I have a major problem with my college decisions: I got into a bunch of universities including UCSD (marshall college, and general bio.) and Eckerd college (with a scholarship and honors program) and the Maastricht Science Programme in the Netherlands. Now, Eckerd was pretty much the saftiest safety for me and my counselor assured me that I would get the college scholarship and UCSD was already a bit more of a stretch. UCSD’s biology program is obviously much more reputable and recognized than Eckerd’s and it is probably generally a better university.
The problem I have is that my parents recently told me that it turns out that they will not be able to finance undergrad and grad school for my sister and I for any of the universities I applied to except for Eckerd (with the scholarship) and the Dutch university. Right now, I am looking to go into research in biology, maybe start my own firm, and I do not really know how important grad school is for that kind of career. Essentially I am deciding between undergrad at Eckerd and then grad school somewhere else or just getting my bachelor’s at UCSD and then figuring it out. Unfortunately, I am not a U.S. citizen so loans and that stuff are out of the question.
How important is getting a master’s degree and does it really matter where one gets their bachelor’s degree? Any kind of tips would be appreciated as I feel like I am not quite ready to think about the rest of my life on this great of a scale. Thank you so much!
This sounds really though, like it will be the culmination of several decades of study and networking. To do meaningful research and lead your own projects, you will most likely need a PhD. To start a company, you will need connections and network well, and/or be very business savvy. Earning an MBA may help. You need the creativity and brains of a scientist to come up with a (biology) product or service, and you need the business know-how to make it a reality (or partner with people who can).
Biology masters are much less common than PhD. Institutions that grant biology PhD may not even offer terminal masters programs. For the business side, a masters (MBA) can be useful. In general, where you get the bachelors degree will not be as important as the graduate institution and how well you use your resources.
Phospholipase’s advice is spot on. If you want to lead the research, you will want (and need) a PhD. If this is your goal, I would scrutinize Eckerd’s research labs and opportunities for student research (outside of classroom labs). I know the marine bio department at Eckerd is reputed to be excellent, and I think there are research opportunities in other areas. Keep in mind, you can also perform research at other institutions during college breaks. Eckerd is likely a fine choice for you, since graduate school is where you will really need to scrutinize your choices.
As for money, you likely won’t have to pay a dime for getting a science PhD. You are cheap labor after all. Tuition should be paid for by the school/lab, as well as a stipend. An MBA is another story though.
For undergraduates? Not necessarily.
For undergraduates majoring in one of Eckerd’s areas of strength (marine sciences, environmental studies)? Quite possibly not at all.
Which would you rather have?
2hrs/week of 300-student lecture classes at UCSD plus 1 hour/week of ~30-student discussion/lab sections led by a graduate student? Or 3 hrs/week of ~20 student classes taught by an experienced professor (possibly with a PhD from one of the UCs)? This, approximately, is a typical difference between the class arrangements at a small LAC v. a large public research university. Not in every class of course … but in many lower-division courses, required courses, or courses in popular majors.
In your case, Eckerd is what you can afford so you don’t really have a choice.
But you may in fact be getting a better classroom experience as well as lower costs.
I expect Eckerd can hold its own in pretty much any of the Biological Sciences, not just Marine. It’s what they are known for and what they pride themselves on. The ultimate good point is there won’t be any grad students competing with you for research positions and professors know your name/dedication, etc.
There are students who go there solely because it’s a college with its own beach. You don’t have to be one of those.
^Although I generally agree with this reply, undergraduates and PhD-seeking graduate students don’t compete for the same research positions in a grant-funded research lab at a university. Undergrads are generally another set of hands that don’t accomplish much on their own until several months into the project and then they leave a few months after becoming independent. Not much bang for the buck from a professor’s standpoint. PhD-seeking grad students are there for the long haul… 4-5 years of research at least.
In response to tk21769:
For undergraduates? Necessarily. UCSD has one of the top biological sciences programs for grads and undergrads alike, and the amount of research and internship opportunities in La Jolla far outweigh those in Tampa. As dadof1 said, you’re not even competing for the same spots as grad students.
For undergraduates majoring in the marine sciences/environmental sciences? Marine Biology was basically founded at the Scripps Institution of Oceanography on UCSD’s campus, and it’s still one of the top programs in the country.
And for entrepreneurship, UCSD’s Basement, Entrepreneurial Challenge, and School of Management are extremely useful resources.
However, that’s advice for people perusing this thread who are in a different situation than OP. OP, if Eckerd is giving you a full ride, I don’t know if it’s worth paying OOS at UCSD. You’ll still gain a fine background in Florida.
^ But this was not the case when my marine loving boy visited schools. Those with grad students were letting them do what he considered all the fun stuff - taking care of tanks and the like. Undergrads were pretty rare in the lab and when we asked folks working in the lab about them they kind of got a blank stare and said, well, I know they come here once/twice a week and have classes. At Eckerd, undergrads are doing pretty much everything that can be done. It was a big difference. It helps that Eckerd is on the water. Many other places have their lab on the water, but the college is a few miles (several minutes) away. For regular Bio this isn’t as big a deal, but I suspect the first part in who’s doing what is similar.
How did this thread become so marine-centric when OP didn’t really mention it…
Anyways, if you want to do research or start a firm, what you do after undergrad will be much more important (e.g. PhD, work experience, networking). I would give UCSD the upper hand in terms of networking and being near a heavy biotech industry, but it may not be worth if it it’s the much more expensive choice. Though do keep in mind biology PhDs in US usually come with a salary and tuition waived. MBA programs like to see you with at least two years of work experience before joining the program, and it will cost you.
At UCSD, 34.8% of classes have 50 or more students. That’s a far bigger percentage than Berkeley (let alone compared to a small LAC). At UCSD, 313 out of 1395 classes have 100+ students. These ratios probably understate the number of big classes in lower-division courses, required courses, and popular majors (like biology).
UCSD may well have top life science departments. It may also have many research and internship opportunities. What I’d *question/i is how well these resources trickle down to the average undergraduate. Maybe they do, maybe they don’t, in ways that matter to you. If you cannot visit both campuses to see for yourself, then look for some hard numbers to compare undergraduate resources and outcomes. That’s assuming you could afford UCSD at all.