, check out the school. Look at their admit stats because typically they will give the % of legacies admitted. From there do the math. If they have a 40% admit, but 60% for legacies, then there is your answer.</p>
<p>Coming at the topic from a different direction, I’m thinking of Liberal Arts Colleges that value “fit”, whose AdComs read essays with great care. and want to maintain or improve yield.</p>
<p>A legacy might have the advantage of a deep understanding of the school’s culture, after years of dinnertable talk about it. A student might know, hope or guess that it would be a great fit for his/her own strengths and personality. The visit might have a focus and enthusiasm that leads to positive identifications for the student that are authentic to that student (not just parroting the parent’s enthusiasm, in other words).</p>
<p>There the legacy advantage could be this: that student writes an essay that links himself accurately with what the school has to offer, and expresses how s/he could contribute to campus life if admitted.</p>
<p>That’s a qualitative way of saying that legacies have a boost: they understand the school deeply and can express it. </p>
<p>That said, any other student could also – through research, soul-searching, visiting and more – develop a similarly deep and convincing understanding of the same school. Also, a clueless legacy could totally misunderstand the school, or express unfounded cockiness…and blow the essay.</p>
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Tell me about it. It’s even worse when the older sibling is at the school. My D will probably be dealing with that risk next year.</p>
<p>B&P: I’m going to stop exchanging posts with you , but I suggest you reread what you’ve posted. It does NOT support your restatement. The part you’ve typed in bold modifies the phrase “UVa’s GRADUATE” schools, as the last sentence you’ve quoted makes abundantly clear. This thread is about legacy preferences in undergraduate admissions and I assure you that UVa most definitely gives them. </p>
<p>And there is a difference at UVa for undergraduate admissions between the kid applying from Idaho and the kid applying from Idaho who has parents who received UVa degrees. That’s a legacy preference.</p>
<p>You’re just plain wrong, IMO, when you say that in this economy, legacy will matter less. In this economy, the temptation is for public universities to give a greater preference to the children of alumni DONORS because they want to increase the amount they get from private sources. If parents know going in that giving money will NOT boost their kids’ chances at all, parents will give less money. (As JHS notes, when legacies don’t get in, many of their parent alumni stop giving.)</p>
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<p>I saw one of my good friends go through that with her younger D (older daughter attending a top 20 university and younger D was interested) and it was hell! This is the one advantage of twins!</p>
<p>Also, just be aware that some school have a courtesy waitlist for legacy applicants. They have no intention of ever taking the legacy kids they put on this waitlist off of it.</p>