My mom had two brothers. One ran afoul of the IRS and when my grandma passed away the other siblings gave him a large sum of the cash in return for him signing a document relinquishing any other claims to the inheritance (not a huge amount of money, but some property). Long story short, the notarized version of the document was given to the IRS to remove a levy from a property that was being sold. Many years later, mom and that uncle have passed away and we’re left with several other jointly held properties and want to sell/donate/dispose of them. The other uncle who witnessed the prior signing is still alive and happy to help resolve this mess!
We have copies of the signed document, but they aren’t notarized. I’m wondering if there’s any possibility that the IRS would allow us to have a copy of the notarized version. I’m assuming it’s somewhere in electronic form since this happened in 1998.
Any thoughts? We have retained a pricey lawyer, but we’ve just started processing mom’s succession paperwork and he hasn’t rendered any opinion on this yet. I’m tempted to call the IRS, but not sure who/what to ask!
I’d be really surprised if the IRS retained either a hardcopy or electronic copy of the document. In 1998, electronic documentation was not ubiquitous.
Are you asking the IRS to release a lien on these other properties? Was uncle an owner of these properties? If his name is on the deeds, it is of course a much bigger problem than if he just had a claim to them. It will also depend on which state the property is in because in some states if his name is not on the deed, there is notclaim. In other states if the parties know about the claim, it can be held against them.
All a notary does is prove that the document was signed by the party without having to prove it. If no one is contesting that the signatures are his, it shouldn’t be a problem but you’ll need to prove the signature. The othere uncle having witnessed it should be proof enough. The IRS might take the document and another document supporting the signed copy. A title company also might be helpful, but I doubt they’d write a policy over the IRS lien, so it will have to be removed.
The info as related by OP doesn’t really make any sense. The notarized document would have no legal bearing whatsoever on title to the property. Either the dead uncle’s name is currently on the property or it isn’t; legal title is determined by deeds, not waivers. (Unless the OP is mistakenly describing a Quitclaim Deed as a document relinquishing claims---- but a deed isn’t worth much unless recorded in any event - and I doubt that sort of document would have been forwarded to IRS).
If the property title currently shows dead uncle’s name, then the next question is the form of ownership. In a joint tenancy, when a property owner dies, the property interest expires and automatically is taken over by the remaining owners. There is a fairly simply legal process to follow which involves submission of a certified copy of the death certificate along with some other basic paperwork.
If the property was a tenancy in common, then the dead uncle’s interest is something that would be part of his estate, which would need to be handled through probate (for the dead uncle).
Whatever dead uncle signed and sent to the IRS, it has no impact on the record title of the property. It sounds like the dead uncle might have signed paperwork with the intent of getting an IRS lien lifted, but it’s not clear whether appropriate legal documents were filed as to title of remaining properties.
The way I read it is her mom and two uncles were left an estate by her grandparents. In order to avoid turning a third of the estate over to the IRS they had one uncle sign his share of the estate away for compensation.
The entire deal never would or should be honored.
There’s nothing wrong with the deal, if IRS was satisfied – but if in fact the uncle was relinquishing his claims on the property, then they needed to also have him execute and record a Quitclaim deed to get his name off the property.
If that wasn’t done, no way to fix that post-mortem.
If the IRS was satisfied there would either be a release of lien on the property or a full satisfaction of the judgment against the uncle.
I have seen it more times than I can count where family members believe they can transfer property out of the name of a relative that has an existing judgment.
I love when divorce attorneys prepare settlements granting ownership of a property to one spouse when the other spouse has an existing tax judgment and the poor spouse thinks they have clear title.
When they call me I always asked who signed the agreement for the judgment creditor
Well apparently there was a release of the lien, because according to the OP, that particular piece of property was sold. IRS must have gotten their money-- if not, and if the dead uncle’s name is on the other properties, IRS would have slapped the lien on the others as well.
Obviously, given the reference to “family drama” there’s probably more to this story than OP has let on. Perhaps the uncle’s name was taken off the property, but the uncle’s offspring are now trying to claim an interest in the OP’s mother’s probate.
I think this is something for the retained pricey lawyer to try to figure out.