EFC with 2 sons in college

Financial Aid and Scholarships
#1

<p>Next year we will have 2 sons in college. I have a question on how most schools handle financial aid and EFC with multiple children in college. My assumption is that both schools would divide the EFC in half to consider what they feel we owe as our contribution. I understand that not all schools meeting 100% of need.</p>

<p>Here is a likely scenario. Our oldest son is at Penn State. His next youngest brother is applying to many schools, but we will use Rice for this example. If our EFC turns out to be 30k, would Penn State and Rice each assume the EFC for them is 15k?</p>

#2

<p>It’s usually not exactly 50%. I think it’s more like each would have 60% of the grand total. </p>

#3

<p>Not exactly. Yes, the parental part of the FAFSA EFC will be cut in half for each student. So your son at Penn State will have an EFC about half of what it would have been. But…Penn State does not guarantee to meet full need and simply does not for most of their students. They may not give your son a dime more. Happens all of the time with schools that don’t guarantee to meet full need. Unless your EFC goes into levels for entitlement like PELL or some state grants if in the picture, that son won’t get more. My SIL nephew goes to Penn State, gets a little aid, and that his sister is now in college didn’t up his aid a dime. In fact, it went down since Penn State expects upper classmen to take on more of the load each year. Many schools do that, even full need ones, and they build that into their aid formulas.</p>

<p>Rice uses PROFLE, I believe, and it’s own definition of expected contribution, not FAFSA EFC in coming up with need. You can run your numbers through their NPC to get some idea of what you will be expected to pay for your second son, with 2 in college. </p>

<p>Your FAFSA EFC works about the way you are thinking it would, but there isn’t a school in the country that I know of that guarantees to meet full need as defined by FAFSA EFC. Usually, the FAFSA EFC tells you what the rock bottom minimum you will be expected to pay before getting penny one of federal money like Work study, subsidized loans, SEOG, etc. That’s about all it guarantees you. That you have to pay at least that before getting any federal funds.</p>

#4

<p>You will be completing a FAFSA for each child so there will be no need for the schools to split the EFC. Each child will get their own EFC based on your income and assets as well as theirs.</p>

#5

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1693295-warning-efc-on-fafsa-isnt-honored-by-all-schools.html#latest”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1693295-warning-efc-on-fafsa-isnt-honored-by-all-schools.html#latest</a></p>

<p>You need to read this thread…similar situation</p>

<p>Are you OOS for PSU?</p>

<p>Keep in mind that “not meeting need” does not mean “oh, we come close but we don’t meet need.” Not meeting need could mean that you get NO FREE MONEY at all, even if EFC is $10k and the school costs $50k. </p>

#6

<p>No, we are in state for PSU. The whole tuition/financial aid thing always irritates me. First, FAFSA (and I’m assuming PROFILE will be the same) are INSANE if they think most people can possible afford the number they come up with for the EFC. We don’t live extravagantly, and their numbers for our annual living expenses are off by at least $25,000. I would love to know when they derived their numbers for living expenses.</p>

<p>Second, it is almost criminal the rate tuition has increased since 1987 (the year I graduated).</p>

<p>Ok, enough of my ranting. I’ll just have to wait and see what our numbers come back as. </p>

#7

<p><<<
If our EFC turns out to be 30k, would Penn State and Rice each assume the EFC for them is 15k?
<<<</p>

<p>Ok, if your current FAFSA EFC, then each child’s EFC will be about $15k, but you won’t get anymore money from PSU. You’ll still be full freight there. </p>

<p>And, as for Rice, they use CSS Profile, so they use another formula, and they don’t split 50/50. They split 60/60. So, if they figure that your family contribution is $35k for one student, they might say that when you have two in college, the amount that you’ll pay them is $18k</p>

<p>So, there’s a large possibility that you’ll be paying full freight at PSU plus maybe $18k for Rice.</p>

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<p>TBH, that isn’t a good idea. You could end up with no affordable schools for Child #2 because the total for both kids is too much.</p>

<p>Your post sounds like you could be facing an unaffordable situation…It sounds like you’re expecting aid from PSU once you have two in school, and that’s not likely going to happen. PSU is notorious for little/no aid beyond Pell…and your EFC is way too high for Pell. </p>

<p>This situation reminds me of a dad who posted about a year ago. He let his first D go to UIUC because he thought that when his S started college, they’d get aid from a splitting EFC… But…once he ran the NPCs with 2 in school, he realized that he wouldn’t get any aid for either student…and he couldn’t afford to pay that much for both kids. So, then he had to tell his S that he had to choose a school where he’d get very large merit because the option of moving the D wouldn’t result in lowering her costs. He felt horrible because D got to go where she wanted, and he was having to severely limit S’s choices. </p>

