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</p>
<p>I think that it’s unlikely that this case will have the effect of encouraging false accusations of sexual violence. A more likely result is that young women who in fact have been victimized will now be even less willing to come forward, out of fear that they will not be believed. False accusations cast a long shadow.</p>
<p>^^I disagree with epistrophy, at least in <em>this</em> particular case. Though I think that in general, false accusations have that effect, in THIS case, I think the lesson learned is that even if your accusation is completely and totally false, you can wreak UNTOLD havoc on a man’s life and cost him both financially and emotionally. This would appeal to someone out for revenge, such as a scorned lover. Just go after people with lots to lose. :(</p>
<p>berurah-
Thanks for posting that letter. As you know our sons will be attending Duke in the fall. We will be at Duke this Monday - so looking forward to feeling the energy that I have always felt on that campus. In response to Primetime, at no time did my H and I and more importantly, our sons question or doubt their desire to attend this great university. Unfortunately there were mistakes made along the way, as the AG said, there are apologies that should be made. First and foremost by Nifong and his assistants who sat idly by as he railroaded these young men. However, I will not disparage an entire university and all of its faculty for the actions of a few. I ask you, in all honesty, if your son had the credentials to apply to Duke, could you honestly take that dream away from? Or, allow him, as we are hoping our sons will be when they get there, a part of the solution.</p>
<p>proudinnj~</p>
<p>EXCELLENT post, and I agree with you 100%, especially about this:
My communications with my son a year ago made me realize that what was seen in the press coverage at the time did not accurately reflect the views of the majority of Duke students around these events. Everyone my son knew presumed innocence and took a rational “wait and see” approach. This should have been mirrored by the remainder of the Duke community, but as soozie so aptly pointed out above, the Duke administration was damned if it did and damned if it didn’t. At the rate that some were calling for the heads of everyone involved (including the coach and Brodhead), there is simply NO WAY that everyone could be pleased with ANY decision.</p>
<p>proud, I am looking forward to your sons joining my son next year as part of the Duke family. And Duke is very lucky to have such wonderfully supportive parents joining its team! Maybe we can meet up in August??? I’d love to give you some {{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}!!! :)</p>
<p>~berurah</p>
<p>I think the message I got about the false accuser is that this particular false accuser isn’t the one to make an example of. </p>
<p>She still wanted to go forward …with nothing but her contradictory stories to base it on? Not-guilty by reason of insanity … although maybe that would be one way – a long drawn out and painful way – to get her the help she needs.</p>
<p>berurah -
Sounds like a plan!!! I’ll PM you as we get closer and I know more details.</p>
<p>Here is an interesting commentary on the issue of the false accusation of rape. (Dated October 2006). I am sure there will be more in the near future.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...e_accused.html[/url]”>http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...e_accused.html</a></p>
<p>From the article:</p>
<p>"However, that cannot overshadow the fact that false accusations are wrong, illegal, even. In fact, the judicial system has created at least two clear categories that such accusations could fall under; perjury and/or slander. Our society clearly has a means in which to punish these accusers, yet rarely, if ever, has anyone been prosecuted of such.</p>
<p>For the feminist who advocates that a false accusation is insignificant, they may want to consider how truly disrespectful a false allegation is to the woman who has ever actually been raped. These liars, who so casually and carelessly manipulate such a crime as rape for their own personal gain, disrespect our judicial system, victims, and most importantly, our society. Sadly, we have allotted them the freedom to do so, for without some formal punishment, society has implied that we tolerate it."</p>
<p>If the link doesn’t work, type in “False Accusation Of Rape” to access article.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Same at our house… </p>
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</p>
<p>My son did have the credentials. He is going somewhere else, and he plans to continue playing lax there… </p>
<p>Honestly, if he were at Duke, I would be afraid for him that teachers would consider him a “meathead” because he is a lax player. Many profs at Duke feel this way and have admitted it freely with no censure from the administration (Dukeengr and co. excluded). To me, that smacks of discrimination, just of a different sort than the racism/sexism that they decry so vehimently.</p>
