Don't Have Money for Berkeley

Paying for College
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Suggested edit:

Hello -

My name is … and I was admitted for Fall 2017 as a freshman along with my twin sister, …
My twin sister and I were both accepted to Rochester which we are very excited about, and awarded merit scholarships as well as need based grants (very grateful for this). However, our parents cannot afford to send us to URochester at the current cost of $91,392 for the both of us annually; they have enough to send one of us but since we both want to attend, it would not be fair for them to slight one of us and pay for the other. Our conundrum is that either we both go or neither of us does. Is there a way for you to use professional judgement to take into account that we are twins, whose double costs fall upon the same person (our dad), rather than two individuals whose costs fall upon two separate families? We are definitely willing to do work study to help pay for this, obviously. Please consider that my father is close to retirement age (62) and the cost of living here in Hawaii is very high, making it difficult to meet the expected family contribution - this higher cost of living is indicated in the different thresholds used for Subsidized Lunches for instance. I am also aware that Rochester is a Yellow Ribbon school and was wondering if my dad’s retired military status would have any effect on the costs. Is there any way that the net cost of attendance for my sister and I to both attend Rochester could be lowered so we can both have the opportunity to attend such a great school? Thank You!
Best Regards,

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Private colleges that meet 100% need do not promise to meet FAFSA EFC. They meet “need” based on their own determination. Like most private colleges, Rochester uses the CSS Profile.

So the only “fantasy” is the apparent belief of @ClarinetDad16 that there is anything at all unusual about a financial aid award that requires families to pay more than their FAFSA EFC amount.

FAFSA EFC determines eligibility for federal aid – direct loans, work-study, and in appropriate cases, Pell grants. That is all.

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@jql2017 calmom is correct, calculations of “meet need” can differ between schools and I like @MYOS1634 edits, all of them (just add a couple of paragraph breaks).

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@MYOS1634 Thank you for the edits! I can’t believe I forgot to introduce myself. I am just going to change it a bit so it sounds like a 17 year old girl’s diction (ex. I’m sorry but I probably wouldn’t say conundrum lol-I know what it means and how to use it but I wouldn’t say it myself)

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@calmom Oh well I guess I will just have to try to convince Rochester I have more need than they previously determined…

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Basically that’s what 'professional judgement ’ means… 'take our special circumstances into account pretty please '.
:slight_smile:
However make sure your sister’s on board, as if UR changes your fa you will both have to go… Or both defer and/take a gap year and/or turn down the offer.

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Yes my sister is onboard with appealing the FA at Rochester, and we will most likely end up at the same college now that Cal is out of the question and our options are the same

I wonder if we can save money rooming together and not in the dorms maybe after our first year

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Good luck with the Rochester negotiations.

As I mentioned above @ClarinetDad16 a $190,000 a year income would likely yielded an EFC in the 70,000 or close range. Remember that at Profile schools (and Rochester is one) the EFC is not divided 50/50. Each student would be at 60% of the EFC. The Rochester award probably meets their need…when you add in their 529, etc.

But definitely this should be asked.

Did Rochester ask for non-custodial parent Profile…? Or did you both get a waiver for this?

And please…contact your dad ASAP about his veterans benefits.

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You may need your sister on the phone with you when talking with the FA officer. Don’t think they will discuss her aid with you unless she somehow gives permission. Plus having you both on the phone allows her to hear the same thing you do - and being on the same page is crucial if you’re going to make this work.

Good luck

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@cap

Can you explain the veterans benefits??

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Parent of a URochester student here. Some info regarding Rochester you should consider:

  • Rochester requires you to live on campus for the first two years.
  • If you plan on staying on campus during breaks, the dining halls have horrible hours or are closed. It was a big surprise to us as my kid stayed his first Thanksgiving there and had to leave campus for food. -The gray, rainy days ended up affecting my kid more so than the snow/cold. It gets very cold, windy and rains a lot!

Regarding financial need:
Remember tuition and room/board will go up every year. With increases for next year, tuition, r/b, and mandatory fees your total would be over 67,000. Minus your 24,000 aid that leaves too much gap.

Rochester is a fine school, but not for that amount of debt.

When oldest kid was a senior at a true ‘meets full need’ school the same year our youngest was a freshman at Rochester, Rochester was double the price of other school. Still a good deal for us, but nowhere close in price.

  • @ClarinetDad16 , Rochester hasn't been a meets full need school for the last 2 years. It meets a decent amount of need, but hasn't been on any 'meet full need list' since we started looking at the school in 2014.
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If your dad didn’t transfer GI benefits before retiring, the GI Bill and Yellow Ribbon are moot points. Guessing from his rank and age he possibly/probably retired before the dependent transfer went into effect in 2009. If he hasn’t mentioned them to you, then I doubt it is an option. When did he retire?

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This story is crazy. Dad is near retirement age (Dad is NOW 62 and will retire in about 8 years at 70), and then HIS income will drop considerably…but he’ll still have this huge mortgage and huge debt from sending twins to pricy schools.

And altho dad has said he won’t retire until he’s 70, who knows what health issue might pop up to change that.

