Failing to launch, or just sputtering

Parents Forum
1

<p>This summer I visited with friends I hadn’t seen in 18 or so years. Their children are a bit older than mine- 2 have graduated from an ‘elite’ university, the 3rd is a junior this year. The parents are both physicians and the father has an academic affiliation- they both graduated from the same ‘elite’ for college and med school and the father of one of the parents teaches a ‘hard science’ at that elite. Just the basic outline of an academically oriented and mostly technically oriented family. </p>

<p>Our brunch discussion, naturally, took a turn towards the lives of our children- pretty much what we were discussing 18 years ago! They were discussing the phenomena worriesome to them and their peers of very talented kids who in the post college years (undergrad completed) seem less purposeful and goal directed than they might be. Among their friends they note that MANY have children who are not on career paths (male and female both), particularly those who have liberal arts credentials. In many cases parental support is still being provided. </p>

<p>Since I had a clear cut career track as did my husband (again, in technical fields) I too ‘observe’ this issue related to my 2 eldest who are pursuing liberal arts. As the eldest has finished half his undergraduate years I found myself talking with him this summer about getting a HS teaching credential as a reasonable ‘safety net’ given his own positive experiences in this sense.</p>

<p>I wonder, though, about the paths that kids expect to have, that parents expect them to have-- and how truly tolerant and accepting of ‘alternatives’ we all are. When the path is not crystal clear, what is reasonable to hope for or expect from a 22 year old? The son of a dear friend took a job out of college which so ill suited him he began having panic attacks (having graduated with highest honors from a most elite LAC)-- and it occurred to me that his college summers had not been spent in ‘possible career related endeavors’. Hence, I have encouraged my older 2 to look at summer as a ‘try it out’ time. </p>

<p>Beyond this, and hoping for a stimulating undergraduate experience, can someone enlighten me as to experiences in the real world that have helped make the launching phase a productive and reinforcing one for kids who really could do whatever they want!!</p>

2

<p>I think the most helpful experience is to know that you don’t have to have it all figured out. I’d have a panic attack too if I had graduated from an elite LAC and felt my parents tapping their feet waiting for me to launch a career that was on par with what expected after paying up for an elite education.</p>

<p>No matter what the name on the degree, these are 22 year olds. The vast majority still need a few years to find themselves.</p>

<p>The most creative and effective people I work with started in the call center at our company either part time during college or shortly after college. It is so not a glamourous job, but you learn so much about the business so quickly and turnover is high so you can advance quickly if you are bright and motivated. </p>

<p>Help desk jobs, call center jobs, retail…just get out there and do SOMETHING and if nothing else start earning a paycheck. Don’t think it’s your career and don’t think it has to be forever. After all , there is always grad school!</p>

3

<p>time and chance happeneth … one S at top LAC fell in love with a fellow student who liked to fly, they both joined the Marines at graduation, now both pilots; other S, top LAC, recruited by alum to partner in a dot.com that defied logic and succeeded. Both entirely unplanned outcomes. None of my business. Relax.</p>

4

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<p>I can see a couple of things happening here. First, work is hard. For the most part, a career is a lot harder than college or summer internships, etc… if you could get someone to support you while you flirted with work, rather than have to actually commit to a career, wouldn’t you? </p>

<p>Secondly, some kids have been on a fairly structured path from kindergarten through college. The time after college, especially for those with liberal arts interests, can be wide open. The road may not be clear. This might be overwhelming or exhilerating, depending on the kid. Procrastinating is a way of coping. </p>

<p>I think it’s up to the parents to cut out the financial help if they expect their kids to get serious about post-education jobs.</p>

5

<p>Well, launching for our firstborn turned out to be trickier than we had expected. He entered college with a clear plan: major in Japanese and take a lot of engineering courses, do a summer internship in Japan, do the fifth year engineering program for a master’s, then get a job and later work on a PhD. Well, things just didn’t work out for him. He didn’t get the positions he put in for. He spent a year after graduation at home, spinning his wheels, working very part-time, still, unfortunately, supported by Mom and Dad. It was a time where he did a lot of reflection, but also wasted a lot of time. We really didn’t know what to expect of him, but tried to be supportive and encouraging, while at the same time pushing him just a bit to find his path.</p>

<p>Then, unexpectedly, an opportunity arose, and he jumped on it. He is now working in Japan in a position that doesn’t pay a lot, but which is teaching him many, many skills that will be very useful to him in future years. His future plans are changing and still vague, but he loves where he is, and I can see tremendous growth and learning taking place. I did convince him to take the GRE, in case he does want to go on to grad school, but much remains uncertain at present.</p>

<p>I can empathize, however. It took me several false starts before I found what I wanted to do with my life, and I have confidence that he, too, will find his path, even if it does involve a little wandering first.</p>

6

<p>Just to defend the dear friend, she felt the son was ill suited for the job before he started and since has been trying to encourage him to see the physical response for what it is- symptom of poor fit- at least at this point. He basically took the first reasonable job that a recruiter offered–no pressure from parents for immediate ‘returns’ for the high ticket school. </p>

<p>Since I spent my immediate post college years in med school/training and because my husband to be (engineer) went from great job to grad school to great job-- neither of us really was ‘seeing’ what happens to kids when the trajectory isn’t the same/as defined(especially me, I was barely awake most of the time when my nose wasn’t in a book or I wasn’t on call) I always wanted my kids to not have to ‘declare’ themselves early on, as I feel I was pushed to do-- but if there are ways to support the process, would like to provide advice and support (if asked.)…</p>

