failed college classes

franglish · May 11, 2009, 7:21am

Yes, this is definitely something that we all wish we could do, but don’t be surprised if this turns out to be very difficult. Because of the FIRPA laws, parents of kids who are over 18 are legally not permitted to speak to or hear from anyone from colleges unless the kid is in a real emergency. The kid has to sign a waiver in order for the college to talk to parents. Of course, we pay the bills, but they are not even allowed to tell us the balance on the bill before we pay it. It can be very hard. Try to call them, of course, but don’t be surprised if you are politely turned down.

HImom · May 11, 2009, 12:48pm

Yes, I meant that the student needs to do the contacting and consent if they want the parents involved. For my D, we let her handle it because SHE is the student and needs to get her own messes straightened out. We told her we’d support her but impressed her with it being HER challenge to straighten out. She took it to heart and worked with her counselor and each of the instructors involved, which impressed them MUCH more than if we as mom and dad tried to get involved. Her being able to resolve everything on her own helped her and us realize that she was ready to transfer to a school thousands of miles away where we’d have to pay lots in tuition & expenses. She’s there now and doing great–socially and academically.

Because of FIRPA, both of my kids signed forms as soon as they enrolled in expensive out-of-state private U that we have access to their records so we can help make sure their charges are correct and can pay accordingly. Both kids were fine with signing the appropriate forms. They also signed forms so we have access to medical info, but so far we haven’t had to test whether the consents were effective.

I have not gotten involved in getting anything worked out for them since they left HS because it is their job. We did hassle S until he got his “I” in a course changed to the letter grade he earned, letting him know it would become an “F” and calculated accordingly if he didn’t get himself in gear to take appropriate action. Several semesters later, he finally cleared it up. S also challenged a grade and paid the corresponding fee–I have no idea what that was about but respect that it was something he felt needed to be done. (He also challenged grades in HS when the instructor miscalculated and was able to get the grades raised to what he had earned.}

Our kids do need to learn to deal with the bureacracy to get things done if we are raising them to be independent. I feel it is their job and I’ll just make sure that they have us encouraging them along the way but they know that it is they that are supposed to make things happen in college, not us. They have taken it to heart. It is good training for when they leave academia and need to work things out in their work environment. Similarly, they have worked out summer jobs/internships on their own, but we do offer them tips & leads when we learn about them. We are very pleased that they are becoming increasingly self-reliant and independent.

MiamiDAP · May 11, 2009, 2:21pm

School Policy is one side. Another is did he identify why he failed and what hes needs to do differently to make it successful for him. Was he physically OK, was he sick or not well for other reasons that caused this situation? Still, another point is having low GPA after graduation. Who is going to hire him or what Grad school is going to accept him with low GPA? These look to me as more serious questions than merely dealing with policies.

PackMom · May 11, 2009, 4:14pm

Our state u. system will allow students to retake up to three classes in which a D or F was made. This is only allowed if the course was a 100/200 level course. It’s basically for kids who do poorly in freshman/soph year to enable them to get it together and have a chance at redemption.

If the course is retaken, the F grade will be replaced by the new better grade. The F will still appear on the student’s transcript but will not be used in gpa calculations. S2 had a horrible first sem. and was put on academic probation for Spring. He used all three of his grade replacements this semester and did much better.

OP, you can prob. look on the school’s webpage and do a search for the rules about academic probations, what gpa is needed to continue, can classes be repeated, etc.

HImom · May 11, 2009, 4:40pm

Not all employers ask about GPA, especially after the 1st job, where the former employer’s recommendations are much more important than GPA. At this point, it seems rather speculative to worry about admittance to any grad school. IF that is something OP wants, it may have to be something to consider after getting things “together,” getting 1st degree and working then applying to any grad school. Life experience is a big plus for many who want grad school.

MiamiDAP · May 12, 2009, 9:02am

I was asked about my GPA during interview after having MBA, 25 years of experience in a field and 8 places of employment all in the same city where references could be obtained very easily. I replied that I did not remember, but they can estimate based on Magna Cum Laude. I got the job. Sometime, in particular when economy is so bad that empolyers will potentially have hundreds of resumes for one position, you need accumulate as much plusses on your application as possible. I do not see any reason for spending 4 years and a lot of money and getting low GPA at the end that will potentially haunt you for the rest of your professional life. Just does not make much sense.

