^^who said they were??
From an admission reader point of view, what they see of college counselors is that some applications look too polished or packaged or something like that (a poster on these forums mentioned that, as an interviewer, some applicants being interviewed came off that way). The college counselors who merely advise students and parents on forming a realistic application list, standardized test scheduling, etc., may not cause the students’ applications to look that way, so such use of college counselors would be less visible to admission readers.
‘“Athletes are not the problem in this case”
exactly!! this case is about students who were NOT athletes, but whose parents, a corrupt college counselor, and numerous greedy, corrupt athletic coaches made them LOOK like they were athletes.’
There have been many college athletic cheating/recruiting scandals over the years, but I believe this is the first one that involves coaches cheating to admit “athletes” who couldn’t actually play the sport.
I never thought I would live to see that.
One of my biggest disappointments is to find out that my 16 year old daughter knows who Olivia Jade is (doesn’t follow her she says but still) and has watched her YouTube videos on makeup and such. This is just a kid who happens to be the child of a famous person - no other claim to fame or skill.
Ugh. An influencer!
Nope, doesn’t look like that at all!
“This is just a kid who happens to be the child of a famous person - no other claim to fame or skill.”
There is a whole media and endorsement empire built on exactly that. It’s called the Kardashians.
Now if Olivia Jade has any brains whatsoever, her next phone call will be to Kris Kardashian. That evil genius would find a way to monetize this somehow.
^^who said they were??
Like dozens of posts on this thread.
Like how kids with LDs shouldn’t get time accommodations or go to top colleges.
Because getting stuff done fast and on deadline is an important life skill. Search for yourself.
Some posters on this thread enrolled their children at the schools referenced in the indictments. Some enrolled their kids at even higher-ranked and more-prestigious schools than those referenced. Their comments are not the result of “sour grapes.” For me, at least, it’s about protecting the integrity of the process. Fraudulent schemes like this cheapen the value of what most of us think is a high prize. So while USC is worth the same as an expensive handbag to them, it is worth far more to most of us. Now, that makes me very sour. And sad.
“Joke’s on Them: Bribing Your Way Into Yale Is a Waste of Money”
" When researchers have investigated the value of going to a top high school or college, they’ve found the long-term financial benefits are, as one paper says, “comparable to zero.” That is, students with the same abilities and ambitions will do equally well whether they go to an elite college or not. It’s the kids who make the school – not the school that makes the kids."
Too bad the stupid parents who bought into the idea that " the school makes the difference in long term outlooks" did NOT do a little research before hand.
1280
Think about it this way, a recruited athlete in a non revenue sport to a school like Yale has to have the same academic stats as a general admit while being one of the best in the country at that sport. Do you not think not only is that student bringing something to the table by being able to represent the school intercollegiately, but this recruited athlete is a very impressive applicant being able to be a stellar student while simultaneously being able to compete at the highest level nationally and sometimes internationally? Do you understand the commitment it takes to be an athlete on this level? Why do you believe a student that only focused on academics is more deserving than this kind of student whom had to do so MUCH more?
@mom56789- As I said, there are lots of ethical consultants (and most are), many of whom post here. They do not write the students’ applications. There are plenty of parents, though, that take over their kids’ application process (including writing/rewriting their kids’ materials) as we can see from this scandal. Not going to get into the pros/cons of college consultants, as that is off topic. I would encourage you to read the IECA, HECA and NACAC sites for more information than the opinion of one adcomm. No College admissions DIrector is going to tell you it is necessary to hire a private consultant. Not sure why you would even ask.
@PragmaticMom I agree with your post for the most part. But Stanford Yale and Georgetown are part of this particular scandal. Not the schools, per se, doing anything wrong- but involved. There are no schools “higher ranked or more prestigious ”. UCLA is involved too. They are the current king of the public flagship universe. 100k applicants.
Once again. I understand your post but not the “higher ranked and more prestigious” comment.
And part of this whole problem is the perception of something (like college a vs b) indicating social and intellectual superiority to begin with… prestige is an illusion that only we give life to.
I haven’t seen a really good timeline as to how this investigation started. Has there been one?
