<p>Post #1380</p>
<p>It was @TatinG. As I said, I wasn’t sure who it was. I agree, we must comply with cops. But again, there are also black assailants who have been gunned down for doing absolutely nothing. Just living while black. </p>
<p>“It was @TatinG. As I said, I wasn’t sure who it was. I agree, we must comply with cops. But again, there are also black assailants who have been gunned down for doing absolutely nothing. Just living while black.”
Not just gunned down. Beaten, abused and sodomized. These things happen and we can’t pretend otherwise and we can’t tolerate these things ever in decent society. Protest and exposure of such abuse are very, very important things.</p>
<p>@marie1234,</p>
<p>It’s all there. She said they would have lived had they complied. Should the guy in the video been shot? Did you watch it? Had a black man taken his seat belt off in such an angry, abrupt manner, I’m sure the cop would have reacted quite differently. </p>
<p>Zoosermon, you posted this statement about people who support the protestors and their right to chant whatever the heck they want. </p>
<p>“it really is remarkable how some people can actually defend or excuse this. I guess it plays into their own personal worldview. Facts and decency be damned.”</p>
<p>And I find it remarkable how some people actually defend and excuse cops killing unarmed black people. </p>
<p>Just as I assumed you were not speaking about specific people, neither was I. </p>
<p>“So if you don’t know and don’t seem interested in finding out, perhaps you should refrain from commenting on the topic.”</p>
<p>No, I will not refrain from commenting and I have every right to say that LEO’s and public officials, including the msyor of NYC, along with news reporters, should always refer to a suspect(s) as alleged. </p>
<p>@NewHavenCTmom </p>
<p>I really prefer to let Tatin fight her own battles. But, personally I think every situation is different. These are one-on-one interactions between two people that often occur in seconds and no not every black guy or white guy will end up dead whatever they do or don’t do, nor should they. But, sometimes they probably should also whatever their race. And the numbers for last year have dead white guys in the 300’s and dead black guys in the 100’s so make of it what you will. It’s not a contest. And, resisting arrest is likely to end badly for everyone so it would be nice if some of our so-called leaders would mention this to some of these people who seem to be unaware of this bit of very helpful information.</p>
<p>Emily, the issue is that the mayor used two different rhetorical standards within a very short time, not whether you personally think the word alleged is appropriate. </p>
<p>The problems between the mayor and the police exist right here in the real world. Parsing, spinning, denying and misdirecting blame by anyone is not helpful. Taking responsibility is what is needed. I do t see this mayor doing that, but humility and understanding would go a long way. However, I don’t think that is possible. Democrats here say that the mayor thinks he is leading a movement, and that is the problem.</p>
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<p>I clarified it that the cop didn’t specify whether he was talking about when he was sitting on the side of the road vs. cruising around.</p>
<p>Is it your position that “driving while black” does not occur on highways, only on slower residential roads?
The study didn’t show zero bias. It showed bias against whites; and the study was set up to show the opposite. So it’s your conclusion that it just must be flawed.</p>
<p>When you are in a car, you can’t tell the race of the cop sitting on the side of the road? You can’t tell the race of the other drivers.</p>
<p>And I know what your opinion of the mayor was before any of this was an issue at all so, IMO, it makes whatever you say about the mayor biased. </p>
<p>You also said he didn’t use “alleged” because there was a video of the officers choke hold. But, there was no video of the two cops being murdered yesterday - thus possibly his use of alleged in this situation versus the
Garner case. </p>
<p>Also, it seems to me that there are people assuming this incident on the protestors when there is no proof of that at all. </p>
<p>Well, anyone who lives in NYC is likely to have a previous opinion on the mayor. So should we discount anyone’s opinion who actually lives there?</p>
<p>Why are you so confident that the NYPD is racist? Is it just because you think racism is pervasive in every corner of America or do you have a specific reason why you think it is prevalent in the NYPD?</p>
<p>Emily you are confusing two things. It is the assault of two lieutenants on the brooklyn bridge, for which four arrests were made, of which there is video and the mayor used the word alleged that is a major cause of the ill will. Two police officers (internal affairs officers there to protect the protesters - and they needed it because a nut job tried to throw a garbage can off the walkway on their heads) were attacked and beaten, including broken bones. The police were outraged because at least one of the assaulters is a lecturer at CUNY and despite the video which was clear enough to make multiple arrests, the mayor’s response was less than stellar. We are not talking about the murders. The issue is what led to this, and my opinion. Is irrelevant. It is the opinion of the police that matters.</p>
<p>I am not singling out the NYPD - I am just as critical of other police departments - in small towns and in huge cities.
These problems need to addressed. Broken window and stop and frisk are/were bad policy and bad policing and happen in predominately minority communities. They are targeted by the police because of where they live and the color of their skin. </p>
<p>Zoozermom’s saying that “democrats” believe he is heading up a movement and “that is a problem” points out perfectly her bias against the mayor. </p>
<p>I have know Zoosermom a long time and I know where her sentiments lie. I’m sure she thinks whatever I say is biased based on where I stand on the issues, too. </p>
<p>I am biased about this mayor. I know you are biased against people on my side of the spectrum because you have said so. However, repeating the concerns of an elected democrat about the mayor’s point of view is not evidence of my bias. It is evidence of the fact that people across the spectrum are concerned about the mayor’s lack of experience and its impact on the city.</p>
<p>Ok. I did not know about that incident on the Bridge. However, IMO, he should always use “alledged” and he should have in the Garner case, too - though as i have already pointed out I have no idea if he did or didn’t. </p>
<p>But, even if he didn’t in the case, for the police to get their panties in a twist over it is ridiculous, especially for a department which has serious and documented problems with how the deal with minority communities. </p>
<p>You are free to disagree with me. </p>
<p>“Broken window and stop and frisk are/were bad policy and bad policing and happen in predominately minority communities. They are targeted by the police because of where they live and the color of their skin.”</p>
<p>Well, that’s ridiculous. Agree or disagree those policies affect the areas where the crime is because there purpose is to stop crime which some of the people who live in those areas actually do understand because they would be the victims.</p>
<p>^Crime in New York City has plummeted in the past 20 years. However, some on this thread think it is completely independent of police practices. I find this curious.</p>
<p>Tomorrow, I am going take a couple boxes of donuts to the local police department to personally thank them for what they do for us. </p>
<p>Collegealum, that does not mitigate the fact that Broken Window and Stop and Frisk target minorities and violate their civil rights. </p>
<p>“But, even if he didn’t in the case, for the police to get their panties in a twist over it is ridiculous, especially for a department which has serious and documented problems with how the deal with minority communities.” I think the term “panties in a twist” is very telling and very disrespectful. The officers were concerned, rightly it turns out, that the overheated rhetoric and lack of support from the mayor and others would endanger their lives and safety. There have been two deaths and two serious assaults in the interim. That is serious. Prior to yesterday, the assaults on the bridge had been front page news for days. The mayor should definitely have been considering how to tone things down. Serious reflection and answers about the policy of targeting untaxed cigarettes as coming directly from him would have been helpful since people are correctly very upset about the loss of a precious life for that. It might help for people to know that the policy came from the mayor in the immediate lead-up to the homicide of Mr Garner and not from rogue cops.</p>
<p>As I recall, the officer in charge at the scene, and the officer in charge back at the station were black. Everyone involved, diverse as they could be, were carrying out the wishes of the mayor. </p>
<p>Yet, he appeases those who insist there was a racial component and skates on any blame. Pretty neat trick.</p>