I’m trying to map out a schedule for summer camps as a rising high school senior, and I’d like to run by some questions and strategies. I know there’s no science to it, but I’d be extremely grateful for any perspective. I’ve started off by collecting all the dates of the colleges I’m interested in and colleges in my area, and now I’m just thinking of which ones and which dates. Thank you in advance for any feedback!!
Starting off with School-Specific or Large Camp. Should I do Large Camps early on because there's less point in seeing a school at a school specific one and then again at a Large Camp? Likewise, the Large Camp can help make a school want to pay more attention to me at their own, school-specific camp?
Timing of School Specific Camps. Is it an advantage to attend a school's first possible camp date in June or does it not really matter if I go with a July or August one? I was thinking with an earlier date maybe it'd help me get on the radar while things are still fresh? However with a later date, I was thinking I will have more experience and might do a better job?
Large Camps. From the forums here, I was very sold on the NE Elite Camp because I've been reading so many great things, and I really like the large list of D1, D2, and D3 schools. However, doing some quick internet research, I've also located some others that are just 1-day whose geography is a little better for me. For example, Discover Football Camp (in NJ), Lauren's First and Goal (at Lafayette), and College Prep Showcase (2-day in NY). These also seem to have a very large showing of colleges. In fact, I imagine I've probably missed some options that might be even better for me logistically. I'd much rather attend a 1-day college. Am I missing something about the benefits of the 3-day camp? Likewise, is there something particular about NE Elite, or will any large camp achieve the same effect of hopefully maximizing exposure?
Weeknight Camps. Might it be an advantage or disadvantage to attend a camp on a weeknight? Stony Brook and Marist are each having one of their camp dates as a weeknight. Logistically, I'm ok with that. However, I was thinking that attendance might potentially be low? Maybe that's good because I can get more exposure? Or maybe it's bad because there won't be many coaches present? Or many guys to do drills with?
Trajectory of Camps. Is there something to be said about schedule a camp early on that I'd be less stressed about just to see what one is about? I was thinking about scheduling my first one as a school specific one, hopefully a smaller one, and at a school that is less of a reach, just so I can see what it's all about in case I make any naive or rookie mistakes. I'm afraid at my first camp I will see that I'm not as polished for these camps as some of the other guys
Choosing Specific School Camps. I know @Ohiodad51 has cautioned against Colgate's. Any others that were a particularly good or particularly bad experience?
I thought these questions might benefit people in general. My case, in particular, is that I’ve gotten a late start on the process, at least relative to what I see on these forums. A few FCS schools came to my school to visit me, and my coach helped generate 1 of them. However, my coach isn’t well connected, so folks from my school traditionally generate their own interest. I haven’t done any visits yet, and I hadn’t been proactive until this week when I contacted many coaches with my highlight video and academic-athletic stats. Some schools have given me a generic camp invite, and a few seemed a lot more interested.
To follow up, one coach at a D3 told me he’ll be at 3 particular school’s D1 camps and i should tell him which one i plan to attend. i hadn’t realized that outside schools came to school specific camps.
i emailed the D1 camps at 2 of them to ask which schools might be present to see if any additional D1, D2, or D3 schools might be there. i was thinking if there is an additional school i had been talking with that might be on the list,
i’d pick that one and let that coach know in advance.
1 camp told me the complete tentative list of 4-5 schools, and 1 said it is against NCAA rules to disclose.
is that actually the case that schools cannot share which coaches or schools will be present? or maybe my question was just poorly worded and misconstrued as other people seem to be talking about it?
also, at the school specific camps, typically how many schools do show up? it seems very generous that a school would allow other schools to come, so it was not something i fathomed. to add perspective, i’m located in the tri-state area in the east coast, so there are many d1 and d3 colleges within a 1-3 hour drive of any school specific camp i’m thinking of attending
As I have said before, I do not have a lot of experience with the large camps popular here, like NE Elite and Lauren’s First and Goal. Many people here seem to have found NE Elite in particular worthwhile. I would be very, very leery of other no name “aggregator” camps. While I am in a different region of the country, I have never known of a kid who made real solid contact with a recruiting coach from a non school based camp outside of Nike Opening and Rivals Elite/Big Man camps. A lot of people will take your money. It is on you to see you get something back for it. Without exception, the kids that I either coached or who played with my son were recruited off of tape, the HS program, performance at Opening or Elite, and at school specific camps.
