<p>Hey guys! So I am currently in law school, but after a few semesters I’ve realized I started down the wrong path. I originally went to law school to pursue intellectual property law, but my interest in that subject matter has steeply decreased, while my love for math has remained. Thus, I’ve decided to drop out and enter a math PhD program, something which I find really exciting. I majored in math in college / did research as an undergraduate, and my dad is a math professor, so I feel like I know to some degree what I’m getting into.</p>
<p>Of course, I understand the arguments against this choice (think of the debt and the job market!), but I know I’ll regret it for the rest of my life if I don’t do it. My question concerns my dropping out of law school. How will graduate committees consider this choice? The law school is highly ranked, and I have average grades here. Am I right in assuming that math graduate programs won’t care at all about any of this? I didn’t fail any of my classes and I have an obvious interest in math. I also plan on supplementing my math major with a few classes before I apply, as I feel like I’m missing a couple core courses from my undergraduate days and I need time to take the GREs anyway. I’ve heard that committees care about LORs, math grades / GREs, and research, so if all that stuff is in order, I assume that my time in law school will have no impact on my chances of admission. </p>
<p>Thanks to anyone who can provide some insight. Just trying to figure out exactly how I’m going to proceed with all of this!</p>
<p>As long as you were in good shape when you left, I do not think it will matter - the degrees are so different that they will really only care about things that suggest fundamental questions about your basic scholarship and integrity.</p>
<p>Have you considered doing a joint degree, or finishing your JD and then doing the PhD? It seems a shame to waste the time and money you have already spent, especially since you apparently need some time before applying to PhD programs anyway - if you are a 1L now, you could finish your 2L or even your full JD before you would even be able to start your PhD. Plus, many law schools have options where you can do a joint JD/PhD, allowing you to complete your dream degree (the math PhD) and finish your more lucrative degree (the IP JD) within a relatively short period of time and (if you start it soon) no interruption. Plus, many of those programs actually expect or require that you apply to the PhD during law school, so you would be perfectly competitive.</p>
<p>You might find that having both degrees (since you have the aptitude if not the interest) will be a big boon in life. A few years ago I had a chance to talk to a guy who had a PhD in electrical engineering and a JD focused on patent law. He did the JD first, spent a few years working as a patent attorney, opened his own small firm, and then got the PhD. He is now spends most of his time as a professor at a major university, and runs the law firm (primarily in a managerial role) on the side - he gets to do what he loves AND makes a TON of money!</p>
<p>Thanks for such a lengthy and thoughtful reply. Addressing some of your concerns below:</p>
<p>While a joint JD / PhD is not incredibly uncommon, very few schools offer the math PhD / JD combo because the two degrees are so different. The school I attend does not; I actually investigated this option a few months ago because I was curious about switching to such a program. In addition, the graduate math program at the university I’m attending is really good. I probably wouldn’t be able to be accepted, especially considering the fact that I still need to take one or two classes to have a decent shot at a decent PhD program. </p>
<p>So the other option is finishing my JD and then doing my PhD, but I think this is actually not such a good idea for several reasons. First, I attend a very expensive law school with (some) financial aid. I will be something like $200k grand in the tank if I finish, which is no small potatoes to be sure. Second, while it’s probably true that a JD is more lucrative than a PhD in math, you need to enter the corporate world through interviews directly after your first year of law school (I’m currently a 2L) in order to land a really high paying job. Unfortunately, when I was interviewing for those jobs, I had little to no motivation to show that I cared about any of the firms because I DIDN’T care about them. I think that if I had managed to land one of those jobs despite my apathy, I would probably just do it for a few soul-crushing years and then leave the job and go get my math PhD without debt. However, I didn’t land one of those jobs, so it feels like the smart move is to leave law school and go tackle a PhD now. I’ll actually initially be taking a “leave of absence,” so if I suddenly decide that I’ve made a terrible mistake and that I can’t live without law, then I’ll be able to reverse my steps. </p>
