<p>intparent
</p>
<p>I was aware of it. There is solid research that a certain percentage of the population is genetically incapable of properly processing THC (which, even in those able to handle it, sticks around in fat cells for up to two years). With their first toke, many are headed on a path which can bring them to amotivational syndrome (which can present much like the negative traits of schizophrenia), psychosis, and potentially to schizophrenia itself.</p>
<p>I agree that deaths from car accidents have declined in the past 20 or so years. On the news this morning, I heard that traffic fatalities in 2010 were the lowest since 1949.</p>
<p>I do think that the increased drinking age is responsible for some of this, but there are other factors, such as increased use of seatbelts and enforcement of seatbelt laws, the widespread use of airbags in vehicles and cars with built-in crumple zones. As for drinking and driving, back in the '70’s and even early '80’s, I don’t remember too many people thinking twice about this. I don’t recall designated drivers before the mid-80’s (when I was generally the one designated!)</p>
<p>My SD did away with homecoming and an activity involving girls and sports that my DD called “Sluts and their momma sluts on parade” a couple of years ago. At both activities, there were kids found drunk at school or just outside the grounds (sitting in a car by the back field, for example). The administration tried to get students and parents to sign a no drinking or drugs contract with a lengthy suspension and disciplinary record as the consequence. The PARENTS refused to sign because they didn’t want to interfere with their children’s “fun!” The school’s response was to cancel the events, which punished the innocent who were willing to sign but prevented the drunken outbursts and episodes of 911 having to respond to alcohol intoxication calls…</p>
<p>The SD also has a prom which the senior parents run. It is held at a local country club. The afternoon before the party, the security force of volunteer parents and local cops scour the area to find where kids have sneaked on and hidden their beers, etc. Sadly, they find a lot, but I think they must miss some. </p>
<p>Of course, HS is different from college.</p>
<p>I do agree with the poster who mentioned the maturity levels of kids. My oldest child is almost 21. Although he is not the most mature kid for his age, he is far more mature than he was at 17 or 18. He is looking forward to his 21st birthday present from his dad - a brandy snifter with a sip of brandy in it. He doesn’t drink or do drugs but is interested in tasting brandy in a snifter. We are trying to figure out how to orchestrate this while staying at a Boy Scout camp to take his little brother home! He said he’d wait a day or two. </p>
<p>My D at 19 is also so much more mature than in HS. She is an RA and has told me horror stories of underage drinking. She has been called in the middle of the night and told that there is a kid outside the dorm lying drunk on the ground. The other kids will bring a drunk kid and dump them and then call the RA because the RA has to respond and will not get in trouble. The dorms are card-controlled so they won’t even put the kid in the lounge because they’re afraid they’ll get caught. They call my D because she has the reputation of not being a drinker or druggie so everyone knows admin will not put her in trouble. She is just terrified that some kid is going to die and she’s going to see it.</p>
<p>As for the OP, I would not be happy that my child had a phony ID. It is a federal offense to have one and even though he wasn’t using it at that time to commit a crime, it is still problematic. I think the Dean’s response showed pragmatism but I would be concerned that my child would now be on a watch list. I would also make sure the ID was shredded and I would probably search their room at home for contraband at this point. There is no point to phony ID other than underage drinking.</p>
<p>Here’s a more balanced view. [Drinking</a> Age ProCon.org](<a href=“Should the Drinking Age Be Lowered in the US? 13 Pros and Cons”>Should the Drinking Age Be Lowered in the US? 13 Pros and Cons)</p>
<p>Studies about “secondary students” is a study about high school students, not college students. There is a reason that college presidents would like to see the drinking age raised. The binge drinking, which is the deadly drinking, is directly related to the illegality of social drinking for a sophomore in college.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.usatoday.com/news/education/2008-08-18-college-drinking_N.htm[/url]”>http://www.usatoday.com/news/education/2008-08-18-college-drinking_N.htm</a></p>
<p>From the article:</p>
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</p>
<p>The other side, in the interest of fairness:</p>
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<p>Also, you will note that the drinking laws only raise the drinking and driving problems to the 21 year old group, who is more like to have access to a car.</p>
<p>coleytown…re apology from RM…how about…" gee i’m sorry my actions caused such distress to you and your family." seems an appropriate response to me…agree though that he may need time</p>