If it fits in the schedule, I would do the bigger camp first, as the stated purpose is to get exposure to a variety of schools, and then choose which or whether to camp at specific places. These camps are not offered every day though, so you have to work within the schedule. The single most important point to me about scheduling is allowing adequate time between camps. I saw many kids try and camp on back to back days and it clearly hurt them. Set at least a day between your camps. Eat well, hydrate and do a recovery workout on the off day.
3)See above
4)I don’t think there is a difference between “under the lights” camps and day camps. The SEC started doing camps in the stadiums at night and turning them into an event. Urban Meyer really turned up the volume on that trend when he got to Ohio State, and many big schools now turn it into a fan event as well as a full fledged recruiting night. There may be marginally less players I guess, but all the coaches will be there. I wouldn’t pick a camp based on whether it was held at night or during the day.
5)If you can swing it financially and time wise, and you did not camp anywhere as a rising junior, then yes, camping at a school you are lukewarm on first can give you an idea of what to expect. I would never camp “down” however. You want the experience of good competition. Go to a camp that is competitive with the schools on your list, or maybe a little higher up the chain.
6)Just one data point from one position group at Colgate. Other parents have reached out to me this year and last who have reported good things from Colgate, so as always, YMMV.
7)Many D3 coaches come to D1 camps, assumedly because it is a way for them to stretch their recruiting budget and see more kids than may show up at their school specific camp. It is a symbiotic relationship. A kid who is waffling on a particular D1 camp may decide to go because a coach from a D3 who is recruiting him will be there. As I have said before, I have a sneaking suspicion that D3 coaches also can function as a source of intelligence for D1 coaches as to what happened with particular kids at a prior camp. Generally, D3 and D1 schools aren’t recruiting against each other, so there is no real downside to a D1 inviting the local D3 coaches. Its not like it cost them anything to let a guy in a Tufts coach’s shirt come and watch drills at Lehigh, you know? D1 coaches generally don’t go to other D1 camps.
As to how many other coaches, that really depends I think on the popularity of the host school and its proximity to the D3 schools. In my region, Ohio State and Michigan draw a butt load of D2 and D3 schools for obvious reasons. Akron U, somewhat less. If I remember correctly, there were coaches from 5-6 other schools at Colgate last year. Somewhat more at the Ivy camps, maybe a dozen schools represented? Remember to that it is not just that a coach from another school is attending the camp. Having the D Line coach from a different school at a camp when you are a QB is probably not too helpful. I would want to know where my presumptive position coaches were going to be if I were picking camps based on other school’s attendance. As an aside, I would not ask a school which other schools will attend their camp. You want to project that you are going to a camp because you want to play for that school. Not because some one else will be there, even if it is true.
As always @Ohiodad51 your advice is incredibly helpful! Very sensible and useful.
I think my only question is why you are more skeptical of some of the other larger camps. The three I mentioned, outside of NE Elite, are Discover Football Camp (in NJ), Lauren’s First and Goal (at Lafayette), and College Prep Showcase (2-day in NY). I also have a friend doing the BC one, which is a big one.
They all seem to have a good list of coaches that will be attending, some more so than others. Decent mix of D1, D2, and D3 schools of interest to me.
Is the problem that you just don’t think the camps are set up well? I have read comments around here that the BC one is not as conducive to talking with coaches. Is that what you’re getting at?
Yeah, kind of. I would worry that at the big camps the drills are maybe not set up for what a particular school wants to do primarily. If the guy running the d line drills runs a 3-4 and you are a 4-3 rush end, how good are you going to show in drills designed to see if you can hold the point of attack? Also I wonder about how well they are organized, and how many quality reps there will be for each kid. Are those camps good for basic numbers like ht, wt, 40, vert, shuttle and bench? Yeah, probably. But you can get that for free at Rivals or SPARQ, which are kind of the recognized general sources for that data in at least D1 recruiting. So what exactly are you paying for at a large camp?