<p>For your sons, I hope that there is a solution and that they are part of it and have a wonderful college experience. For me though, this whole saga did take Duke off any college list my son could have come up with.</p>
<p>You know, sokkermomm, I was thinking about that this morning. Earlier this week a (male) friend of mine called; he was complaining about some things on his job, and in the process of expressing various complaints out of his mouth dropped “one has to be very careful with females”. And as I’ve posted before on other threads, it’s difficult for professional women when males in business keep ALL females at arms length, not because of any one particular female, but because of the generally understood concept that even the hint of impropriety, or a false accusation, can be devastating. My friend is 40-ish, very married, with children in college and he has never had a negative experience with a female - he just really believes that “one has to be careful”.</p>
<p>This past week, I’ve been alone in our rental house with the following males
(1) a college professor; (2) the ceo of a company; (3) an air conditioning contractor; (4) a college coach; (5) a city employee who moonlights as a landscaping and lawn maintenance contractor. </p>
<p>What if I were just a bit unbalanced, or, what if I wanted to extort money? I could falsely accuse any one of those gentleman, at any time. I could claim they attempted to rape me, or sexually harrassed me, etc. And which one should I choose? The ceo probably has the deepest pockets - and a rapid, quiet payoff would be the best thing for him to do. But then, he’s probably more feisty than the others, has better lawyers, and would be more likely to fight back quickly. The college professor and the coach might have more to immediately lose though - so while a cash payoff might be smaller than a payoff from the ceo, it might be offered a lot faster and with a whole lot less fuss. The air conditioning contractor has daughters age 11 - 16, so, he might be equally inclined to come up with a fast cash settlement in exchange for testimony withdrawn or agreement to not press charges. But the man who works for the city would be a very interesting target - what if I could sue the city?</p>
<p>And, I’m a credible person with a spotless background. Chances are better than even I’d be believed, at least for a little while. </p>
<p>But even if I didn’t prevail and gain a cash payoff, what would a false accusation do to any one of these gentlemen? </p>
<p>At first, I agreed with Soozievt when she said there are false accusers abound; it’s the DA (the educated, experienced professional who is charged with the responsibilities of his office and who is supposed to have reasonably good judgment) who is most responsible here. The accuser, she’s just in a very bad place, and needs some help. </p>
<p>But then I think, gee, the starving person who needs food and steals it is in a very bad place too. There are all sort of examples of people who commit crimes in reaction to unfair events that happened to them. Also, the accuser was presumably rational enough to attend college, and achieve a GPA high enough to be awarded a scholarship so that she could turn down Jessie Jackson’s offer of money - exactly how far into Alice in Wonderland territory can she really be? </p>
<p>I really wish they would consider charging the accuser with a crime. If she’s in need of help, fair enough, let her attorney plead insanity or whatever is appropriate. But to let her just walk away without any penalty for her actions just seems very unfair, and harmful to women everywhere - real rape victims, professional women, etc.</p>
<p>What was the number I heard yesterday - the cost of the defense was $3 million? Someone (in addition to Nifong) should be held accountable here…</p>
<p>From Joev, yesterday:
For some perspective here’s a link to the “Innocence Project” breakdown of th racial background of the people they have proven to have been wrongly convicted - not just accused, but convicted and sent to prison before being released after proof of their innocence was uncovered: <a href=“http://www.innocenceproject.org/Content/351.php[/url]”>http://www.innocenceproject.org/Content/351.php</a>
As you can see, 60% of these victims of failure of the system are black. That’s 119 men who spent years, sometimes decades, locked in prison cells before being exonerated. And that’s just the tip of the iceberg, the ones lucky enough to get a group of impractical idealists to take the time and effort to go back and examine the evidence in their case - without government subsidy.</p>
<p>I’m glad that the Duke students were exonerated. I’m glad the system worked for them - if slowly and inefficiently, at least before they suffered the truly awful penalties our society dishes out to the less fortunate. But to take from these events the idea that whites are somehow disadvantaged in America is evidence of a profound failure to view them in perspective.</p>
<p>Ag54
Unfortunately, many scholar-athletes have to deal with that label whether at Duke or elsewhere. Dealing with that stereotype has my guys very strong in character.
