<p>
</p>
<p>What a pointless, useless skill to insist on unless someone’s really interested in computers (in which case, have at it). You know who builds and services my computers? The friendly folks at Apple. Talk about classic geek-who-thinks-everyone-else-should-share-his-interests. Same for building / repairing car engines. Again, if a kid is genuinely into that, terrific - but why force those interests? Specialization and division of labor, baby. That’s what makes this economy run.</p>
<p>Thanks to whoever pointed out about where to find comments in the piece. There’s this bit from the editor (click on the small square to the right of the second paragraph labelled “SM”)</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>which of course raises a lot of questions as well. Shame on the editor for not having a more apt title for the article. </p>
<p>There’s also a comment from “Child #8” who has his own website–he’s a PhD student in software engineering, started undergrad at UMass (tennis player) and finished undergrad at UC Irvine. The family is indeed Mormon. </p>
<p>Agree with blueiguana that flexibility is key, but I’ve only raised two kids not 12. The father’s one-size-fits-all-families attitude is self-congratulatory, but c’mon people, it worked for his family. Not getting why so many folks here, rightly bristling about being lectured on how to raise their own families, are taking it upon themselves to tar and feather another parent. Whatever works, folks. Your mileage may vary.</p>
<p>I have nothing against large families. But these people essentially had two large families in one. Twelve kids? I simply don’t believe that it is possible to give appropriate attention to that many kids. (Sure, many kids in smaller families don’t get enough attention, either, but at least it’s possible.) This is evidenced, I think, by a lot of the details–like kids reading to each other, and making sure that all of the kids are out of the house at sports and clubs.</p>
<p>On the plus side, in this family you get a car (albeit a junk car) for your sixteenth birthday.</p>
<p>Hardly, Pizzagirl. A large family has a different dynamic, structure, and vibe than smaller families. A difference that some take to or avoid. </p>
<p>
I don’t believe those with big families that other people envy them, but it’s clear that people feel some type of way about large families. </p>
<p>There are quite a few blogs, forums, and articles about the remarks people make when they see parents with multiple children, and from what I’ve interpreted, most of the parents are over the remarks and looks.</p>
<p>I do agree that with a family this large, the parents can’t do it all. Essentially, you have kids raising kids, ensuring their younger siblings are tended to.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>But I don’t believe all large families have some uniform dynamic, structure and vibe and that all small families have a different (but similar to one another) dynamic, structure and vibe. Look, there are families with 2 - 3 children where the children are close to one another as adults … and where they are distant to one another as adults. Same thing for families with 6, 8 or 12 children. </p>
<p>I’m one of 2. I would pick my sister as my best friend any day even if we weren’t related. OTOH, H is one of 3 and he really doesn’t have much in common with his siblings other than they grew up in the same household. That’s not a function of the size of family. That’s a function of the people involved. There’s nothing magical about any size, large or small, that “guarantees” closeness or functionality. All you can say about large families is that there are more of them and therefore resources are spread thinner. You can’t argue that they’re “closer” or “more loving” or conversely that they are “more distant” or “less loving.”</p>
<p>Sounds like a spin off of the Duggar’s on TLC. Unlike the Duggar’s, at least they let their kids go to college. The Duggar’s only allow homeschooling and online schooling. Mom and Dad are afraid they’ll be corrupted by society.</p>
<p>No, you certainly can’t argue that PG. But, they do have a different dynamic. I know several families like this. One with 14 kids, one 12, and one 9, although one is deceased…so 8. What happens in virtually all of them is that the older kids take care of the younger kids and they develop a different kind of sibling relationship. Not better or worse. Just different.</p>
<p>
Ok, and neither do I. </p>
<p>No one is arguing that larger families have more love or are closer. Different families have different dynamics. There are aspects of a large family that people take to or avoid.</p>
<p>My mother’s sister and her husband raised six kids, all adopted, as were my brother and I. We used to stay with them when we visited my mom’s hometown. They were raised in an atomosphere very much like the one outlined in the article. Some have done better than others as adults, but they haven’t achieved anything like the success rate touted in this article. As for my brother and me, we were considered “rich” and “spoiled” by this family, but by and large have had more stable, successful lives as adults. And, like a lot of posters, I would have gone bonkers had I been raised in a family like this!</p>
<p>Slithey Tov- good point about not pointing fingers. There are many ways to raise kids and this one worked for them. My wish was to see more about the how they worked out the “no pay” college and weddings, beyond that they did, and some of the sentimental approaches to the weddings. Maybe there will be a follow up article.</p>
<p>All I can say is that I’d have been a sobbing mess if my father had said, “Here’s your computer, figure out how to put it together, and here’s you pieces of car-go for it”. I am not mechanical and I’m not a strong person so I don’t see myself ever lifting large car parts and welding it all together. And I could probably figure out what slots to put computer pieces into, but I barely passed the one programming course I took. I’d have opted to walk everywhere, and stay offline I guess, unless that got me beaten. </p>