<p>You have to be careful about statistics used to prove a case, as Twain said there are lies, damned lies and statistics…</p>
<p>One of the problems with statistics about teen drinking and driving is that the raise in drinking age came about in a time when drunk driving itself became a cause celebre (and rightfully so). I am in my late 40’s and was on a rescue squad as a late teen, so I saw the consequences of drunk driving and also know what the environment was like. It was a different era so it is hard to compare or make cause and effect relationships because a lot changed, there wasn’t just making the drinking age 21.Here are my observations, for what they are worth.</p>
<p>-I have heard only anecdotal stats, but from what I have heard the problem with teens drinking and driving was prevalent before the 18 year old drinking age happened (many places had 21 drinking ages before the adoption of the right of 18 year olds to drink and also the legal change to where 18 was the age of majority). When I was on a rescue squad in the late 70’s/early 80s,. there were people who had been on the rig starting in the 50’s, and they told me they routinely used to deal with crashes from kids drinking and driving, that it wasn’t something new. Obviously, not a broad based stat, but still</p>
<p>-The change in drinking age came about in the 80’s, it went to 19 when I was 19 and I believe went to 21 when i was 21 (yep, just checked…blame me). some of the stats I saw cite from 2000 to 2010, which is almost 15 years after the law passed. It would be more relevent to compare let’s say the 5 year period before the law went into effect and after, to see direct impact (so 1979-1984 and 1985-1990). Not saying it didn’t help, just saying stats can be twisted</p>
<p>-The other factor is that the culture around drinking and driving changed across the board. Watch tv these days and what do you see commercials for? Designated drivers, and it is not uncommon to see these in beer commercials and hard liquor ads. There is a reason for that, liquor companies, partially because they fear lawsuits, and partially because they realize drunk driving accidents give them bad pr, push this. The no drinking and driving message is emphasized, it most assuredly wasn’t 20 or 30 years ago. </p>
<p>-Parents have also wised up with teen drinking and driving, besides the stepped up enforcement of no drinking with teens, many places have parents and school officials smart enough to realize it still will go on, and they have in effect a taxi cab service, that if a kid is drunk and thinks he can’t get drive, they can call and get a ride home. Despite the complaints from the ‘anti crowd’, who as expected claimed this would make kids drink knowing they could get ride, the reality is they are going to drink, and if they didn’t have a ride, they would drink and drive…</p>
<p>-One of the key factors the statistics jockeys leave out is that penalties for drunk driving, for teens and adults, went through the roof, and on top of that, there has been a major push against drunk driving. Whereas in my day a kid stopped for drunk driving would probably get their keys taken away by the cops and made to call the parents or a drunk adult would have the keys taken away and told to call someone, they got serious with the penalties. These days, the penalty for drinking and driving is stiff in many places, and for teens it can mean losing their driving privileges, something that didn’t happen in my day.</p>
<p>And because of this, drunk driving these days is not a casual thing, and few would laugh it off, as they did in my era. I can remember my parents talking about friends or relatives who had been bombed and drove, or even when they got picked up for drunk driving and later on complaining when under the new rules someone they knew got picked up and faced real consequences. I remember quite well going out to lunch with my dad and some friends from where they worked (these were all engineer types), when I was in college, and them talking about a coworker who had driven drunk and ended up killing someone and was charged with vehicular homicide, and they were upset, not that he drank and drive and killed someone, but that the penalty was so stiff for ‘an accident’, and that was not uncommon. </p>
<p>I am not sure where I stand with the 21 drinking age,while if it is protecting teens from driving while drunk or hurting themselves, I am all in favor of it (since I saw the grisly outcome), but I also have problems with it in that people think this has ‘solved’ a problem, which to me is kids not learning to handle alcohol responsibly and when given the chance, in college and as young adults, I see the result of it. Friend of mine’s child is going to a school you would expect would not have these kinds of problems, and in the first month or two they had close to 10 kids sent to hospitals with alcohol poisoning (actually not that surprising, many of the students come from backgrounds where alcohol was a ‘no no’, lot of religious objections and cultural ones). The real answer to this isn’t drinking ages, it is having a rational discussion about it. Like with sex, many parents have a hard time dealing with their kids growing up IMO, so they choose to ignore it or just say “just say no”, and when the kid has a modicum of freedom, hell can break loose. I would prefer to see where kids are brought up where alcohol is a fact of life, like crossing the street safely, and they are introduced to it in a controlled way, under the guidance of parents or whatever, rather then sneaking off with friends with the ‘taboo’ juice and the like, not knowing the limits or reality of drinking. </p>