I read something about how this came to light through securities and financial fraud. One very rich dad under investigation for financial crimes in Florida who paid the (now former) University of Pennsylvania basketball coach to designate his son as a basketball recruit and successfully got him into Wharton, and another very rich dad under investigation for financial crimes in California who told investigators about the (now former) Yale tennis coach successfully selling seats at Yale. Then it became about Singer – but I’m not sure how.
And Singer seemed to choose some gullible, not terribly bright parents to offer up a special version of his college advisement service after scaring them into believing their child was definitely going to get rejected without his help.
I’m curious why a teenager who apparently was the face of a real marketing business and had an instagram following of real teens from all over the world following her – something she did not do just to look good on a college application – would not be as desirable as a student started a charity or raised money at a benefit or started a history appreciation club.
It seems that such a student would be just as likely to be admitted via the back or front door and not just the side. Was Singer scamming Loughlin because she was a less powerful client than all those clients who are not named? What kind of college advisor does not advise playing up the clear strengths of an applicant (she has millions of followers on instagram!) instead of faking soccer prowess? It almost sounds like a set-up.
I find it hard to believe that admission to USC is so impossible that merely running a real marketing business with over 1 million instagram followers would not make you just as desirable as a recruited soccer player. There are a lot more female soccer players – including very good ones – than there are teens running instagram accounts so influential that they have major brand sponsorship deals. Seems like Singer convinced Lori Laughlin that she’d have to cheat to have a chance of her daughter to be admitted and she believed him without question.
So either non-athlete admissions standards at USC are extraordinarily high these days or Singer was under investigation for other things and wanted to hand the feds an easy “criminal”. While Loughlin was absolutely in the wrong, it is unclear whether she would have ever pursued this means of college admissions without Singer specifically offering it to her after convincing her it was the only way her kid was likely to get in.
Ok — the investigation started last spring. A Boston area stock broker became involved in scheme in Europe. Once confronted, he told them about the Yale coaches bribe attempt. The case was unrelated but he thought it might help with his case.
He wore a wire and implicated coach.
Yale women’s soccer coach was originally connected with Rick singer in California. Decided to be go off on his own. Keep more money himself. He caved and implicated singer. Once confronted, rick singer caved and set up clients for the past year.
This has been going on since 2011.
Thousands of clients and over 700 involved in cheating the system over the years.
Yale coach quietly resigned last summer. Rumors are swirling of school knew and kept quiet. Maybe they had to per the feds.
“Think about it this way, a recruited athlete in a non revenue sport to a school like Yale has to have the same academic stats as a general admit while being one of the best in the country at that sport.”
Wrong.
they DO have to have the minimum scores of the Ive League Academic Index, in order to be considered, but those scores are in many cases LOWER than for NON recruited athletes.
"Here’s an example calculation for an Academic Index score from, So, you want to play in the Ivy League? ,
SAT: Your score divided by 10 divided by 2. So, if you got 1500 on the SAT, your index number would be 75.
SAT 2: The sum of your two scores, divided by 40. If you got 1450 in a Math SAT 2 and 1500 in a Chinese SAT 2, your score would be 73.75 ((1450+1500)/40).
GPA: GPA times 20. If you are a 3.7, then your index would be 74.
In this example, the student would have an academic index of 222.75.
“There is some debate surrounding what the cut off is for the lowest score to still be considered by the Ivies, but the general rule is to score 176 or higher.”
I posted this in response to the aforementioned erroneous assumption.
^^And?
@privatebanker The schools caught up in this include some lower-ranked schools (relatively speaking). That’s all I meant by that comment. In any case, isn’t Princeton and Harvard not ranked higher than USC? Some years higher-ranked than Stanford? Not the point of this discussion which I’m enjoying very much. I was responding to a post that characterized the outrage as “sour grapes.” I’m not sour becuase my kid did get in. That’s my point. I’m sour for a different reason. Anyway, sorry for distracting off-hand comment.
@observer12- somewhere buried in this behemoth thread is post # 1194, indicating that the Yale coach was caught by the Feds last april, and when he turned state’s evidence, he told them about Singer. The link to the article with sequence is in post 1194.
I love all the headlines now about the girl who “got a 34 on her ACT but was still rejected. Now she’s suing in a class action suit”
Did we think before this scandal that a 34 on the ACT was a guarantee into your top choice? Maybe CNN thought so. I guess they don’t spend much time on the CC decision threads.