My sons are lettered in three varsity sports, one of which is crew – Chose Duke over Harvard even though Duke doesn’t have a crew team. That proved to us their commitment to Duke.</p>
<p>Good luck to your son.</p>
<p>Proud in NJ: If my sons had dreamed of Duke for years, perhaps I’d relent & allow them to attend. Otherwise, I’d cross the school off the list, like ag54. My kids are lax players, but neither is a Div 1 recuit level talent. I find the attitude of faculty pre-judging athletes as odious as pre-judging students based on race, religion, region, etc. It is the antithesis of an open-minded academic environment where truth is sought without preconceived notions coloring one’s judgment or stifling that pursuit. A real shame, as our Duke alum friends have always spoken highly of the school & are fiercely loyal. It’s never been in that “dream” category in this household, so it’s really impossible to honestly say how we’d handle a decision like yours. Too bad that such a wonderful institution has been tainted by the cowardly actions of the administrators & the poisoned mindset of the Group of 88.</p>
<p>Proudin NJ: Are your sons receiving athletic scholarships from Duke? I can imagine that would make the decision a lot tougher!</p>
<p>Perhaps this has been covered before:</p>
<p>How many faculty members are there at Duke? IOW, the 88 comprise what percentage of the faculty?</p>
<p>Son, a Duke freshmsn, is saddened and concerned about the unfortunate besmirching of the school’s reputation, but has not regretted for a second his decision to attend. (Well, except for maybe a sleepless night or two caused by Dr. G’s class!!)</p>
<p>It’s not just a matter of what percentage of the total faculty the 88 comprises. It’s the fact that such a horrible rush to judgment, perpetuated on their very own students, would be published widely & not a single meaningful repremand came down from the administration. That’s quite a chilling reality if a parent expects his kid to be treated fairly and decently by his school.</p>
<p>Stickershock -</p>
<p>No scholarships— athletic or merit.</p>
<p>I understand and respect the concerns of Ag54 and others. It is certainly not my role to question any parent or student’s decision regarding attending Duke. That’s why there are how many colleges and universities out there? Our sons have made their choice and we proudle stand behind them. I have read the posts on CC and have reached out to parents of current students. The well-reasoned posts of DukeEgr and others, and more importantly the students at Duke that the boys have met and spoken with - one of whom is our neighbor and one of their closest friends, give us great comfort in THEIR decision.</p>
<p>Stickershock-</p>
<p>I really was asking to ask…not to make a point.</p>
<p>~mafool</p>
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<p>We know that it was an ugly, racially-charged scene from the accounts of the neighbor and the second stripper’s 911 call. That is a separate issue from the one the Attorney General was discussing, the apparently false charge of rape.</p>
<p>It was the ugliness of the entire evening, combined with past behavior history of the lacrosse team, that provided the tinder for the community response. The players put themselves in a position to be falsely accused. No good is likely to come from a drunk white athletic team hiring two black strippers. There’s high potential for negative outcomes in that situation. I suspect that the majority of the players on that team recognized that and were uncomfortable with the scene from the start.</p>
<p>proudinnj~we CC Duke moms are thrilled that you will be a double Duke mom!!! :)
S1 always wanted to go to Duke and has loved it from the moment he arrived fall of '05. He said everyone he knows was so thrilled with the news yesterday!!</p>
<p>If S2 wants to apply to Duke when he is a senior we would never stand in his way. He has some specific interests that he could not pursue at Duke, however, so that may not happen. He loves it too–and has stayed with his brother on several occasions!!</p>
<p>We CC Duke moms should definitely have a gathering in August!! :)</p>
<p>Welcome back, kluge!! Have missed your input here!! :)</p>
<p>Hey y’all - don’t start trying to get proudinnj’s kids to change their minds or anything like that. They’re ED anyway, and they’re coming :). I just hope they’ve figure out the obligatory identification hats since IIRC the <em>other</em> option was a third nose break… and no one really wants that…</p>