<p>Reading the federal law, it does give latititude in many states with private drinking by underage kids, but in reality it isn’t that simple. When my S was little, maybe 5 or 6, we had gone to a liquor store to buy some stuff for visiting relatives, and my son was helping push the shopping cart, and the store owner had kinipshins, because he could loose his liquor license if an ABC person saw that, and underage kid even touching a cart carrying liquor…and I don’t live in the bible belt someplace, this is reputedly liberal NJ…and I have heard similar tales, where they had fits if for example the parent and a young child were in a store and the child touched something alcoholic, and that tells a lot of the problem, that it isn’t just safeguarding children, it is treating alcohol as a mythical demon rather then what it is, something that needs to be dealt with.</p>
<p>I’m very happy to see that Graham Spanier, president of Penn State, is not on the signatory list of the Amethyst Initiative.</p>
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</p>
<p>I don’t know what you consider to be “stiff” but personally I don’t believe the penalties are harsh enough. A lot of the ones I read in the paper get probation and a fine. But then many of the other violations get dropped at the same time. For example: person gets pulled over for speeding and is found to be DWI. They go to court and are found guilty of DUI and get probation and a fine. But the original charge, the speeding, gets dropped. I say make it hurt. They made a stupid decision; make them pay for it. </p>
<p>Meanwhile, we have a 19-year old kid awaiting vehicular manslaughter because he misjudged a turn at a stoplight and killed the passenger in his car. He made a mistake and will face a much harsher punishment than one who made a conscious decision…</p>
<p>It’s a strange world isn’t it…I was at the grocery store a few years ago and my 16 year old at the time son reached to grab a 12 pk of NA beer and a 12 pk of soda that I had bought so I could carry the bag out to the car. The store owner grabbed the N/A beer case from my son and said he couldn’t carry it to the car even though I was with him and even though it was non-alchoholic beer. The world has gotten horribly absurd and something is very wrong. Regarding statistics…I’m in marketing and you can make statistics do pretty much what you want to do so I tend to take blanket statements about statistics with a grain of salt at first blush. </p>
<p>I’m all “for” harsh penalities for driving drunk and totally “for” going back to a drinking age of 18 or 19 or better yet a graduated drinking system like graduated driving. In my opinion changing the age to 21 simply exchanged one problem for another and put all college administrators in a very problematic position.</p>
<p>I’m all “for” harsh penalities for driving drunk and totally “for” going back to a drinking age of 18 or 19 or better yet a graduated drinking system like graduated driving. In my opinion changing the age to 21 simply exchanged one problem for another and put all college administrators in a very problematic position. </p>
<p>Exaxtly.</p>
<p>Re: the fake id - this became a law after 9/11. Fake ID’s can be used by terrorists and others with nefarious goals to board planes, open bank accounts, etc. The only way to put the fake ID people out of business is to heavily criminalize the possession of fake ids.</p>
<p>I’m not a pollyanna, I know college kids drink. But frankly, purchasing a fake ID is stupid. I don’t see that any 19 year old is prohibited from doing anything they truly need to do to have fun if they don’t have a fake ID.</p>
<p>As for campus police not being city police - depends on the college. At my D’s college the campus and town police are one and the same. The kids and parents are told that at orientation. </p>
<p>The courts have ruled that high schools have the right to search lockers. I would think dorm rooms fall under the same type of guidelines. They are owned by the college, and I’m sure the housing agreement states that rooms can be searched.</p>
<p>Any kid who is smart enough and works hard enough to get a large scholarship should also be smart enough not to break the law out in the open. He should also be smart enough to read the student handbook, and the information that he received when he got his scholarship, and know the consequences for breaking the rules. He should be smart enough to figure out that assuming the rules won’t be enforced, or that he won’t be punished because he’s a “good” kid is a large and dangerous assumption to make.</p>