BTW…I wonder what college DAD went to?

Can the student tell us where DAD went to college???

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I want to say something about UAH…

While it may appear that many are instate, let me tell you about the area that draws many students …Madison County…

Madison County is home to Cummings Research Park, the 2nd largest research park in the nation. Many Fortune 500 companies there. It’s also home to Redstone Arsenal…a large Army base.

The students who go to UAH are largely from (or their parents are from) other states. Madison county is full of transplants from all over the country. Few people are “from there.”

so, even if a student is “instate”, likely their roots are from Calif, Maryland, Missouri, Illinois, Ohio, PA, Mass or some other state and their parents’ employer moved the company to Cummings Research Park…so the family moved.

Huntsville and Madison County are not “southern areas”. In fact, when I moved there I remarked how much it was like my hometown in Orange County California.

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If the email is not yet sent, I’d just advise simplifying into paragraphs, each making its point. When a reader can easily comprehend (both the situation and what you’re asking for, ) they can more easily judge what they need to -and can - do.

The basics are: both excited, both interested, the cost is a challenge, can anything be done? And that you will call. Close with a positive. (“Sandwich technique.” Positive, issue, positive.) It should be concise.

In Professional Judgement, they can bend some rules if they are somewhat consistent in how they do, when they do, for other kids in a similar position. Eg, for multiples and/or how they revise income, etc.

I’d also be sure to introduce yourselves as Mary and Sue, from xxx, HI. (This both reminds them of this detail, up front, helps id you in their minds, and that by winning you, they get 2 with this geo diversity. All you say is from HI, not the selling detail. )

Don’t be afraid to speak with them.

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The point some were trying to make is that there are public schools, like UAH, UA, that offer huge merit scholarships, full tuition or more, for high stats OOS students. The students will still have high stat peers in the honors college, but they have a great chance of getting great opportunities because they are some of the top students in the school.

Need based aid at other schools probably won’t get the price down much below $30K because of the EFC. There is a NCP in the picture too which might require waivers.

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Just popping in to advise you to definitely NOT include this. You’re basically saying there’s a perfectly fine affordable option available for both of you (going instate). Rochester will just say, ok great, stay instate then. They won’t care that it’s not “fair.”

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Maybe exercise your imagination, look at the following link, and find a school that might work for you:

http://wue.wiche.edu/search_results.jsp?searchType=all

I’m not going to do the research but I’d guess some places have rollling admissions.

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OP I do feel for you and your twin.

I have a significant amount of family in Hawaii and also have an office there and understand where you are coming from. My family is in academia and while most of them have done undergrad on the mainland, some have come back for undergrad and several have gotten their masters at UH. There is a significant pressure to go to the mainland for college, however there are plenty of acceptable schools that would be far better financial fits without the sting of UH. Also, west coast in general will save a small fortune on flights with smart planning. Berkeley and UW are not options and frankly I personally don’t think Rochester is either. At the end of the day, your education is what you make it but I very well understand the expectation and pressure to go “anywhere” else.

That said. I would really consider the gap year concept proposed by so many, regardless of your tiger mom’s feelings. My niece just headed back to UH after a year in Portland and I had several college friends at UW (my alma mater) who had a very hard transition. Rochester, which is your best of very bad options, will be an incredibly difficult transition for both of you. The flight costs will also most likely exceed the $2500 budget you have given for yourself. Given the time of year of travel (peak) your flight costs will be $800-1600 per trip, times 2 and then plus any other personal expenses you may have. It is unrealistic to think there will be zero on top of flights.

If you were to take a gap year you could both work and save. With an EFC of 34k, your earnings really will not change your picture at all beyond no longer qualifying for a subsidized loan, they will all be unsubsidized. Both of you need merit monies, not need based. You should be targeting schools that will give you full tuition awards and both of you have the stats for it. If you are able to do that, then combined with what your parents can actually contribute without 200K in loans, then you’ll be in a much better place for grad school. You need to look beyond ivy and OOS prestige schools to privates and schools in the 50-100 range to get the larger awards and be strategic about it. Very good school at an affordable price is a much better life plan for all of you. Do look at what is open come the May list as there may be something worth going after.

Rochester did meet your full need, they assume you will take $5500 in loans and consider that “offer” as part of meeting need.

While I understand where your parents are coming from, 200K in loans WILL delay or rob from their retirement, the payments on those loans are not sustainable, nor are they payments you’ll be able to afford regardless of whether or not you go to grad school. Your dad is robbing his retirement with this plan even if he doesn’t see that now. Some loan, some debt, can be manageable for many families. This is not.

By all means appeal the Rochester offer but you really do have better long term options if you take a gap year and start from scratch. I personally think that’s a better option for your goals and “fit” than considering UAH at this point which I know lots are suggesting but you’ll have many more options going the gap or spring admit route.

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Yes Rochester asked for a non-custodial parent waiver, and my counselor says it was sent, but this morning my sister received an email from our financial adviser saying that they did not receive my sister’s non custodial form. I have no idea why since my counselor says they were faxed at the same time (and why they need two copies of the same form is beyond me).

Email is not sent yet.