Mitdu · May 19, 2009, 1:22pm

Newbie here!

My son has just completed his freshman year at a large state university. Things aren’t good. My question: how do I show my son that we support him, but also give him the time and space to handle things for himself–even if they don’t turn out well?

He ended the first semester with a failed class, a 1.2 GPA and was placed on Academic Probation. He admitted he partied too much, didn’t work hard enough, and promised to work harder second semester.

He worked much harder this semester, but it still wasn’t enough. He ended the second semester with an F in Algebra, a 2.2 GPA and was suspended. His Advisor petitioned the Registrar, he’s being allowed to return in the fall, but if he doesn’t get a 2.5, he’s out.

Dear Son has what educators call a “Specific Learning Disability.” He is a multi-sensory learner with incredibly keen insight. He’s a gifted musician and athlete, and incredibly talented in any science lab. He’s a very deep thinker and a hands-on learner.

However, he doesn’t learn well with words or sequential information. His brain gets overwhelmed with information presented in lectures or when reading textbooks. He’s been a lousy test-taker since elementary school. He knows the information, but can’t retrieve it or express it well during tests.

He is embarrassed by the “dyslexia” label and refuses to ask for help from the university’s Disabilities office. He has recently changed his major to Geology with a minor in music (oboe performance.) Previously he was majoring in Secondary Science Education.

To cope, Dear Son has been apparently turning to alcohol and smoking. Pretty common for bright kids who struggle in school, but it only increases his risk of failing. While he is definitely the silent type, he told me last fall he thinks he may be depressed. But he refuses to go to the doctor for it.

The learning issues are hereditary. My husband has the same type of learning profile and struggled to get through high school and college. dh is a smart guy but not a great student. We encouraged ds to go to a smaller college with small classes and more 1:1, but he chose the biggest university in the state.

ds has always ignored others’ advice and seems to only learn by doing. That includes making mistakes.

But like others on this board, I don’t know if we can financially afford the cost of his mistakes.

Over the years, I’ve seen him pull through tough times and even shine. But it ALWAYS takes him longer to acclimate and adjust. I just don’t know if college will allow him that time and flexibility.

jasmom · May 19, 2009, 1:40pm

I might consider suggesting a semester off (until depression and substance use/abuse can be ameliorated). I certainly would not fund another semester unless/until he devises a reasonable plan with adequate use of university/college/other supports.

Cardinal_Fang · May 19, 2009, 2:07pm

Mitdu, it’s time for some tough love. Let your son take time off. Let him prove, at community college or wherever, that he can succeed in college. Or let him stay in college, but he pays.

I understand about learning disabilities; my son has them too. But your son needs to figure out how to succeed in school before wasting any more of your money. He needs to learn to advocate for himself, and he needs to get treatment for his depression if that’s a problem. He also may need to figure out some different learning strategies. Most colleges have tutoring available-- that could help.

He won’t do anyone any good if he just goes back to his college in the fall and changes nothing. Have you thought of summer courses? If he could prove himself in the summer, then he might be ready to go to school in the fall.

ellemenope · May 19, 2009, 2:08pm

The gpa progession is good–1.2=>2.2=>higher than 2.5? Sounds like avoiding math next semester is a must do.

I’d take a class that you had real trouble with in the summer. Take only that class and have a tutor. It is really hard to try to master an area in which you have real trouble when you’re trying to have a social life, do well in your other classes, etc.

Cardinal_Fang · May 19, 2009, 2:28pm

I don’t see how Mitdu’s son can avoid taking the math classes and still major in Geology. He has some science courses to take, and they’re going to have pre-calculus as a requirement.

He should do Algebra this summer at community college.

Mitdu · May 19, 2009, 3:45pm

Thanks, everyone!

Part of me wants to yank him out of school for a year, force him to go to counseling, and stop the expensive nonsense. Part of me believe this is all part of him growing up, accepting consequences, testing and learning his limits, and finding his strengths. I’ve seen a lot more maturity since Christmas.

