What do you think would happen if one of the T10 schools decided to accept rising sophomores into their college once they graduated in a guaranteed but binding program where that student didn’t have to give any tests as long as you maintained a decent GPA? In return the school and student would agree not to apply anywhere else.
Do you think we will see this in ten years, maybe targeted at hard to reach populations? And what effect will this have on the admission process if it happens?
Why would the college make that deal? What’s in it for the school? How would the pick those sophomores? MANY sophomores in high school have perfect gpa’s.
I was thinking something like a BSMD program for college admission. Once in, the kid can have a regular high school life and not stress out about college admissions. If it is targeted at URM, first gen, low SES etc, can’t the college cream off the best students in those categories from it’s competitors? Or maybe they go after let’s say very smart and accomplished kids?
How would they decide this? Not sure, but like Duke does TIP maybe or some other method?
BA/BS->MD/DO programs do require students to earn a high college GPA and high MCAT score to retain the assured admission to the MD/DO program, so the student cannot just be a “regular college student”. If a college does what you are suggesting, it will probably impose a GPA, course selection, and test score minimum to maintain the assured admission.
However, that presumes that the most impressive 9th graders will be the most impressive 12th graders and college students. Considering that 9th graders are even less independent of parents than 12th graders, such a program would probably select even more for parental involvement and knowledge than current college admissions processes. I.e. the credentials of a 9th grader are more dependent on parental circumstance and support than the credentials of a 12th grader, and even the act of applying to such a program as a 9th grader is even more of a parental decision than the act of applying to a college as a 12th grader.
Also, the college would have to find some way of assuring financial aid predictability for the parents early on. (Medical school is different, since students can and are assumed to have to take $300,000+ loans for medical school.)
“What do you think would happen if one of the T10 schools decided to accept rising sophomores into their college once they graduated in a guaranteed but binding program”
Acceptance into that sophomore program would then become the new rat race.
I do often wonder if it would be a good thing or not to have an across-the-board cap on how many T20 colleges each student could apply to (say, three). That would force students to think about fit over chasing prestige, but in exchange they might have a slightly higher chance of getting in (okay, only very, very slightly higher, but still…). Those colleges wouldn’t ever agree to that either, though.
Groundwork2022- “That would force students to think about fit over chasing prestige”
Why would that be better? Top 20s all have retention rates in the high 90 percentiles. It seems the “fit” works for most of the kids that choose these schools even if it is in the pursuit of prestige, and because the competition to get in so rigorous the kids tend to have the ability to thrive academically.
Might hate conceptually chasing prestige but it seems to work out as does the current system. Frustrating sure but effective in my opinion based on the mutual selection of school’s and students when 97+% freshman retention rates are the norm in top 20s.
Why change something that’s not broken?
@Groundwork2022 , that’s how the UK limits such crazy application numbers/admit rates. I’ve often wondered about a similar system working in the US (obviously not quite as limiting as the uk’s 5 schools total and only one of either Oxford or Cambridge), given how much pressure is put on the process from the number of applications in the US I do think something like that would help. Agree it’s highly unlikely to happen… and of course, the colleges would have to deal with not being so “selective” as a corollary.
What would happen, is that kids would start coming under huge pressure from middle school. It’s hard enough for older teens to deal with the stress, let kids stay kids.
Nocreativity1, I agree, based on retention, that part isn’t broken, nor would retention rates be likely to change if applications were limited. The application process is the squeaky wheel on which I was more curious about experimenting. I’m not holding my breath, though.
I started sophomore year at 14 years old, and many sophomores are just 15, still children. No agreement with them could remotely be considered “binding,” and no reasonable adult could expect a 14-15-year-old to make such significant life decisions. This is a non-starter.
For many students and parents, “fit” is defined mainly by prestige (or what they think prestige is).
However, the UK has a population about one fifth that of the US, while Oxford and Cambridge bring in two or three times as many new undergraduates as Harvard and Yale.
Groundwork2002 I think the most unfortunate element of the application process is that based on the convenience and ease of applying, top tier schools receive 10s of thousands of applications that are almost immediately eliminated from contention based on sub standard school stats.
Kids are allowed and in most cases encouraged to waste time, effort and money pursuing admission to schools that they simply are not competitive candidates for. Adults are reluctant to deliver the message, school’s provide stats in a manner that suggest unhooked lower quartile kids stand a chance, and unsolicited encouragement arrives in the mail box daily.
I fear that even if the number of applications was capped, kids would still waste precious opportunities on the unattainable at the expense of realistic options that will be needed later.
"that’s how the UK limits such crazy application numbers/admit rates. "
Limiting the app to 5 colleges is a piece of it, but the other key piece is that each of the colleges have fairly well defined admissions criteria. Ie - applicants must have a certain # of a certain type of scores for admissions, it’s not very holistic. Much more pure stat and merit based, more similar to the Chinese method but doesn’t rely on a single test.
The royal kids (William and Harry) didn’t go to St Andrews because it was necessarily their top choice; their scores weren’t sufficient to get them into Oxford or Cambridge and unlike US “selective” schools (which really aren’t necessarily selective regarding grades especially if you’re an athlete, legacy/donor or URM), it’s more difficult to buy an admission through donations or being famous in the UK.
@marvin100 I agree with you, but that’s alrady happening. My D is a gymnast and we are always hearing about 8/9/10th graders with verbal commits.
@milgymfan - sure, in sports. It’s a non-starter for general applicants, though.
My point was it’s considered just as binding as ED (as in not really, but the pressure is there) and it’s a huge life decision thrust at kids early. Athletes aren’t somehow better prepared to choose their college or major than the general student public, so I don’t see a huge difference, personally.
9th grade commitments to a coach are NOT like ED. Either side is free to walk away and the 9th grader may not be admitted to the school anyway. In fact, nothing is signed and nothing can be signed. I know a bunch of early committer who did not go to that school, and in fact early committing is no longer allowed in lax because the coaches asked that it be moved to junior year.
There is a reason the NCAA doesn’t allow binding commitments with 13 and 14 year olds- things change.
@milee30 I think you meant Will and Kate (as Harry never attended university), but with their grades of AAC and AAB respectively, they would have had a shot at Oxbridge at the time they applied to university, especially William.
Will’s predecessors could get into Cambridge with grades of CCD (Edward) and BC (Charles). See: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1531553/The-family-qualifications.html.
Even well connected individuals, e.g. the journalist Toby Young, in the UK can seep through the grade requirements system for Oxbridge:
Yes, @Capricancer1 you’re right. Sorry it wasn’t clear - meant that neither of the kids went to Oxbridge, not that they both went to St Andrews. My DH is from the UK and the US holistic admissions system drives him batty. He makes comments about how corrupt our system is and the part about how even the royal kids don’t get an automatic pass into the top unis unlike the kids of famous people over here is what stuck with me.