<p>Anyone following this?
So far it has not been that exciting except for a couple of games such as Spain v. Italy.</p>
<p>I have seen all the games so far. Unlike you, however, I think most have been very entertaining. </p>
<p>Do you have a team that you follow, or, do you have a favorite?</p>
<p>The European Cup is usually of a higher level than the World Cup. The teams are more close to one another than in the “other” tournament. This creates a lot of excitement but the plays might not be as entertaining as in the World Cup where you have surprises from unknown teams. </p>
<p>It does, however, seem that many players show how long the last season as been. The Dutch, for instances, known for their attacking soccer seem tired and spiritless. A player such as Robben does not seem to have overcome its disastrous Champion’s final. </p>
<p>This one will be unpredictable to the last game. I also hope that the champion will exhibit a better soccer than the winner of last two great cups. We do not want another “little” champion that squeaks by through a series of insipid 1-0 wins after weaving 600 back and forth passes for each scoring chance. </p>
<p>At least there are no vuvuzelas to ruin the soccer in Poland and Ukraine. One could only wonder what those crazy Russians and Poles would do with those african weapons of mass annoyances. I hope that the FIFA will come to its senses and stop truying to be so PC, and ban anything that comes close to those 3$$%& things in Brazil, and perhaps avoid to repeat the worst WC ever.</p>
<p>xiggi,</p>
<p>I knew it wouldn’t be too long before you came to rip Spain. Maybe if everyone doesn’t park the bus it won’t happen. Italy didn’t, and that game was thoroughly enjoyable, IMO.</p>
<p>Viva La Roja</p>
<p>I’m not sure where you get that xiggi… each team should play to its strength. Spain has a fantastic midfield and until Puyols and Villa got injured, imho the world’s best defense and a top-flight attack. With how much Torres, the only true finisher on the team, is struggling, don’t expect consistent goals from the Spaniards. If he was in 2008 form the score would’ve been 3-1 handily. And if Villa was there it would’ve been at least 2-1.</p>
<p>If you’re going to make a comment about “insipid” wins, I’m assuming you’re consistent about discounting the wins of 2006 Italy and 2004 Greece too.</p>
<p>how did Poland get this tournament again? When I went backpacking in Europe in 2008 the tournament was in Poland and the Czech Republic (I’m pretty sure).</p>
<p>I was rooting for the Netherlands, but they are done for and played terribly.</p>
<p>soccerguy,</p>
<p>It was in Austria and Switzerland. The Netherlands still has (albeit tiny) a chance to progress. All the game in the Group of Death have been exciting, even if at times the games weren’t top shelf.</p>
<p>2016 will be in France.</p>
<p>I love soccer + love the big sports events (WC, Olympics, . . .) I feel sorry for the Netherlands. My home team is Sweden (
, although tough to play a host team first). Gotta say Gomez has probably locked in his starting spot for Germany. The whole family has gotten a kick out of the “group of debt” references.</p>
<p>I’m quite disappointed at the Holland team. How could their level of play drop so much in 2 short years? Italy and Germany are also the team I’m rooting for. Spain and France are ok. Lost faith in England a while back.</p>
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<p>The strength of Spain is indeed their midfield. However, how many goals did the best offensive team scored in the last WC? Fwiw, the difference between the play of Xavi/Iniesta with Messi compared to the national team is obvious. Spain, obviously, does a have a great team, but a purely offensive powerhouse it is not. At the national level, tts system is based on ball possession and slowly breaking down the opponent; not to create a great number of chances. Do not confuse the national team with Barcelona. </p>
<p>As far as the defense goes, you do not seem to be too familiar with Spanish football. Although Puyol is an inspirational leader with great workrate, the rest of the defense has been iffy for a long time. Valencia’s Jordi Alba is nothing more than a decent defender, and nobody should be proud to align Alvaro Arbeloa, who is booed at the Bernabeu in Madrid on a regular basis. Mourinho’s greatest priority is to replace him. Add this to the lapses of concentration and poor form of Piqu</p>
<p>They showed pretty good offense today.</p>
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<p>I’m not sure whether you watch Barca… because that’s the exact way they play as well. Ball possession to break down the opponent’s defense. It has more solo brilliance courtesy of Messi, but he does not make the team (look at Messi with Argentina). Don’t pretend like all the offensive playmaking centers around him, Xavi is just as responsible for their attack - and I say this as a huge Messi fan.</p>
<p>Additionally, Spain led WC 2010 in shots attempted by a wide margin (tied with Uruguay in shots on target) compared to the other teams which played 7 games. Even if you go on a per game basis, they’re near the top. And if you’re going to use goals scored as an indicator of a paltry offense, I expect you to be consistent and use goals allowed as an indicator of a strong defense.</p>
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As far as the defense goes, you do not seem to be too familiar with Spanish football. Although Puyol is an inspirational leader with great workrate, the rest of the defense has been iffy for a long time. Valencia’s Jordi Alba is nothing more than a decent defender, and nobody should be proud to align Alvaro Arbeloa, who is booed at the Bernabeu in Madrid on a regular basis. Mourinho’s greatest priority is to replace him. Add this to the lapses of concentration and poor form of Piqu</p>
<p>I read a funny prediction on who will win EURO12 based on who has more control in ECB.</p>
<p>Germany
France
Italy
Spain</p>