<p>And my SIL would be dead if her father had said, “Eat this melon or starve,” since she’s got a deadly allergic reaction to it.</p>
<p>Forcing a sport might have been problematic for my youngest when her asthma was really bad, but hey, it was probably all in her head. </p>
<p>My sister-gosh, I don’t know. She had an undiagnosed LD and was called stupid by some of her teachers-AP classes, ALL of them? She’d have probably run away from home. Or worse.</p>
<p>And the way he “paid” for things was to NOT pay for anything major-those kids paid their own way and for their own weddings. </p>
<p>The guy sounds like a control freak of the highest order and I don’t care how happy and successful those kids look in the photoshopped togetherness picture-I feel sorry for them. And I bet there’s reason they’re never all together. Dad’s it.</p>
<p>I like it. I also do make my D participate in sports (she gets to pick the sport and it only has to be one per year). She can quit a sport if she doesn’t like it but then needs to replace it with something active and organized (run a 5k or pick another sport).</p>
<p>They also promised the school that they would ensure that the child was ready for AP which I took as meaning if the child needed help they would get it at home. I also don’t force my kid to finish food (she can fix herself whatever she likes to eat if she doesn’t want what I cook and did this at an early age, she could fix herself whatever she was age appropriate able to fix - this started out being a bowl of cereal).</p>
<p>I also totally think an 8 year old is capable of washing their own clothes. I was an 8 year old latch key kid and was cooking food, so yeah. I didn’t see anything too objectionable in there.</p>
<p>It just occurred to me:</p>
<p>Dad made them build their own computer and their own car.</p>
<p>But it doesn’t mention if they were also required to make their own clothes. Perhaps they grew the cotton, carded it, spun it, wove it, and then sewed it. </p>
<p>And what about slaughtering the pig, so they could have pork chops for dinner? </p>
<p>In other words, why be self-reliant for cars and computers but not for other things? It makes no sense.</p>
<p>I am not about to make aspersions. They appear to be successful in raising their kids. I don’t have the discipline to do what they did, which is why I can’t, didn’t and won’t. </p>
<p>I can also say, it’s great that with that many kids they all build their computers and learned to fix their own cars. I’ve seen kids fail miserably at things their parents insist they do, and sometimes it’s the way a parent can deal with the failures of their kids that make a difference. Not all of us have kids that meet the marks we set for them. That this family has is a wonderful combo of discipline, nurture and, yes, blind luck.</p>
<p>I don’t believe that his goal was to make his kids self-sufficient. </p>
<p>Making a kid build a computer isn’t bad. It’s not “torture”. It’s useful to know what goes into making a computer. My dad made us learn computer programming and tried to teach us how to build one. (Still have the books in my bookshelf). You can save money and from being scaled when you know what to look for. </p>
<p>While building a car is more on the extreme, it wouldn’t be so bad for a kid to know all the parts that encompass their car and how to fix it. Again, saves money. </p>
<p>If you use and rely on something greatly, might as well learn how it works.</p>
<p>EDIT: Adding on to what cpt mentioned, the way the parent handles the teaching and failures of the kid definitely matters. My dad was not how the dad was. If my dad was more encouraging and understanding, I might’ve had my own computer job on the side…;)</p>
<p>IDK, I wouldn’t expect them to have the kids slaughter their own pig, veryhappy. But it’s perfectly reasonable to have a kid put a car together or a computer together (both are do-able by people of average intelligence). Putting a computer together is actually not all that hard (like a puzzle). Seems like all of the children were of average to above average intelligence so we don’t need to presume ‘what if the child was LD’ well then I think the story would be different.</p>
<p>In my opinion, to have that many children is unacceptably risky. The consequences to the entire family of a calamity (i.e., dad dies or becomes disabled, or one child has a very costly illness) would just be too great. It just seems imprudent to me.</p>
<p>They had help - you’ll never convince me otherwise. I assume there was domestic paid help, simply because the Dad/author doesn’t add that to his list of pride points to say, “and we did it all without any paid staff.” I’m bothered by the fact that The Help isn’t mentioned at all.</p>
<p>They sound like an extremely organized, hardworking crew, but I believe it’s fairly impossible for Mom (he travels) to put breakfast on the table at 5:15 a.m. unassisted and still supervise the 6-8 p.m. homework scene while getting in all the kitchen clean-up and baths, as the SOLE adult in the house. I mean, what happened on a day the Mom was sick or in hospital giving birth? Such a big, young family would fall apart without some paid help inside the home. </p>
<p>No problem that they have staff – just acknowledge it, okay? It’s work also to manage domestic staff, probably fell to the wife, but there could also be office supports, too: secretaries who book tickets for those family vacations, etc. </p>
<p>People who envision themselves pulling themselves up by their bootstraps usually don’t refer to the people paid to tie them each morning.</p>
<p>The thing is with a family this size, by the time a D is 15 she is taking care of a 2-year old. I know nothing of this family, but do know a few without much money who make this lifestyle work and are very happy. Of course, it’s not bump free. Nothing is.</p>
<p>hahahaha. I’m the 5th child mentioned in the article.</p>
<p>@paying3tuitions, I WISH we had help… the kids were the help, we were responsible for most chores while my mom oversaw everything.</p>
<p>Also, I don’t see why everyone finds it so hard to have breakfast and dinner as a family every day. Sports were always right after school for the most part.</p>