After the very bad first semester, my husband, son and I had a productive meeting. We discussed–and wrote down–who would do what. What would ds do differently? What were his expectations of us? What if it didn’t work out? That will be the foundation for the next talk.

He proactively contacted his Advisor last Friday when his grades were posted on line. He contacted her even before he told us of his final grades. He has also been working with her on selecting a different Algebra professor for the retake.

I had also thought about summer school at the community college. He’s lifeguarding all summer and is assistant manager at that pool. But academics are the priority.

The college loans are all in his name. We may help him (and his younger sister) pay off their college loans if we can. But even before he went to college, we told him we would not pay for any failed classes or any retakes. I already have a spreadsheet set up!

PackMom · May 19, 2009, 5:12pm

Mitdu, My S2 (who I posted about earlier in this thread) also attends a large state u. in NC (not the same as your S).
When he was put on Academic probation after the first semester, I prepared myself for the possibility of more of the same by looking ahead to see what the university’s consequences would be if he did not pull his gpa up enough in the second semester.

His school’s policy is that if a student is suspended for a semester, he is not allowed to take courses at any other school during the suspenscion period. They will not accept classes as transfer credit if taken during the suspenscion.

I know you said that his advisor had been able to gain him a reprieve for Fall semester but you might need to double check before having him take any courses at the CC this summer to make sure they will be accepted for transfer credit under the circumstances.
Most of the state u’s in the system have similiar policies so it might be worth your while to check.

Did your S retake the classes he did poorly in for first sem.? My S2 retook three classes in the second semester. The gpa improvement was temendous. 
He made a .307 (yes, that’s right) in his first sem. He retook three failed classes in the second sem. made a 2.571 for the sem. and brought his .307 up to an overall 2.105 using grade replacements. He is now off Academic Probation and in good standing with the univ. Grade replacements can be life savers in these situations if the student is ready to make the turn around.

Mitdu · May 20, 2009, 8:11am

Thanks Packmom. I did not even think about a possible policy prohibiting him from taking classes at a community college while on Suspension. I’ll have to look into that–or have ds look into that.

He will not have to retake the specific class he failed the first semester. It was an elective. (A class in Ethics, ironically!) He said he really enjoyed the class but the grade was based on just his Midterm and Final. He failed both tests in Ethics, a common pattern for him in every subject since about 1st grade. Retaking Ethics with grade replacement is a possibility.

(In case you’re wondering, he has taken Study Skills classes and Test Taking strategy classes for many years, with no real benefit. He also went to a private tutor weekly since 6th grade. Every teacher, tutor and neuropsychologist agrees: he learns and processes information differently than most students.)

Congrats to your son for his incredible turnaround!

peppermintlounge · May 20, 2009, 8:42am

One of the things I realize with my HS DS1 is that progression - and recovery from a mess of one’s own creation like grade debacles are - is not linear. Certainly - that’s true in college as well. The student’s poor expectations for himself/herself after a semester like that can really influence the present performance. It was hard for my DS1 (whose issues were in an AP HS class) to admit that he screwed up and to take corrective measures…Keep the carrot and the stick going at the same time…

momofthreeboys · May 20, 2009, 8:42am

Agree with everyone here, it is imperative to get to the root of the problem. Often, as some have said, the first semester is a shocker, but second semester the kids kick in and understand what it takes to make the necessary grades. Two failed semester’s in a row requires some heavy duty retooling. Some kids don’t have the maturity to move from HS to college. Some kids need a few years to find the inner passion. I’ve had friends call is Grade 13 syndrome…the kids don’t understand it isn’t Grade 13…it’s much more than that. I don’t have any advice, as I’ve seen it happen with the children of friends and each situation was handled differently but as a parent, I feel for you. We tend to just expect that our achieving high school kids will go off to college and achieve. Rest assured that I’ve watched these friends kid all go on and find a life path…some faster, some slower, but they have all found a path. I will say, that the ones that found the path faster had parents who did not prop them up.