<p>A scholarship is a gift. It comes with strings attached. Keep up your GPA and don’t break the rules. If you value it, you will follow the rules. If not, do not be surprised when it is revoked.</p>
<p>OP, I do feel sad for your S’s roommate but I hope this is a huge valuable life lesson to him.</p>
<p>Actions have consequences. Kids need to learn that yes, the rules DO apply to me, and they need to learn it sooner rather than later.</p>
<p>kayf
I would hope that any thinking person would shove a fire hose into someone’s hand if their house was on fire, instead of putting an arm around them and handing them a beer. Many on here felt the house on fire metaphor fit, and that the “wait another day” scenario does not apply. The real friend when your house is on fire is the one with the hose.</p>
<p>@YankeeBelle I can understand not wanting to have your daughter be tagged with a “snitch” tag and I do not blame you. I would either make an anonymous call to the principal, but I would name names. I do not know all of the circumstances surrounding what happened but an older kid passing out drugs to younger kids just does not sit well with me and as an adult, I could not sit still for it. But if you are not comfortable with that maybe you can just make a call and say you heard that some kids were doing drugs and it included freshman and you are concerned. </p>
<p>I can understand why you would not want to get involved, but feel some sense of responsibility because of what you have been told. Other parents and other kids know what has happened and others might call also. I know this is not an easy decision for you to make so good luck with whatever you decide to do.</p>
<p>YankeeBelle I can understand your wanting to prevent your child from backlash, but if no one tells what they know then this situation will NOT stop. Someone has to stand up to it. This is how these situations go on and on… and when someone ends up hurt in a car wreck or in the hospital with an O.D. and you knew about the situation and did nothing, how will you feel? </p>
<p>I strongly believe you need to make a report to the principal. Do it anonymously if you need to.</p>
<p>There are no “innocent bystanders” if someone knows that someone else is doing something harmful and fails to take action to try to stop it. Aren’t we PARENTS? Isn’t it time for the adults to start acting like ADULTS instead of teens who want to be in the popular crowd? </p>
<p>I know you are concerned for your daughter and for this being blamed on her. I truly understand that. Perhaps there are other parents “in the know” as well and you can go together. If not, please make an anonymous report. If this situation is as commonly known as it sound, the perpetrators will be unable to figure out who the “snitch” was.</p>
<p>Spidey, </p>
<p>If a house is on fire, action must.must be taken IMMEDIATELY. Or the house will burn.</p>
<p>Here, OP was in no need of a immediate morals lecture. The advice people gave her to be contrite, be warned and listen was immediate. Not the other stuff. The other stuff could be dealt with over time. </p>
<p>I dont buy your analogy. I believe that there is a time and place for everything. This wasnt it.</p>
<p>YankeeBelle, I think that you need to do something, just in case this tale is true. But, especially since it is hearsay–and may well have undergone significant exaggeration on its way to you–I would not rush to inform authorities who would be required to take official action. I would instead contact the parents of the kids who supposedly distributed pills, and the parents of your D’s friend. After talking to them, I might consider contacting some parents of freshmen, especially if you know any even slightly.</p>
<p>For all you know, the miscreants may have distributed baby aspirin or vitamins and tried to prank the freshmen. A very, very dumb thing to do, but probably not worthy, IMHO of the possible “one-size-fits-all” penalties attending distribution of “drugs.” They may also have made the whole thing up. It seems far-fetched to think that kids would actually take the risk of distributing real “pills”–uppers or downers or whatever–to a bunch of freshmen. (I devoutly hope so, anyway.) Let their parents have a chance to deal with it first…and try to get their parents to understand why it is important that your D and friend not be identified as the source of information.</p>
<p>I would require some kind of checking back with you after the parents investigate. If they don’t, or if you get the feeling that it isn’t being taken with appropriate seriousness, then reconsider reporting it to the principal.</p>
<p>Re apology from roommate:</p>
<p>After reading this entire thread, I have a feeling that if things had been the other way around, Coleytown and her husband are the type of parents who would have insisted that their son call his roommate, and possibly roommate’s parents) to apologize for getting him mixed up in all this. Maybe not immediately, but certainly within a few days. On the other hand, I think Coleytown’s son is the type of person who would have already apologized, without his parents needing to tell him to.</p>
<p>kayf -</p>