<p>Finally, while the guy you talked to seems to have a pretty sweet life, having a PhD in EE is a lot different than math. You actually can’t really do patent law (or at least patent litigation) with any kind of math degree (BS or PhD); you need a degree in some kind of science (engineering, chemistry, or biology especially) or a ton of coursework in those fields to even take the patent bar. This irritated me to no end when I was still considering a career in IP law. A combination degree like JD / PhD in EE is something highly sought out and useful in the legal world, so I’m not surprised that the guy you met is doing so well. Finally, I don’t think I want to multitask like the guy you met; math is what I love, and it’s what I want to spend all of my time doing (besides family, friends, and all that jazz, of course). You might ask me then why I even decided to go to law school, and I would respond, “I made a mistake.” :)</p>
<p>Cut your losses, and put everything you got into getting a math Ph.D. As you’ve said, you made a mistake. You’ll just end up hating working as a lawyer and will quit the first time your boss scolds you. Your heart is just not in it.</p>
<p>You have a mathematician in the family so I am not going to lecture you on anything math-related. However, one thing you said struck me:</p>
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<p>May I ask what sort of math you saw as an undergraduate? I am a graduate student in math and I found grad-level math to be rather different from undergraduate-level math. I would be a bit concerned that you might regret your decision to ditch law and go back to mathematics if that decision was based on point-set topology and a first course in abstract algebra.</p>
<p>I appreciate your concern. I certainly won’t pretend to understand the ins-and-outs of graduate work, but I think I have at least a decent idea going in. My brother is currently getting his PhD in math as well, so we’ve talked about his coursework and I’ve gotten a taste of what it’s like. While I was an undergraduate, I did research in knot theory, and I have experience with topology, as well as PDEs and complex/real analysis. My background in algebra is admittedly a little weak, so that’s why I’m planning on taking a couple courses to beef up my application before I apply. I’m going to try to take as advanced courses as possible to further cement in my mind that this is the right choice. And, of course, my dad is a math professor so I grew up with the stuff and I’ve talked to him about his work at length. Of course, I’m sure that I won’t know quite what it’s like until I really step into the graduate school environment, but I’ve loved math for as long as I can remember, and I feel like I’ve stepped enough into advanced work to have a decent idea of what I’m getting myself into.</p>
<p>It is definitely possible to switch successfully, and you just have to make it clear via your application that you really want to pursue that PhD.</p>
<p>Please do be careful, though - b@r!um is correct that math you pursue from now on might be different. You seem to know a thing or two about what you are getting into, though. Of course, needless to say, a career in academia is something nearly nobody should count on. If there is no way you could spend those years better for your future (as opposed to merely the present), go for it.</p>
<p>“In addition, the graduate math program at the university I’m attending is really good. I probably wouldn’t be able to be accepted, especially considering the fact that I still need to take one or two classes to have a decent shot at a decent PhD program”
You were accepted to one graduate school program at your U- why dont you at least 1] ask the dean of graduate education if you can take the math classes you need there? And then 2] ask the graduate math admission dept if they would consider your application for the math PHD program if you end up taking some UG math classes there?</p>
<p>You’re a 2L. Given that it’s December, I’m assuming that you are halfway through your second year. I’m also assuming that you are planning to wait until next year, since a lot of math programs’ deadlines are either past or coming up too soon to adequately prepare an application from scratch, especially if you still need some classes. That means you won’t be applying until next fall, when (if you stayed in law school) you’d be a 3L - and you’d not be attending until the fall of 2013, when you’d be finished the JD anyway.</p>
<p>I mean, I’ve definitely heard of the sunk cost fallacy - there’s no reason to sink another ~$80K (or perhaps ~$120K if you plan to drop out before your second semester) if you hate being in law school and hate the idea of being a lawyer. And if math research is really your passion and you know what you’re getting yourself into - go for it. There’s no reason to waste time in doing something you dislike when you could be doing something you are really passionate about, and there’s little point to spending more money in finishing the degree if you don’t plan to use it.</p>
<p>But yeah, your law school experience should have very little impact on your application to math PhD programs.</p>