Economic Woes - College vs. Housing

Parents Forum
1

<p>I like school newspapers. As a journalism major myself I like to look at both the quality of the writing as well as the quality of ideas put out for public consumption. In my mind, it has the ability to reflect both the quality of the education as well as the concerns of the community. This said… some school papers are much, much better and benefit from better writers than others. And it’s also true that some have good writing but very little substance to what is written. This said, between school newspapers, websites and president letters as well as CC in general, there is a lot of talk about what kind of affect this economic crisis is going to have on Financial Aid. </p>

<p>And then it struck me. How is paying for a college education through a majority of scholarship, grants and other financial aid initiatives any different than when there were mortgages given to people who had no way to pay it back or afford the added costs of home ownership? Surely, this is the somewhat the same as the “haves vs the have nots.” Is it in the best interests of colleges (at this critical financial juncture) to stay true to an overarching commitment to need blind admissions and, as some elite schools have done, a no loan policy? While those on financial aid might compare offers of aid from various schools, what will we compare and contrast? What our 50K now buys vs what it will buy next fall.</p>

<p>On the one hand I could compare it to wanting to sell my house. I’d love to live in another part of town. Where I live is great, it’s fine… but I just like the area “over there” much more. It’s more representative of how I live my life. There are walking trails right there plus the commute to downtown is ideal, not to mention how much I like the various shops and markets. It’s all about the quality of iife. However, this comes with a very different pricetag for the kind of house we currently live in and if I really wanted to live over there, I’d have to settle for a helluva lot less square footage, which is (as it happens to be) becoming easier and easier to imagine. However, if I wanted it today I’d need to shell out almost twice what my current house is worth to get a similar house there. Should a bank just give me the mortgage? And would I think it ok if they just wanted to give me a grant or scholarship for what would make the house affordable just because I’d be a credit to the community? What are my responsibilities in turn for accepting their offer? I’m just saying. </p>

<p>I am not saying financial aid is not a great thing. It is! But, frankly, I can see both sides of this particular trick coin. From my very personal point of view, I have been growing more and more concerned at how we, as a family, will compare schools when programs are being cut and/or reduced, faculty is being frozen (along with their salaries) and the list goes on. In the absence of qualifying for any type of financial aid at schools (especially those that don’t offer Merit Aid either), how does one go about comparing something that might not be the same in 6 months time? And does one take into consideration how much or how many proposed changes are being made as a signal of institutional values and intelligence (e.g., do I see the proposed cuts or reductions as ones made with a broader and deeper view than simply a line item savings). Is it right that because the school is fully committed to its financial aid polices that the quality of the education might change? If I am given a leg up in this community across town, but can’t afford to take care of my lawn or make repairs to this dream house, would the rest of the community suffer? How will this commitment to financial aid affect the school’s future - near and far off?</p>

<p>Just putting it out there for discussion… Frankly, I can make arguments to support several points of view, but I just want to hear what others think.</p>

2

<p>I understand your point, but I don’t think the analogy works. One can acquire a different house at any time in life.</p>

<p>Yes, one can go to school at any time in life as well, but once the bachelors is earned, that’s it.</p>

<p>So, presumably someone can live in a shack and market an incredible product and end up in a mansion.</p>

<p>School is more of a one bite of the apple kind of thing.</p>

<p>Although this doesn’t speak directly to your point, I believe it’s vital for people along every spot of the income pyramid to receive a first class education. I don’t want to live in a society sharply delineated by hereditary wealth.</p>

<p>I think it is worth some sacrifice to bring about a more egalitarian society. I suspect you do, too.</p>

<p>I do, however, understand your uncertainty and frustration.</p>

<p>BTW: Some schools are more devoted to helping upper middle class earners than others. </p>

<p>And if your financial situation changes, you can apply for FA, as you know. It’s nice to know that colleges are committed to some kind of financial safety net. I think freezing of faculty positions and moratorium on capital projects are better moves than withdrawing financial support to students. I hope the crisis does not worsen to the extent that colleges have no choice but to take that step.</p>

3

<p>Surprizingly enough those who decided to pay off mortgages before sending kids to college are the same people who also decided to send them to colleges that they can afford despite all kinds of ambitions and achievements. …or maybe it is NOT such a coincidence?</p>

4

<p>I don’t follow miami, considering mortgages are just about the last tax haven left, I will keep my mortgage. But in it’s current state, I can afford it. I am not suggesting we live in a cash and carry world, I am just asking how much debt is too much debt? And how does how we allocate our own funds compare to how a college allocates theirs? But in keeping with your argument (I think), for most people, affording a school is about the aid package. And it is true that the current price tag of a Dartmouth education would be more “affordable” when considering aid than the state university. This certainly doesn’t hold true for the person without aid.</p>

5

<p>Righ now ANY debt is too much and mortgage IS NOT tax haven, it is a burden. It is absolutely NOT true that one cannot earn aid under current conditions (of course, they will change soon, then it will no longer be true). Currently, all you need to do is to graduate at the top of your HS class or a little below.</p>

6

<p>To quote my favorite financial columnist, Michelle Singletary of the Washington Post:</p>

<p>Debt = Slavery</p>

<p>Sometimes (like with buying a house) you have absolutely no other option than going into debt. However, the further you can stay from being in debt, and the quicker you can work your way out of it, the better.</p>