<p>Let it go. No one gave a morals lecture. That is a matter of opinion. The OP received the advice that different people on here felt she needed at a critical time. The analogy is sound (I would have been shocked if you finally let this go and admitted you were wrong, of course). Keep on policing the free speech here and evaluating other people’s input, if you wish. Continue lobbing judgmental jabs about other people’s viewpoints and how they choose to help. It certainly isn’t bothering me. It is amusing to watch someone do the very thing they accuse others of doing.</p>
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<p>How does she know it was drugs? Somebody told her child this story. She wasn’t there neither was her child. What can the school do realistically if someone calls and says they heard from their child who heard from another child that something was going on? An anonymous phone call…really?? Call the parents or call the band director (I don’t remember if it was a band trip) but for heavens sake don’t make an anonymous call.</p>
<p>Kids use IDs other than their own to go to bars. I know many of them use their friends real IDs who look like them, and sometimes resemblance is not always that similar. Most college bars will let them in with any ID. When caught with someone else’s ID by the authority, “I was carrying it for my friend,” “My friend must have accidentally left it here.” Most of those kids know at this point not to use a fake ID.</p>
<p>Elemenope
He could be telling the truth. Still, if son says he was unaware that roommate was using and storing, it is highly unlikely he is telling the truth. If DS says that RM smokes pot, but he does not, he is also probably not telling the truth (note that I said probably, and not definitely). </p>
<p>Oldfort is right that most kids know that using a fake ID can be a huge problem. I only assume this because I asked my youngest, who is way too young to be in that game but even he knew about it. OK, so the kid took the risk. Note some risk taking. Regarding the RM…Many people smoke some pot here or there (I do not condone it). But smoking it out in the open is a bigger red flag, as is having a personal supply stored away and hanging out with someone who has syringes in their room. Deans do not often catch people getting high. You kind of need to be up close to know that is going on. When searching a room to investigate a student (and coming across an ID in the other kid’s name), why even check the information on it? Why zero in on that at all? And the crazy searching-like-it’s-a-murder-scene upending of the room? Something about all of this isn’t sounding totally right. What I am alluding to is that there may have been a report of some sort, or some investigation going on. Perhaps.</p>
<p>The Dean’s “apology” is also noteworthy, in that it is unlikely she really believes a roommate (and friend - important distinction) is unaware and not participating. School officials in these situations are sadly often much less concerned about the health and welfare of the individual students involved, and more focused on PR, legal issues, community rules, and the like. For example, school officials will “watch” a kid over time and try to create a case or ensnare more participants. All the while the original subject may be in a critical health situation where timing is everything (literally life or death). Parents are told so little, and really need to believe nothing of what they hear and half of what they see. </p>
<p>There may be more to this than a nice 3.9 gpa roommate who just smokes pot once in a while and got caught. Maybe. And BTW…OD statistics include high gpa kids who “just” drank or smoked pot, but once in a while (or even one time!) tried methadone, oxy, ectasy, or the like. </p>
<p>It is highly likely that none of this will amount to any more than what it is. Still, every time one of these situations happens, parents need to respond as if they do not know and cannot know whether or not they have a bigger issue on their hands. This does not mean freaking out, it just means taking logical steps to lesson the chance of worse case scenarios.</p>
<p>What to do next…An alcohol and drug assessment by a professional is in order, as is some education on the subject (maybe this is what the school required as part of the punishment, but I would make sure it is done by a highly qualified professional). It cannot hurt. Repeat: Is this likely a non-issue? Yes, it is likely a non-issue. Still, the potential danger of what it would mean if there were more to this cannot be ignored. </p>
<p>The reality that DS was one person removed from a kid with syringes in his room cannot be ignored, even if it probably means nothing. Mom and Dad have ample reason to prohibit DS from rooming again with this particular student. Another consequence, yes, but a reasonable and natural one.</p>
<p>If associating with drug users continues, random drug testing may be called for in return for financial support. If DS is a “norm”, there is little family history of addiction, and there are no other red flags, this may be overkill. But if there is a family history, and there are other red flags, it may be a good thing to consider.</p>