I do not understand how people willingly submit to physical and mental torture in order to “get” friends.
while I am against banning things I wish frats would simply fade away because people cringe at what they do and stand for. I have never understood the psychological mechanism that causes people to willing submit to this.
http://thehofstrachronicle.com/alleged-sigma-pi-hazing-involved-induced-vomiting-cage-anti-semitic-imagery/
Not all frats behave this way. We tend to only hear the bad stuff. But I agree, if I were a college guy this stuff would not interest me. IMO, I think the fraternity alum groups need to be more involved in shutting this stuff down.
the alumni from the frats did the same stuff. and it is not just one or two rogue frats doing this (sadly)
I went to a school with a big frat culture, and I am not a fan, for many reasons, not just the potential hazing. This tends to be a pretty divisive topic, and people always pop in to say that some organizations do some good, etc. But if I had to do it over again, I would go to a school with no or very minimal frat involvement. Not a fan at all.
Two of my brothers joined a frat in our flagship U because it’s a commuter school and that’s one way to make new friends that aren’t from your HS clique. My 3rd brother joined a co-ed business service fraternity. I believe he’s the only one who made lasting friendships from joining. Two of my sisters joined sororities. I tried but ended up quitting as they hassled me during finals week and generally made me an emotional wreck as a freshman. I don’t think my sisters made lasting friendships either.
I found the honor societies were more my kind of place, as was the campus YWCA, where I became very active.
I disagree with making the lasting friendships. I have a lot of friendships from my sorority, some from my time in college, many from alum groups. A few weeks ago a group of about 25 of us went to a football game at our school. Some women I see every month, but several I hadn’t seen in almost 40 years. It was fun.
My father is 82. He has a group of fraternity brothers he sees every year even though he lives 2000 miles away. Most of them live very close to each other and have retired to the Cape. Over the years, they have vacationed together, gone to football games (shared tickets on the 50 yard line, good years and bad), been in each others weddings, gone to a few funerals (one mother cried when she saw the group of 50 year old men walk into her son’s funeral). They are lifelong friends.
I do not think most Greek houses treat each other like those in the article did (and the national organization shut them down). We didn’t have hazing, unless you call waking kids up at 3 am to have ice cream to be hazing.
I would agree with the comment that not all frats and sororities have that type of hazing. It is critical to discern which frat/sorority would be a good fit.
Before my D started the sorority recruiting process she targeted only 2 sororities that she felt were good fits for her and decided in advance that if she did not get into one of them (she did) that she would not pledge. She already had friends in the sorority she ended up joining and being part of the sorority did add to her campus life and gave her lasting friendship. Currently she is at Columbia for grad school and is sharing an apartment with two sorority sisters/friends who also are at Columbia for different programs. She sees other sorority sisters who are in NYC or who visit NYC. She said her sorority’s idea of “hazing” was to have the pledges sort a batch of sprinkles (jimmies) by color – and then the sorority members hosted a huge ice cream party so that’s not too terrible. I am confident that she found a number of long term friends through her sorority. BTW she also lived in the college’s scholar house for her last 3 semesters and made close friends there as well – she felt they were both provided great but different experiences.
IMO it is all about choosing wisely.
As I continue to think about it, I would have to disagree with any blanket condemnation OR any blanket endorsement of fraternities/sororities. As with many things it life, it is important to consider the nuances/the details of each situation – including but not limited to the individual, the college, the particular fraternity/sorority etc.
I would never argue that what worked very well for my D in her particular circumstance would be right for everyone. In fact my S went to a college with no frats/sororities and it was perfect for him. Things are not always one size fits all.
I attended a new college with a brand-new frat and sorority. The brothers and sisters had an opportunity to build their organizations the right way. The main reason why my frat didn’t succeed was it’s inability to obtain a frat house. I’m not sure what happened to the sorority. One of my favorite handouts was several pages of raunchy songs “borrowed” from another fraternity in Boston.
My fellow freshmen pledges and I were counter culture children of the 60’s in contrast to our upper-classmen straight arrows with patches on their jackets, turtlenecks, briefcases, and smoking pipes. There was always something to do and I made a few long-term friends. We were a closer-knit group compared to most students at our commuter school.
My son didn’t join a frat as his club sport rugby teammates became his close friends. The women’s club team bonded with the men’s team too.
People join for a variety of reasons, some because they believe it will create a network down the road with jobs and such, others to have something they belong to, a pseudo family, some do so for cultural reasons (for example, a frat house predominantly consisting of Jews, blacks, Mexicans, etc, etc), some for the wrong reasons (for the party hearty culture of a particular frat and getting ‘babes’ and whatnot, ie the jerks). I went to a school not exactly known for frat culture (there were some), and for me never really had a reason to, I joined clubs and groups I liked, and that gave me what I needed, but I could see others who got something out of it. Blanket condemnation of frats and sorrorities is unfair, yes there are fraternities that across college campuses seem to have a bad reputation, and more than a few of them seem to me haven’t grown out of being 14 year olds away from home with some of the stuff they do, but like anything else, there are a lot that actually have grown up. Seperating the colors in sprinkles then having Ice cream sounds cute, having someone race between fires in the woods, where the pledges have to drink noxious crap at each fire, run to the next one, and see how far they can go without puking, or making pledges drink until they pass out, sounds like a bunch of sadistic 14 year olds a la the fascist frat in “Animal House”
Or white or east Asian or south Asian or any other race/ethnicity people. Fraternities and (especially) sororities are often more segregated by race/ethnicity than the campuses that they are associated with.
Do you hate fun?
I think a quality fraternity, one with quality people and a quality house would be 100 times better than living alone.
How easily can a prospective new member determine what a “quality” fraternity or sorority is, particularly at a college where pledging is traditionally done first semester?
^^ It is fate that you are put in the perfect house for you.
My DS didn’t get a bid, but really wanted to join one to have new friends…an organized group that looks like they do fun things. It’s an easy way to meet people and be one involved. I totally get it and felt so bad he didn’t get in. He has friends, many from high svhool, but he was really looking for a fresh start. He got close to his freshman dorm kids, but this year everyone is split up of course and all over campus. People just want to belong.