We had our bathroom redone recently, and I’m having a problem with the floor tile and grout. The tile is 18x6 inch rectangles, with “sharp” straight edges.
They are spaced about 1/8 inch apart, with seems fine. But, some are significantly higher than others, and it’s really bothering me. If I take a credit card and run it along the floor, it gets “stuck” pretty often. Some of the tiles are over the height of a quarter difference, which seems pretty “off.” (A quarter is thicker than a credit card) A couple of the tiles have already chipped (not sure if they were like that as they were put in or got chipped by very gentle wear and tear - this is the master bath area, so it’s not like a lot of people go in there).
The grout is not to the top of the tiles, and seems a little uneven as far as how far from the top it is. If it were to the top of the tiles, I think there might be less of an issue with the sharpened of the tiles, but I’m not sure.
Anyone have experience or suggestions related to this?
We have tiles of that size in our master. The floor is perfectly level. IMO, this sounds like an installation problem.
Could be a couple of problems, poor installation or the tile is concave or convex. Take a 18 inch straight edged and put on top of tile running long ways and see if you see an air space in the middle or on the ends.(board rocks). If the tile is bowed the installer should of compensated during installation.
I agree that it may be an installation problem. I would do as suggested above. If the issue is installation, I would contact the installer.
Sounds like you might have rectified tile, which requires more precise installation as it’s intolerant of lippage (where tiles aren’t installed perfectly co-planar or flat/level).
So you very likely have an installation issue, not a grout issue. An extenuating circumstance would be tile warpage as mentioned in a previous comment, so definitely use a straightedge to see how flat your tiles are.
Call your installer and complain. Probably will be a lot of hassle and mess to correct at this point, with destruction/removal of existing tiles. An uncaring and unskilled installer (which it sounds like you have) will do his best to blow you off and explain away the issues since he’ll have to buy you new tiles and spend a lot of time and effort ripping out the poorly installed ones (assuming the tiles are flat and not warped).
Sorry to be so blunt. I hope you can get it addressed to your satisfaction. If you’re dealing with a larger installation company, try to talk to a supervisor or someone in charge, not the original installer.
About rectified tile:
https://www.tileoutlets.com/blog/what-is-rectified-tile-why-does-it-matter/
About standards for lippage:
“Lippage is a condition when one edge of a tile is higher than the adjacent tile, giving the finished surface an uneven appearance. According to ANSI A137.1, when a pressed floor and porcelain tile is installed using a grout joint between 1/16” to less than 1/4”, the allowable lippage is 1/32” (about the thickness of one credit card).
https://www.ceramictilefoundation.org/blog/ansi-standards-tile-installers-best-friend
I have rectified tile floor planks in my bathroom, and they are flat. However, I read a lot of information before choosing tile to make sure I chose tile that would lie flat. If your tile was the issue, though, your installer should have warned you that they might not lie flat. Nose around the John Bridge tile forum online to get a better understanding.
You can’t always blame the installer. Homeowner like to save $$ by purchasing the material themselves and not looking at products, a reputable tile installer buys A grade tiles instead of tile from home centers and discount places
OP here - Thanks everyone. I worked with the person they told me to to pick out and purchase everything. I paid separately, but they work together, talk regularly, etc. I found that standard myself, and other similar articles (people seem to have different opinions on how some of this should be done) which is why I was measuring via a credit card and a quarter.
The same guy did our tile shower and it looks amazing. (Although one tile was cracked and one has a slight nick in it - but he’s coming back to fix those, and to see what he can do about the floor tile).
Any comments on how high the grout should be, compared to the top of the tile? At this point it’s going to be hard to clean, but I doubt he will redo the entire thing to make the grout higher.
At least I learned this stuff on a “small” job. I read some complaints about similar issues with tile laid throughout entire houses.
I don’t think I will get rectified tile again, but nobody mentioned any issues as I was picking and before they laid it.
