<p>“Zoo-Mass. 'Nuff said. Would not send my kid there.”</p>
<p>That’s pretty astounding rationale.</p>
<p>“It’s pretty widely accepted that UCONN is the the top public university in New England.”</p>
<p>If this is a widely accepted fact, you should have no problem finding citations to support your claim.</p>
<p>“Oh and the Men at UCONN play basketball, too! And especially well in 1999 and 2004.
CollegeMom08 is offline”</p>
<p>How is UConn at GeoSpatial Computing?</p>
<p>When I took my son to see UMASS on their special open house day, their head guy addressed the thousands assembled and he said that UMASS students root for two teams, UMASS and whomever is playing UCONN. When we went to the special open house at UCONN, they spoke about UCONN. C’est la difference. </p>
<p>That said, I was impressed with UMASS and the kids we met there - including the two sisters who both turned down Boston College for scholarships at UMASS.</p>
<p>What really matters is the education that is possible there. There are lots of kids that don’t achieve their potential at UMass but that is their choice.</p>
<p>DaddyWarBucks, though I definitely agree that UMass is getting more selective, it’s still a relative “walk-in the park” to get in compared to other state schools. The admissions rate may be dropping but most public schools acceptance rates are also dropping now a days have more applicants because of the bad economy and the fact is that this year was the largest applicant pool in history.</p>
<p>Let’s compare UMass with a school like Oklahoma (“ranked” lower than UMass)</p>
<p>SAT Critical Reading:
UMass - 510-610
Oklahoma - 540-660</p>
<p>SAT Math:
UMass: 520-630
Oklahoma: 540-660</p>
<p>% graduated top 10% of class:
UMass: 22%
Oklahoma: 33%</p>
<p>Also UMass’s ranking in US News has been dropping instead of increasing like several state schools like Clemson or even Arizona State!</p>
<p>There are a bunch of UConn dopes - obviously not every UConn person is a dope but these are and TTown is near the top of the list - who have a strange need to inject “UConn is great” into UMass discussions. It’s pathetic. When you say the schools are equivalent - which is obvious to any person not rooting for one or other - you get ridiculous crap back. </p>
<p>They post, for example, that UConn gets more research dollars. Nope, UMass gets 35% more, not counting UMass medical* which gets much more than CT’s equivalent. They post that UConn gets tons more state funding. Nope, they get almost to the dollar the same amounts from their states. I could go on but you get the point. I say “Bravo!” to UConn for raising its profile and for using its basketball programs to attract attention, but don’t get carried away.</p>
<p>*Another factor why UMass is viewed oddly for what it actually is can be summarized by the medical campus. A huge political fight erupted over location. The sensible location would have been at Amherst because then the research dollars would have elevated the college system - like with Ann Arbor and many other schools - but the politicians from Worcester won and so UMass Medical is there.</p>
<p>I lived near Worcester for a few years and could never understand why it was built there. I never thought that Worcester had any clout. The city has been a basketcase for decades and shows few signs of digging out.</p>
<p>I’m going to second the cultural aspect of the entire thing.
I’m from California and I have friends in MA (I’m a high school senior, by the way).
Around here, the UCs are what you strive for. I go to a high achieving high school, but more than shooting for Harvard, people want UCLA or Cal. I know plenty of people who would choose Cal over Williams in a heartbeat; one of my friends turned down Stanford for UCLA. Asian parents push their kids to attend packed seminars held by former UC admissions officers while college visits from Amherst have 6 kids in attendance.
In contrast, my friends from MA don’t even really consider state schools: they say that they’re for the kids who can’t make it into/pay for one of the private colleges.
IMO, when your schools aren’t a top priority for the students, they’re only going to end up with the kids who honestly have no other options, and you see that in the kind of student bodies they end up with. But that could just be me.</p>
<p>“IMO, when your schools aren’t a top priority for the students, they’re only going to end up with the kids who honestly have no other options, and you see that in the kind of student bodies they end up with. But that could just be me.”</p>
<p>They will end up with some kids without other options.</p>
<p>For some, the composition of the student body is a concern. There are those that are looking for an education at a good price that will make a pragmatic decision. You’d be surprised at the number of wealthy parents insisting that their kids go to state schools.</p>
<p>Lergnom… you are right about basketball, it brought a lot of attention to UConn… Don’t forget, though, the BILLIONs of dollars the state threw UConn’s way for its reconstruction and expansion!!!.. If the state of CT never did that, UConn would still look like the dump UMass is today. You give too much emphasis to research dollars… its blocking your better judgement. By the way, the comparison is between UConn and UMass Amherst, not UConn and the whole UMass system!!</p>
<p>“If the state of CT never did that, UConn would still look like the dump UMass is today.”</p>
<p>It appears that you’re into appearances. Yeah, UMass looks ancient. But you really don’t need that much to get an education. I went to BC. BC has a very, very nice campus. I offered to pay for BC but our son chose UMass for the better education in his major. He was fully aware of the differences in the campuses as he’s been to BC many, many times (and many of the other Boston and Cambridge universities). If you’re really into appearances, then by all means, why not pick landscaping U?</p>