7

<p>So… Various private colleges – in their attempts to have a balanced budget – will cut 20 million from their budgets while continuing to fully fund financial aid initiatives. Something is going to suffer from the lack of that 20 million. And if I am paying 50K, don’t I want what’s lacking to be somehow mitigated to have the least effect on my kid’s educational experience? Does this mean I will look harder at the school that cuts financial aid? No, because I certainly don’t want my kid to be surrounded with silver spoons. However, will they cut support to the writing center? Fail to fully fund the science department? These things will absolutely matter to all students. It is just that in our case, no one will be offering us a lot of money that might offset the pain in the reduction in services.</p>

<p>There has to be a balance between attracting and retaining financial aid students and attracting and retaining full tuition paying students. So as the consumer, I can only hope I will be fully appraised of any budgetary changes colleges are planning on making. And if the school’s resources are committed to financial aid, does that make me feel they are less committed to my concerns? Or is it better in the long run, and is actually of greater benefit to the individual, to attend college with a breadth and depth of society instead of a privileged few? </p>

<p>My concern, if you will, is based on the fact that schools are currently putting out their letters from their presidents addressing how the college is dealing with the financial crisis. Very few mention specific programs, but almost all speak to preserving their financial aid. I just want to know preserving it at the loss of… what exactly?</p>

<p>Amherst’s student newspaper recently reported on their student union group ponying up quite a chunk of their money to protect certain student oriented programs due to cuts. However, the school is committed to need blind admissions and financial aid without loans. So while Amherst’s students have stepped up to the plate to protect the integrity of the full college experience and tradition, how will other schools handle the same challenges?</p>

8

<p>As individuals we need to look at this question and ask what, if any, debt we can afford for college. The potential debt can be so overwelming that one may decide to choose a different school or go part-time or not even go to college. But, we also need to look at this question as a society. If college is getting so expensive that many people can not afford it or are saddled with crippling debt, then we need to find a way to make college more affordable. Our society needs a well educated population that is not crippled by debt. During the Civil War Pres. Lincoln began the great land grant colleges. We may just need another great program to bring college to more people in these trying times.</p>

9

<p>I’ve been thinking about this and our philosophy has changed. Some of the US policies is to encourage more debt. With D1, I thought UC tuition/dorm would be just the right price for us but I’m seriously changing my regarding colleges for D2. My husband and I will be also be buying a McMansion(if the price is right) and also will encourage D2 to apply for private schools. Worst come worst there will always be bailout or we will be too old to care. When we reach 80 and having dementia, who cares if we live in a nice nursing home or a crappy nursing home. We rather spend now then let someone else spend for us.</p>

10

<p>I realize there is an abundance of concern about debt. But here, in a nutshell, is my concern for the future:</p>

<p>[Hopkins’s</a> endowment drops amid recession - News & Features](<a href=“http://media.www.jhunewsletter.com/media/storage/paper932/news/2009/01/29/NewsFeatures/Hopkinss.Endowment.Drops.Amid.Recession-3604734-page3.shtml]Hopkins’s”>http://media.www.jhunewsletter.com/media/storage/paper932/news/2009/01/29/NewsFeatures/Hopkinss.Endowment.Drops.Amid.Recession-3604734-page3.shtml)</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>100million??? That’s alot of programs, salaries, events, etc. etc. going bye bye. And yet there will be a tuition increase that I will, if my kid goes there, be asked to pay. It’s not about debt. It’s about the value of services relative to cost of said services.</p>

11

<p>Modadunn: I addressed this a bit in my post. Most colleges are cutting back in capital improvements (building projects), new hires (filling vacated chairs), and non-teaching staff.</p>

<p>So perhaps classes will be a bit larger, though most LAC’s can’t withstand large class sizes and still attract students.</p>

<p>Some are enlarging the frosh class, though the numbers I’ve seen are small additions, so perhaps housing will be a bit burdened and the physical plant a bit more utilized or crowded.</p>

<p>As I indicated, I prefer these cutbacks to cutbacks in FA for the reasons I gave. But that’s just one person’s opinion.</p>

<p>If the situation gets worse I am sure some schools will have to cut some FA initiatives, at least for internationals. We’ll see what happens.</p>

12

<p>“When we reach 80 and having dementia, who cares if we live in a nice nursing home or a crappy nursing home.”
I want to work when I am 80 to prevent dementia and living in nursing home. My concern is that with the bailout, I will loose my job much sooner (like in few weeks/months) than I planned. I am really scared!</p>

13

<p>Oh dear. MiamaDAP – I am so sorry.</p>

<p>My H has a small business really impacted by this financial mess. I have a safe job that is wonderful but not desperately lucrative.</p>

<p>Although his revenue is really down, he can always scare up some money. Small businesses can survive if their overhead is small.</p>

<p>Maybe you can start thinking about alternatives and escape routes.</p>

<p>I will also work into my seventies. Not sure about 80. Our union traded the pension (that the oldsters kept) for benefits to the higher ups so all I have is a glorified IRA that now has pennies in it.</p>

14

<p>

</p>

<p>I’m sorry to hear that. My job maynot be safe either but my husband is. However our jobs are retirement jobs. So we plan to spend now.</p>