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<p>You really ought to read what I wrote more carefully. Obviously, I know that the Spanish team emulates the way Barcelona plays. And why would they play differently with the basis players being identical! My point was that Spain does NOT have a Lionel Messi to bring the system to the level played by Barcelona. Look at the composition, if they had Villa this time and selected Cesc over Torres, you’d have almost every part of Barcelona, safe and except the one that bring the utmost geniality. Obviously, Xavi and Iniesta bring a lot to their team and it is not a Lionel Messi one-man-show. As can be seen with Argentina. It just happens that the magic happens when Messi is added to the mix of Xavi, Iniesta, etal. </p>
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<p>Same comment regarding reading more carefully. Pique is indeed one of the best defenders in the world. And that is why he is playing for Barcelona. However, he did not have one of his best seasons, and is the player most influenced by the absence of Puyol. Ramos has not been at his best for a long time, and if you cannot recognize that a tandem Pique/Ramos does not work as well as their reputation might indicate, I am not sure what to add. </p>
<p>As far as Alba, if you happen to think that Alba is a star (and better than decent at THIS level) power to you. I believe that his performance against Italy clearly showed his qualities and limitations. </p>
<p>Remember you were talking about “best defense” in the world. The current version of Spain is not at the level. </p>
<p>Understanding soccer is one concept that remains in the eye of the beholder. I think I do, but you are welcome to doubt that. That is what makes soccer such a captivating affair.</p>
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<p>Actually, she lives next door.</p>
<p>Yes, they were good today, but still have Croatia to face. Spain has always tried to be offensive. It’s just easier against some teams than others.</p>
<p>xiggi,
My wish is that Mou would leave.</p>
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<p>ah, thank you! I remember having a great time watching in Poland and the Czech Republic, so I guess my mind just moved the games to there! haha</p>
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<p>They don’t have a Messi, but they don’t need him to be an offensive powerhouse. Your logic is flawed. If nearly every piece of their attack is top-flight, it’s obvious their attack is (barring chemistry issues, which do not exist for Spain). What Spain’s missing is a top finisher, not a top playmaker. When they get good finishing like yesterday, you’ll see 3-4 goal results. Their midfield can create more than enough opportunities, with or without Messi.</p>
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<p>What’s to read more carefully? I realize you meant that they were in poor form right now, I simply disagreed. Pique is still very good, Ramos has not been at his best, but only if you think his reputation was build on being a purely technical defender (which he never has been). He’s still very solid though playing out of position. Either way:</p>
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<p>I suggest you also read more carefully. I said up until Puyol was injured - if he wasn’t Ramos wouldn’t have to play inside, and other than Capdevila, it would have been the same back line that gave up 2 goals through the WC.</p>
<p>Just because the defense is worse than it used to be doesn’t mean it’s not still strong. Any line backstopped by Casillas is world class. And who are you going to argue has significantly stronger defenses? Italy and Germany (maybe Brazil). But you couldn’t say any of them are definitively better.</p>
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<p>I don’t think he’s a star, but he’s better than decent. I’d say he’s pretty good, and he’s still young.</p>
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<p>Oh brother! This is hopeless. You are simply arguing for the sake of arguing. I hope you realize that Messi is not only a creative genius but a lethal finisher. And, that is the difference between the two teams in terms of entertainment. This said, arguing is just part of what sports fan do! Pick any sports and fans will wear different color lenses when it comes to teams they like or do not like. I find myself liking to watch the club teams in Spain very much and being less than captivated by their national team. I did not have such strong opinions about it until the last WC, which I considered a total disaster on and off the field. The fact that Spain won it by scoring 8 goals (and overcoming a loss to the mighty Swiss team) was the cherry on top of a foul-tasting cake. </p>
<p>And, fwiw, were Spain able to rely to a a top flight attack, Del Bosque would not have to keep going to Torres, who has been a ghost of a player for a long while. While it might change when Villa returns (and returns to his form of two years ago) the current reality is that having to choose between Torres and a player is who is not a pure forward (Cesc) shows that Spain does not have one of the best ATTACKS in the world. A fact that is not hard to verify by looking at the rosters of the best Spanish clubs, and at the Pichichi rankings.</p>
<p>With Messi they would have been in quarter finals now. Torres lost a couple of golden scoring opportunities. He redeemed himself by scoring twice vs Ireland.</p>
<p>I’m not arguing for the sake of arguing - you’re simply ignoring half of my posts to make absurd points which I’ve already commented on in full. I see you’ve already given up trying to argue that Spain’s defense is a sieve. Messi is an amazing finisher, but he has to play behind someone - which brings Spain right back to the original problem of a consistent CF. I also specifically stated that Spain had a top flight attack WITH Villa, and are on much shakier ground with Torres. In fact, I said that twice. What were you saying about reading carefully?</p>
<p>PS - 2006 France had 9 goals. Were they awful too and undeserving of getting to the finals?</p>