Remember that while school camps do make money for the coaches, they also serve a serious recruiting purpose. They want a well run, professional camp so that they can get a good evaluation and as importantly, impress the recruits at the camp. There are going to be a lot of reps for each recruit, and a lot of drills designed to see how a kid may fit in a particular scheme. Nike’s Opening series, and Under Armour Elite/Big Man have a very good rep and attract a lot of big time talent and consequently coaches. But those camps are feeders to the televised Opening and the Rivals challenge series and are at least partially designed to showcase and sell their gear. I do not see that same purpose or reputation at the big “no name” camps which to be honest are primarily designed to make money for the organizers. I could be wrong, I just think that you want to put yourself in a position where you can show well in front of coaches who are interested in you. For my money, you can best do that in front of your prospective position coach running drills he designed.
@Ohiodad51 Your perspective is interesting. From the forums here, I had been getting the impression that the smaller camps were more just a formality and a money maker, and coaches see enough of what they want to see from the larger camps. Sounds like you’re saying the large ones though are the money makers. From what I’m seeing, they are a lot more expensive
In fact, what you’re saying makes sense that coaches get to run things the way they want at smaller camps, so it is easier for them to see who they want to potentially start committing
You’ve convinced me so well that I almost forget why anybody said large camps were good on these forums
@Ohiodad51 I understand why it wouldn’t be proper to ask a school directly if and which other schools will be present. Should I mention to D3 schools which D1 schools camps I plan to attend and ask if they will be there? I should not expect another D1 school to be at a D1 camp?
Reading all this stuff about football camps is crazy! They are moneymakers for the assistant and position coaches so they can make ends meet over the summer. If you are going to numerous Ivy League camps be very careful not to waste a lot of time and money. Most of these prestigious schools are targeting their potential recruits during the spring football season and will be closely following them throughout the year especially when it comes to academics. Maybe maximum of 2 kids out of 100 will be offered that day on any given camp date. You are best off going to only 2, maximum 3 camps. A bunch of D3 programs were at the 2 Ivy camps we attended. My son did not get offered at either of the Ivy camps he attended. but got offered by Ivys that saw him in spring practice and followed him throughout the year. In the end he had 7 offers. 3 Ivys, 3 Patriots and 1FBS program not to mention the numerous D3 programs that expressed interest. Of all those 7 offers he didn’t attend any of their camps. The dream schools HYP play games! Beware!!
@redshipman What is your advice? I should go to 1 large camp and that’s enough?
All I know is right now today I don’t see myself getting any offers, at least at places I’m interested in. A few FCS coaches visited me at my high school from my highlights but not a large amount. To generate some interest, I started contacting some coaches myself. I’ve seen people in my program get all-county and all-state honors but who were not pro-active and ended up scrambling January senior year. However, I’ve seen people at my rival high schools whose coaches helped a lot but were worse academically and athletically do very well.
No be very proactive. My sons high school coach send his Hudl video to 50+ schools. Absolutely can’t wait till January of senior year. Have your dad or coach call the school and talk to your recruiter or one of the position coaches and say you want to come up for a visit. My son and I visited all the schools that showed interest and those he was interested in. Most schools were delighted we wanted to see them. They wanted to see my sons size and see how comfortable they felt with him. Again, be proactive.
@redshipman You are suggesting that I should just make 1-on-1, unofficial visits rather than go to the camps themselves? I should just tell them that I’ll be in the area, I’d like to meet them, take a tour of their stadium, and so forth?
I’m a junior. As I wrote, a few FCS coaches saw my highlights and came to my school. For all other places, I started emailing the recruiters this week. Many have responded. Some of the responses have been short “come to our camp: here’s the info.” Some others have been more detailed and enthusiastic “we liked your tape etc…” for a few sentences … then “come to our camp”
I would target the schools that are enthusiastic and ask if going to camp is absolutely necessary. My son was offered by 4 schools before their summer camps and 3 of those were Patriot League schools and one FBS. My son wanted to go to an Ivy. Most Ivys are reluctant to offer without you going to their camps (moneymakers). My advise is go to the place that you can feel most comfortable in athletically and academically and who are truly interested in you. Don’t get caught up in a brand name Ivy like HYP.