<p>I am fine with a bit of chaos, I have faith in entropy. But, I learned something by watching the son of my friend, so want to learn from the lessons of others as well!!</p>

7

<p>The fact of the matter is that for most LArts grads entry level jobs are in actuality below entry level positions. What will see them through in the future is the personal talents and qualities which were instrumental in their ability to attend a highly selective LAC. However what this also confirms the findings of Kreuger and Dale, ie that their future success would have been likely to be the same regardless of the college they had attended.</p>

<p>I have seen the post grad employment data from Columbia University and most posters would be surprised at the entry level salaries which their LArts grads accept. And if these salaries reflect the fact that a significant number choose to remain in NYC, many salaries barely manage to reach subsistance level. However I suspect that if you were to track these students for a number of years, we would find that they would generally find significant success in whatever career path they ultimately chose because of their innate talents and personal attributes. But then the same could be said if they had chosen to attend City College.</p>

8

<p>In my opinion, the time to live poor is post-grad (20s) up until your first child is born. Even then, a parent should expect a ramp up to the optimum earning level.</p>

<p>That said, I’m down with the anti-float campaign. I want mine taking courses in their major from the get-go. No farting about trying to decide what your major. The rest of the world doesn’t do that. Pick a ‘close enough’ major and take electives to satisfy yearnings in other directions.</p>

<p>Every summer from Senior year hs onwards should be spent in a life building endeavor; ie not serving ice cream at DQ. We’ve supported our son in intensive language programs and unpaid internships. Though he’s just a rising junior, he’s come home for the month and been offered two additional internships–one at the distinguished local newspaper doing a research project for the leading reporter and one with the Crown Prosecuter’s office with the senior law partner. He got those offers of the strength of his baby CV and unpaid internships–and, stop the presses, the paper is going to pay him (!). The additional internships will give him a window into further career and grad school choices.</p>

<p>To keep a kid moving forward, on the rails, the endpoint has to be compelling, attainable and visible. The build up of these focused experiences is doing just that fro my son. He was never happier or as swtiched on as when he was an intern on Capital Hill sitting in on various hearings, listening to future political stars, surrounded by amazing peer talent. These early experiences and mentors will surely provide a fantastic gateway after graduation–something that a landscaping or dock job cannot provide.</p>

9

<p>my sister lives barely able to pay her rent in this gorgeous apatment that she would think u were crazy if u told her to give it up for something less expensive wouldnt u like to live in laguna beach Cali w/ a view of the ocean?? she lives w/ her friend and its a little more reasonable…but she part time does DISPLAy something(Fashion merch. major) and part time dog walks…but she loves both jobs but seriously she cannot pay for much she just got a 1 eyed PUG! mas(my annoying sister) is 23</p>

<p>My oldest is a little more financially stabled has an ok job at a mag. but she is not happy w/ it makes 40-something thousand got a great apartment(Really good price)shares it w/ someone new and shes got really good benefits w/ work(one of the benefits for working for a big Mag. Corporation…)</p>

<p>I LOVE BOTH My sisters but…sheesh my sister couldnt be any more Financially stable(middle sister)</p>

10

<p>“When the path is not crystal clear, what is reasonable to hope for or expect from a 22 year old? The son of a dear friend took a job out of college which so ill suited him he began having panic attacks (having graduated with highest honors from a most elite LAC)-- and it occurred to me that his college summers had not been spent in ‘possible career related endeavors’. Hence, I have encouraged my older 2 to look at summer as a ‘try it out’ time.”</p>

<p>Reasonable to expect that a 22-year-old who has graduated from college wil be supporting themselves without parental assistance. This may mean working 60 hour weeks or sharing an apartment in a low rent area. </p>

<p>I also expect college students to spend their summers working or doing something like research or volunteer work that’s directly related to gaining skills for the job market or skills to get into graduate school. I don’t understand why so many parents now seem to think that since college is “hard” students should spend their summers relaxing.</p>

<p>I doubt that most parents did that during their summers in college. I spent mine working, and also worked during the school year. I didn’t feel that I was being hurt by working. I felt proud and independent. In those old days, having internships, etc. wasn’t essential in order to get a decent job after graduation. Now, however, most companies won’t hire graduating seniors for decent jobs unless the students have done internships.</p>

<p>I think that somehow some parents think that students should automatically graduate from college to a lifestyle similar to how they were raised. My thoughts are that one earns that lifestyle, parents shouldn’t give it to their offspring by subsidizing their expenses, etc.</p>

<p>For the record, one of my sons is 22 and a drop out from college who’s working temporary jobs and living on the other side of the country. The only thing that my husband and I provide for him is health insurance. S’s living a marginal lifestyle, which is his own choice, results from his decisions, and we’re not going to subsidize him and thus give him a distorted sense of the type of life he has earned for himself.</p>

<p>My other s is 18 and taking a gap year working for Americorps in our home town . By his choice (after noticing the limited apartment choices on his income), he is living at home and paying us rent because husband and I want S to have a realistic view of his limited options without a college degree. While we are happy that he is volunteering with Americorps, we still want him to have a gut level understanding of the limitations of earning $800 a month.</p>

<p>When he goes to college, if he is still living at home, we would not expect him to pay rent since he’d be using his earnings to help pay for college.</p>