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No. Each of these students parents are judged as being able to pay a certain amount. The bad choices of the wealthy student’s parents affect which school their child attends but not the bad choices of the poor student. The end result is still that a student that has no control over his situation is not able to attend the same college as a poorer student through no fault of his own.</p>
<p>^^ Wrong. We wouldn’t qualify for aid. Living and working where we do, many here don’t qualify.</p>
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Of course it does. If you are a top performer in YOUR socioeconomic peer group (high school) you will get more aid. There is a way out of poverty for those that want it and are willing to work for it. Reward those that have EARNED it.</p>
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I don’t think that’s true, either. The bad choices of the poor student’s parents will likely close even more doors because I don’t see anyone suggesting giving every poor kid a full ride. Which is another issue with the lack of merit aid. Having merit aid at a variety of colleges may make it possible for those poor kids to get free rides at lower-tier schools or school that want diversity or some other special thing and are willing to pay for it. I don’t think there will ever be enough money (nor should there be) to give every worthy student a free education. Eliminating merit aid across the board would probably be more harmful to many poor kids on a case-by-case basis. More options is almost always better than fewer.</p>
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I think people have misconstrued your post. Your not entitled, you just have the same liberal attitude as many others in the US. I believe you are actually proposing that the US Government and college FA “save you from yourself”. If you (and the rest of us) can’t resist the urge to take money that we don’t deserve then we need more government to regulate our morality and to determine for us what we deserve. Of course it seems we all disagree mightily on what we deserve and who should pay for the sins of their parents, but giving more to the poor is always a popular liberal belief.</p>
<p>Nah. Vossron took out home equity to send one of his kids to college. So he is playing the upper class liberal, but in fact he belongs to the conservative middle-class whiner constituency.</p>
<p>Anyone care to define the annual income of the “middle class” in the US? Want to translate that income into the average EFC for that family with one child in college? How much “need based” aid is the middle class currently receiving? </p>
<p>This discussion has been primarily about the wealthy and poor. I think if we look at who the middle class actually is and what they are currently receiving in “need based” FA, we’ll see that this conversation is actually about funding the education of the poor.</p>
<p>I’m actually thinking more in terms of moving merit money to FA, to reduce, e.g., PROFILE EFC that schools calculate, and for schools that gap, reduce the gaps. The poor already have zero EFC.</p>
<p>zm knows I’m not conservative! :)</p>
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I would never have insulted you by calling you conservative!</p>
<p>Vossron, if you were King of the World and moved all merit money into the need-based pot, you would probably still not be able to give every student you deem worthy a free ride. Whereas those meritorious of being admitted to the top colleges could find some very generous options based on that merit.</p>
<p>I accept partial solutions that are improvements, doing the best we can to keep scarce dollars from those who don’t need them.</p>
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So not an absolute, set in stone, end to merit aid at every private college?</p>
<p>The act of being admitted to a college is not sine qua non for deserving merit. Otherwise, every student in the country would deserve a free ride <em>somewhere</em>, and the Ivy would not have to admit that they turn away hordes of ‘qualified’ students.</p>
<p>The students who do not need the money are those who are asking society to pay for their prestige-whoring yet are inadequate to deserve merit aid.</p>
<p>^^^ Sure, if there were a way to keep merit aid away from those who don’t need it, that would work, without ending it.</p>
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That principle is so important to you that you would keep “merit away from those who don’t need it” even if it ended up costing the college and its students more than the merit aid would have been worth?</p>
<p>Most of the information I have seen has shown that it is the wealthy/upper middle class kids who tend to have the high test scores and ECs that the schools want. CC gives you a warped view as to the number of students who are truly top drawer and are Pell grant eligible. So merit awards often do go to the upper income kids. </p>
<p>Zoosermom brings up an excellent point about the fact that not offering any merit money at all can cost some colleges more than it saves. Getting some high scoring, higher income kids in a school can really make a difference in the ratings and draw of the school. I know some schools really held out from giving merit aid and finally succumbed because they were losing a competitive edge. To get a top student whose parents are willing and able to pay 80% of the cost is really a smart use of money.</p>
<p>Colleges are a business to be run when it comes to the bottom line.</p>
<p>^^ It’s a zero-sum game; the same total number of dollars would be distributed. The change would likely alter the destination of some students (the wealthiest would no longer be bribed into their choice). Now that I think about it, there would actually be more total dollars available, since the wealthiest would no longer get a discount.</p>
<p>If I were going to “fix” the system, I would arrange the incentives so that ALL students are motivated to become better students and are rewarded for doing so. It’s not much of a reward for an elite college to accept a middle-class student if the student can’t afford to go there. </p>
<p>Maybe this is already happening. As a result, a few of the very top colleges have “need-based” financial aid where the middle class only pays up to 10% of their income or some such (targeted merit aid, in essence), and many have merit scholarships which mostly go to middle class (yes, some wealthy students get these, but we wouldn’t want all of them to go to HYPSM, and maybe a few of them are worthy of rewards, too).</p>
<p>Also, I suspect that a lot of merit aid is not giving money away, but brings the price to around break-even, so it’s not really money that could have gone to need-based financial aid.</p>
<p>There would not be more dollars available. If you are an admissions officer with $100K to give out, if you could offer $10K in merit money to 10 kids whose families can afford the rest of the tuition, but the “discount” is enticing especially since Rival U across the way did not offer a dime and is of about the same type of school, you are in good shape. $100K is only going to get you 2 full pays. So you use your money to get a better crop of kids for the money. This is done all of the time at those colleges that are fairly selective and want to attract the high test score crowd.</p>