Believe it or not there are places in the US there is no spring ball for kids to get looked at, coaches do nothing to encourage very capable kids to continue. the only chance the kid would have is going to camps.
Just recently there was one coach in a nearby district who for the first time in his career, thought a kid was good, sent the kids film out,coach admittedly said never thought he would get a response. Within 3-4 days,7 coaches were at the school the kid had 7 top D1 school offers. Just makes you wonder how many kids slipped thru over the years and lost opportunities.
@samiamy Thanks for your encouragement. I guess this is embarrassing to admit, but I still don’t know what hudl is. I just have a video that I had made that I’ve been sending out to places to which some places have been saying they like
All that said, may I ask where you stand on the issue of camps? I just know if I don’t go to any camps, I know for sure I won’t be getting any FCS offers, definitely not at places I’d want at least, just given the recent history of guys from my program.
@redshipman First, I don’t know how to gauge if a school is actually enthusiastic. I’m leaning toward several schools may be curious, in part because my contact has been limited.
Second, isn’t it off-putting to ask a school if it is absolutely necessary to go to their camp at this stage? I don’t want to seem like an athletic diva
Third, If it clarifies anything, I don’t think Ivies are in the cards for me, so I haven’t been targeting them. I hope my SAT will be high enough but my GPA won’t be. I’d be happy with schools in the Patriot League (like Lehigh, Fordham, Colgate), other FCS D1s like Villanova and William and Mary, D2s like Bentley, or solid D3s academically like Union, Franklin and Marshall, Tufts. I’m picking some of these because folks in my rival schools have gone to some of these places where they do get more support from their coach, and I know they were roughly on par with me athletically and definitely similar academically
Football recruiting is new to us as well, all I do know up to this point, coming from areas where recruiting is limited, the only way is to market yourself, get in contact yourself. My son participated in out of school recruiting events,not combines, but 7 on 7 events. He has gotten invites to many camps thru those, however I do think there are messages within the e-mail messages. For instance Boston College camp was not a school he ever contemplated, never contacted, has been sending him a lot of unsolicited information about BC. Another a coach(one my son never contacted)specifically asked my son to let him know what camps he was going to, for my son to introduce himself to the coaches, gave my son a list of the camps they were going to be.
My previous recruiting experience is with Lacrosse, the HS coaches are not involved in recruiting at all, at least not in anything of value. It is all thru outside events, the family/kid are in control. Lacrosse is tournament play and colleges individual camps, camps, camps. Sell yourself, it is the only way, especially if your area,(sounds a lot like our area) is lacking in football recruiting. I know of many kids who could have played at top schools for football going to lower divisions and absolutely killing it, way above the level of play they went to, only because they waited for the schools to find them and they never did.
Let me be clear. In my opinion, camps are of little value if you are going in cold, and your definition of a successful camp is getting an offer at or immediately after the camp. Where camps can be important is in a situation where there is active recruiting going on. In that circumstance, school based camps are important for two reasons. One, it gives the coach an opportunity to see the player live, against good competition, doing things important to the coach. Equally as important, it gives the player an opportunity to interact with his presumptive coach in an athletic setting. Both are important, and can be valuable in advancing the process. But you should not go to a camp and expect an offer unless there has been substantial, serious contact before hand.
For a rising senior, I believe, you would be better served to use your funds to travel for unofficial visits to the schools.
Call an ask for an appointment with a coach, tour the sports facility, see the academic life, talk to admissions and financial aid offices explore the campus to see how you fit as a student.
A coach will see your interest in their program. From our experience, an interested coach will allow you to attend for a hourly or day cost when they truly need to see you in action.
When talking about a third party disinterested opinion of your ability, call the rival schools coach that put players into the schools you mentioned. “Union, Franklin and Marshall, Tufts”
We had rival high school coaches talking in our player’s ear on where they would like him to go. High school coaches coaching against you have already seen you in action for a full game.
Are you saying that the face-to-face, 1-on-1 time is the most important way to get on coach’s radar and that is most likely to occur by setting up an unofficial visit?
I’m not sure what you mean by the “hourly or day cost”. Are you saying that I should gauge from their interest whether I should come back for the camp?