<p>1) I really think most legislators in MA went to BC or another private college. I’m willing to bet that most legislators in MI went to Michigan or Michigan State, most of the Ohio legislature went to Ohio State, etc (either for undergrad or grad school). UMass is grossly underfunded and has been for years, partially because it doesn’t have enough alumni in the state gov’t who see the value of investing in higher ed. Beacon Hill is surrounded by BC, Harvard, MIT, Northeastern, BU, etc, while UMass is 100+ miles away. It’s simply overshadowed.</p>
<p>2) The Zoo-Mass thing is an unfortunate reputation that refuses to die, although I don’t think it’s true any more. At this point UMass’ admission standards have risen so high that a lot of the party crowd is forced to go to Westfield State for a residential college experience at a state college price. UMass has an average incoming GPA of 3.5+ (weighted). Show me any large university that doesn’t have partying - UMass today isn’t any worse about that than any other large univ. But the old ZooMass reputation refuses to die among people who don’t pay attention.</p>
<p>3) This may seem irrelevant, but UMass doesn’t have any prominent sports teams. Why do so many other states take so much pride in their public univs? Sports has a lot to do with it. You never see UMass on TV in a game… but BC is on TV all the time. Out of sight, out of mind. Sports teams breed loyalty in alumni, and in state taxpayers.</p>
<p>Perhaps those in MA associate moreso with the Red Sox, Bruins, Celtics and Patriots.</p>
<p>I posted this in another thread about how UMass is getting increasingly selective but still lags behind in “selectivity” and the stats of the student body:</p>
<p>I definitely agree that UMass is getting more selective, it’s still a relative “walk-in the park” to get in compared to other state schools. The admissions rate may be dropping but most public schools acceptance rates are also dropping now a days have more applicants because of the bad economy and the fact is that this year was the largest applicant pool in history.</p>
<p>Let’s compare UMass with a school like Oklahoma (“ranked” lower than UMass)</p>
<p>SAT Critical Reading:
UMass - 510-610
Oklahoma - 540-660</p>
<p>SAT Math:
UMass: 520-630
Oklahoma: 540-660</p>
<p>% graduated top 10% of class:
UMass: 22%
Oklahoma: 33%</p>
<p>Also UMass’s ranking in US News has been dropping instead of increasing like several state schools like Clemson or even Arizona State!</p>
<p>and I agree, I think that a Division I-A football program might do UMass some good though it is not academically related, it does add to the “prestige” of the school if they can get a winning program like Florida or Ohio State. Students flock to that school in part because of the athletics (though hopefully academics first) so the schools can be more selective in their admissions standards.</p>
<p>“when your schools aren’t a top priority for the students, they’re only going to end up with the kids who honestly have no other options, and you see that in the kind of student bodies they end up with.”</p>
<p>I’d say there’s a grain of truth to this, even if it’s an exaggeration–but remember that “no other options” is about more than just academics. Lots of applicants who have several good options academically may turn out to have no options but UMass financially (my son could well turn out to be one of them). And “the kind of student bodies” that UMass ends up with for financial reasons may include lots of academically gifted and motivated students.</p>
<p>(Lafalum84–you make some good points. I suspect that (2) and (3) are not unrelated, in which case I think the current trend is a bargain we might want to settle for. IIRC, the “ZooMass” cliche reached its peak in the 90s, during the John Calipari era when the UMass basketball team was briefly a national power.)</p>
<p>another bone I have to pick with UMass is those fees. I got an Adams scholarship (free tuition) but it’s basically worthless because fees are like 8 times the cost of tuition!</p>
<p>Funny that this should happen today with this topic:</p>
<p>[Former</a> House Speaker DiMasi indicted on corruption charges - Local News Updates - The Boston Globe](<a href=“http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2009/06/former_speaker_1.html]Former”>http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2009/06/former_speaker_1.html)</p>
<p>I’m a junior and will be applying to Umass Amhurst. How do you think it compares to my instate choice, Suny Albany. I like Umass better, they both have a journalism major that looks good, and I should have no problem getting into both. Obviously Albany would be half the price. Can anyone compare on academics and living? Amherst is nicer than Albany, and I do like having a football stadium, I hear complaints about Albany housing and safety.</p>
<p>pierre mentioned Clemson… for years it was known as a “jock” school. Now it’s climbing rapidly in the rankings. It’s gotten very selective, and still maintains a strong sports program. They’ve managed to combine academics and amazing school spirit (and, let’s be honest, pretty nice weather) in a way that the students and alumni are proud of both their academic and athletic reputations. Princeton Review ranks them as having the “happiest students.” And who doesn’t want to go to a school with happy students? Which leads to more top applicants, and more selectivity…</p>
<p>but pierre… I’d bet it’s a lot harder to make the Top 10% of the class in most MA high schools than in most OK high schools. Not trying to say OK students aren’t smart or hard workers, but MA’s K-12 schools are near the top of the nation, and MA has a high percentage of adults with college degrees, and very few jobs that don’t require a college degree, so I think in general the expectations for MA high school students are higher. So the comparison of kids in the Top 10% between UMass and Univ of OK may not be fair.</p>
<p>haha let’s not get sidetracked, I just mentioned Clemson because I’m going there next year :)</p>
<p>the point is, UMass needs something to attract the in-state students to the school. Most graduates of state schools end up getting jobs in that state so if Massachusetts wants to stop the mass migration of people from the state, it needs to invest more in the UMass system, thus keeping these excellent students of Massachusetts high schools in jobs in Massachusetts.</p>
<p>any ideas how UMass can do this?</p>