From what I read in the attached links it doesn’t sound like the fact that the tile was rectified caused this issue. Wouldn’t this same issue have happened if non-rectified tiles of the same dimension were laid on the same floor? Perhaps it is slightly more noticeable due to the more precise edges of the rectified tile. But if the underlying floor is not level even a non-rectified tile laid over a non level floor with 18” dimensions would have lippage issues right? My understanding is that larger tile dimensions will be less forgiving overall of a non level floor.
Just had a close look at my travertine floor tiles. The grout isn’t quite flush to the surface, it’s maybe 1/32 to 1/64” below the top. You can look at natural stone tiles (granite, travertine, marble) as an example of how rectified tile should be laid.
I don’t believe you can or should have grout totally flush with the surface, as part of the installation process involves wiping it down with a sponge which will dip down a bit into the cracks. Grout flush to the surface would probably chip and wear quickly and unevenly.
@adlgel, may not understand what rectified means, but I thought it was the flat “sharp” edges. So when they aren’t perfectly level, which I understand can be difficult, it seems harder to care for. For example, a mop or sponge will catch on the sharp corners. They also seem like they might chip/break off more easily. Maybe I’m wrong - that’s just my impression.
It’s also my opinion that they should have mentioned it might not be level BEFORE they put it all down. The floor underneath looked very level before they put the tile on it, and this tile replaced 12x12 tile, which we didn’t notice any problem with.
Live and learn.
When I had our laundry room re-tiled I told my contractor that I wanted large 12"X24" tiles with the tightest grout lines possible. He told me that we could achieve that by getting rectified tile and using acrylic grout. That’s what we did and the floor is perfectly level and very easily mopped. I found the tile myself at a local tile shop, my installer approved it and did a good job; after about 5 years it still looks perfect.
I’m afraid your installer may be the problem but I think rectified tiles are great. I hate scrubbing grout and have used them (same contractor) in two bathroom remodels with no issues.
OP here. The contractor sent a tile guy to our house today, and he got here before the general contractor (our guy). The tile guy didn’t speak English very well, but he said the problem was the tiles were offset at 12 inches, and they should have been 8 inches. (In thirds vs at half). He asked me if I had an extra tile, and when I went to get one in the garage I noticed the box had a picture with them offset at half with a big X through it, and showed it should be set at 8 inches. The contractor is maintaining that it doesn’t matter what the box says, and it’s a fine job. He will replace a couple of the tiles but certainly not all of them. I am really not sure how to move forward.
They did replace a couple of tiles in the shower that were problematic (1 was cracked, and 2 were chipped. The guy is maintaining the “chips” are the way the tile is supposed to be, but I disagree.
What a mess.
Why would the offset make a difference?
Here is a good explanation:
https://www.tileoutlets.com/blog/managing-lippage-offsets-matter-installing-tile/
You must gather your courage and be INSISTENT with your contractor. They did a bad job, and need to tear the tile out and start again. There should not be that big a difference in height between the different tiles; that’s dangerous!
I understand you. When we redid our master bathroom floor the tile edges were sharp, unlike the tile chosen for the rest of the house. I had our contracter soften the edges (getting close to 7 years now, the details get fuzzy- and the word rectifiedwas something I once knew). It was consistent- not irregular as you report. Learned so much i may never need again- dislike the hardness of tile and getting too old to wnat to undergo renovations…
We did run into a problem with a batch of tiles with faulty small spots too late to correct most- some were that <mm larger and wouldn’t fit the space- only a couple or so redone.
I have a list “the next owner” things for this house (including popcorn ceiling removal- never should have listened to H and now don’t want to put up with the mess involved). I do know I have made so many improvements in so many things the last owner would have wanted.
As above- be insistent now to avoid regrets later.
OP here. The contractor came back last weekend and fixed the tiles. They still aren’t as “perfect” as I would like, but I can live with them. They unfortunately put chips in a couple of tiles while they were fixing the problem, so they have to come back again this week. Since it’s our master bath, and not many people will see it, I can live with the way it looks. I don’t worry that I will trip on the tiles now.
@wis75 instead of removinga popcorn ceiling, they can also mud over it (I’m not sure what actual substance they used) We did the in laws ‘60s home, and the guys smoothed the ceilings without removing popcorn, instead the encased it in new’ stuff.’