<p>Run Rice’s NPC two ways…once with 1 child and once with 2 kids in college. (However, if your child has a NCP or you take business deductions, then the NPCs will not be accurate. Also, run PSU’s NPC with 2 in college. </p>

#8

<p>" First, FAFSA (and I’m assuming PROFILE will be the same) are INSANE if they think most people can possible afford the number they come up with for the EFC." </p>

<p>FAFSA doesn’t assume anything. It is a calculation to figure out if you are eligible for subsidized federal loans and grants. That’s it. The subsidized loans and Pell grants are for low income families, and usually there is a school somewhere that would allow that student to attend for that amount. If families chose a different school, the family may have to come up with a lot more money. You have to decide what level you feel comfortable paying.</p>

<p>The government makes those decisions all the time with benefit programs and entitlements. Make $X, you qualify for food stamps, medicaid, EIC, child credit, child care credit. Make $XX+, nope, no benefit for you. With food stamps, you can buy food for your family and it will go a long way if you use coupons, shop at the less fancy places, buy more pasta than steak. If you shop at Whole Foods, you are going to be hungry much sooner in the month. If you qualify for Pell grants, those grants are going to pay for more credits at a less expensive school.</p>

#9

<p><<<
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If our EFC turns out to be 30k, would Penn State and Rice each assume the EFC for them is 15k?</p>

<h1><<<</h1>

<p>Ok, if your current FAFSA EFC, then each child’s EFC will be about $15k, but you won’t get anymore money from PSU. You’ll still be full freight there.</p>

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<p>Big typo…should say, "Ok, if your current FAFSA EFC is $30k with one in college, then when you have two in college, then each child’s EFC will be about $15k per year…</p>

#10

<p>I wish they would change the wording from EFC (Expected Family Contribution) to MFC (Minimum Family Contribution). It could help dispel some of the confusion for families. </p>

#11

<p>^^</p>

<p>I agree that the wording needs to change. It is sooo misleading. I’m not even sure if MFC would be clear enough. It should just be an index where people can refer to a chart to see if they qualify for any fed aid. </p>

#12

<p>^^ and include an explanation that most schools do not meet need as defined by the FAFSA calculations. FAFSA calculates a number that determines eligibility for Federal (and sometimes State) need based assistance for grants and loans… </p>

#13

<p>^ Why does the gov’t need to include that declaration? That should be something the schools should state. Does the gov’t say “some credit cards charge >15% APR?” No. They do require the APR be stated and savvy customers will compare them.</p>

#14

<p>^</p>

<p>I agree. The feds have no business stating anything that resembles the words Expected Family Contribution. The gov’t has no control over what state or private schools will charge families. Their EFC terminology suggests that they do! Ridiculous. Many people wrongly think, Oh, the FAFSA results tells each school how much they can charge my family…ha ha…not!</p>

#15

<p>APR disclosure is a credit transaction, licensed and regulated by state or federal government. The government doesn’t regulate the cost of college, so no disclosure or comparison required. The credit laws don’t require car dealers to disclose how car A is different from car B, or how a car at the lot down the street is a better deal, only to disclose the credit deal for THAT car, and if you don’t finance the car, the disclosures are not required at all. Similarly, colleges don’t have to list and compare their product with other schools.</p>

<p>They could call it ‘Federal line of entitlement’ or ‘Amount where your federal entitlements will kick in’ They could call it MEFCBFAKI (BYMHTPM) = Minimum Expected Family Contributions Before Financial Aid Kicks In (But You May Have To Pay More). The first time you look at EFC you may not know what it means, but you have the obligation to find out.</p>

<p>I actually think the government is doing a pretty good job at explaining how much benefits will cover, what loans are available, especially with the NPC now required. Even with all the credit disclosures required, most borrowers still just want to know what the monthly payment will be - not the total repayment amount, the APR, the fees. They just want to know what it will cost them every month. Same with college - how much will this cost me out-of-pocket. Many don’t care about the amount of the loans, and if the government didn’t cap them, they’d borrow more.</p>

#16

<p>OEFC (Our Expected Family Contribution) is a better term. It totally depends on each college. The NPC for each college should be used to estimate.</p>

#17

<p>Maybe I worded my earlier reply incorrectly. I meant we would wait to see what financial aid (merit and/or need based) our second son gets from the schools he is applying to (VCU, Boston University, Rice, Minnesota, Case Western, Illinois-Chicago, UAB). I understand that PSU most likely won’t be giving our first son any aid.</p>

<p>And we are prepared to continue pay full in state tuition for our son at PSU–doesn’t mean I like it though.</p>

#18