poetgrl · May 20, 2009, 9:15am

–Is there any possibility that your S might be willing to investigate getting re-tested over the summer and getting accomodations for his dyslexia? Big State Universities, because they tend to get federal and state funds, have to accomodate at a very strong level. Also, NC is one of the states which really does extremely well in this area, and is considered to be a leader and innovator. The professors I know who teach there rave about the creativity and ability of the LD kids and all that they bring to the table. I “get” that he feels uncomfortable about it, and I know it is a decision he would have to make for himself. But, to suffer needlessly, and more importantly, to not get an excellent education because he is constantly stressed and unable to perform, is such a needless waste. We are really moving into a post reading and writing economy, right now, and though education has not yet caught up, your son might really benefit from understanding that the strengths he brings, as a dyslexic, far outweigh the deficits. There a psychologists who not only test but based on the tests spend some time explaining the strengths and weaknesses to the student, and how to best utilize the strengths to compensate for these blind-spots. (I have a dyslexic, dysgraphic D, just so you know I know how challenging it can be to watch talented kids in this type of situation.)

momofthreeboys · May 20, 2009, 9:34am

As I usually do, I agree with Poetgl re: Mitdu’s situation. For the most part, and as a parent of dyslexic, they are highly intelligent and their LD shows itself in specific types of situations, especially as the child grows older and learns to compensate for many of the issues. The dyslexia on top of the experience of heading off to college will definitely require another adjustment (on top of all the ones dyslexics make along the way from elementary through high school.) My son is comfortable with his LD, but as he grows older I’ve noticed he is inclined to want to “hide it” and resist help that is available to him as he doesn’t want to be classified as “dumb” when clearly he is not. The Disability office at the school may be able to help him with his personal concerns regarding that aspect also. Oh a lighter note, I’ve not yet met a high IQ dyslexic without other issues that isn’t highly social and gregarious…this can be a problem in and of itself in college. Not sure if the highly social + dyslexia is a research proven theory but it is this mom’s theory LOL.

poetgrl · May 20, 2009, 9:40am

Right? One more party and I’m going to die of exhuastion. “Oh, Mom, it’ll only be like 20 of us…” But, such good kids, too.

Mitdu · May 20, 2009, 11:05am

You guys are great!

momofthree–I’m really trying to let him find his own path, as hard as it is to watch him stumble. In middle and high school, I repeatedly told his teachers that he “learns by doing, not by listening.” It doesn’t just apply to teachers’ lectures in Chemistry or Psychology class, it also applies to any lectures Mom and Dad are tempted to subject him to. He doesn’t learn unless he experiences it for himself.

poetgrl–Retesting is not necessary to get disability services from the university. The Disabilities Coordinator has already offered to help in any way possible. And new eval scores probably wouldn’t change the accommodations the college could provide. He has such wacky psychoeducational evals with incredible scatter. He doesn’t fit the traditional model of IQ/achievement discrepancy. One neuropsych emphatically told me it was “impossible” for a person to get the scores my son got on the IQ and achievement tests. But he did, even on retesting. The neuropsych then told me my son would never graduate from high school. He did graduate…and with a 3.2 GPA.

What my son must do is accept his learning style and embrace that it does not mean he is “dumb.” He can articulate his learning strengths and weaknesses and had a “self-advocacy” goal on his IEP through high school. But when he went off to college, I think he wanted to just put all of that behind him.

Unlike the personality type momofthree described, ds is introverted and analytical. INTJ. [Portrait</a> of an INTJ](<a href=“http://www.personalitypage.com/INTJ.html]Portrait”>Portrait of an INTJ) As it says, he appears to others as “aloof and reserved.” He is a man of very few words. He skillfully hides any emotion and always appears unruffled, calm, cool and collected. He strongly dislikes appearing that he needs anything from anyone. He is very stubborn, extremely independent and “convinced that he is right about things.” That’s part of being 19 years old. It’s also part of his innate personality.

I am convinced he will find his way through this and find his version of success. He will likely emerge with some scrapes and scars. I’m just trying to figure out when to speak and when to just let him flounder–and how to keep my sanity in the process!

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