<p>^I totally agree that it is up to the student and not the UG </p>
<p>However, I believe we have a different vision of the student we are hypothetically comparing in terms of med school admissions. You are thinking about a type of student like your daughter who works hard and will probably thrive regardless of the UG. I am using the average Joe as my example. If Joe went to a top UG, he’ll have a better shot, more opportunities, and more individual attention/support during his med school admissions process. I cannot say the same for Joe if he went to a state U/no name school. </p>
<p>Obviously, the opportunity is everywhere and for people like your daughter, they can grasp the opportunity even at places where it presents itself less conspicuously (i.e state/no name schools). However, that opportunity is much more pervasive in a top UG with a small student body and significant funding from alumni/donors. </p>
<p>In the end, the advantage of going to a top UG is evident due to the fact that increasingly more parents are willing to send their kids to top UGs (as revealed by top UGs’ increasing number of applicants) despite the harsh economic circumstances the country is in. No matter how many counterexamples (exceptions, i should say) you provide, you cannot undermine the fact that going to a top UG does give the average Joe a money-worthwhile advantage towards his future endeavors.</p>
<p>The source is the increasing number of applicants to top UGs. You can find specific numbers on their specific websites.</p>
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<p>I hope you aren’t serious that application numbers = “money-worthwhile advantage”…</p>
<p>Uh, by definition, the “Average Joe” does NOT attend Medical school. :)</p>
<p>Sorry, I meant the “Average Joe Medical School Applicant”. Someone with a GPA of 3.5-3.7 and a MCAT of 30-32 and decent ECs/LORs/whatever. For these types of average applicants, attending a top UG might just be that extra factor that bumps them into medical school versus someone with similar stats coming from a state U/no name school.</p>
<p>" believe we have a different vision of the student we are hypothetically comparing in terms of med school admissions. You are thinking about a type of student like your daughter who works hard and will probably thrive regardless of the UG. I am using the average Joe as my example"</p>
<p>-average Joe should not be discussed here. He belongs in another thread. the only students that we are discussing here are those “who works hard and will probably thrive regardless of the UG”. Only these have ANY chance at Med. School admission. My D. is just like all of them, she is part of the crowd. There are also geniuses, but it is waste of time to discuss them as they are a great exception.</p>
<p>…applicant with "Someone with a GPA of 3.5-3.7 and a MCAT of 30-32 and decent ECs/LORs/whatever. " by no means is an average Joe. And this applicant will do just fine if he applies to correct list of Med. Schools, the list that matches his stats. He will have several acceptances if he applies smartly.</p>
<p>If these kind of students that I have described above went to top UGs with well respected premed committees, they have a very high chance (~75% based on Duke, Hopkins, Cornell websites) to get accepted into a med school if they use the premed committee. I don’t think state U/no name schools can bolster the same percentages for their “3.5-3.7, 30-32, decent everything else” students.</p>
<p>OK, go to UG that fits you, do not go to place for the reason that it looks good on Med. School application. You do not want to be misearable for 4 years, however, if you do not pay for UG or pay very little, you will have wider choices of Med. Schools, since cost will not be as high priority as otherwise. That is the only message I am trying to put forward. Name of your UG will NOT help you to get into Med. School. Do NOT rely on it, wrong strategy.</p>
<p>If these kind of students that I have described above went to top UGs with well respected premed committees, they have a very high chance (~75% based on Duke, Hopkins, Cornell websites) to get accepted into a med school if they use the premed committee. I don’t think state U/no name schools can bolster the same percentages for their “3.5-3.7, 30-32, decent everything else” students.</p>
<p>My son’s state flagship (which does do Committee Letters) does say that if you have a 3.6 GPA and a 29+ MCAT, you have over an 80% chance at acceptance. They also say that the acceptance rate is even higher for those who aren’t instate students.</p>
<p>This is for acceptance to MD AMERICAN schools…not DO…not abroad.</p>
<p>The pre-med advising helps with med school app list based on your stats to increase your chances. Also, the director told me that when they do have a student with good stats who isn’t accepted, it’s usually because he/she has “suicided” and has only applied to one med school (for personal reasons) or would only apply to - say - top 10 schools.</p>
<p>I am currently a rising high school senior aspiring for a future MD. My family is in that difficult spot where we won’t get much financial aid because of income but at the same time cant pay for an Ivy League education, thus im looking for reputable institutions with great premed programs such as USC, Vanderbilt, University of Miami, and WashU in St. Louis who give merit aid. Do you happen to know which of these is best for premed? any others I should be looking at? How about NYU?</p>
<p>All of those school would be fine. Do you know how competitive big merit aid is at those schools? It is far more likely statistically to get an acceptance to HYP than it is to get half-tuition (other than NMF’s at USC) at these schools. Lots and lots of hounds chasing a very few rabbits.</p>
<p>First of all, thank you for responding to my post, I am new to this site and still getting my bearings. I am sure that all big merit aid is very competitive at all of these schools, however (not to sound cocky), I am positive that I am in a good position to receive significant aid (please correct me if I am wrong). I have all 5s on eight AP exams (among them Calc BC, English Language, and Physics B), perfect 36 on my ACTs, 1520/2200 on my SAT and I am going to take SAT again (only taken ACT and SAT once each), 800 math 1, 800 math 2, 800 u.s. history, and 750 physics SAT II subject test, straights As all of high school, 5.24/6 weighted 4.0/4 unweighted, 5/961 in the class, varsity swimming and water polo, nhs, mu alpha theta, community church group, exct. I don’t really know what else I could do to significantly improve my chances, and I just want to know what you think my chances are to receive significant financial aid from these schools. Also, if you have any additional tips on choosing premed undergrad schools or school recommendations, please post them. I am the first in my family to go to college in the United States, and this whole process is very new to my parents and I.</p>
<p>First thing, do not bother with sat retake, just submit ACT only. Second …work the essays and scholarship weekends like they were job. Washu specifically has a confusing series of programs and required essays . Thirdly, add Emory, Case, Tulane, Rice and if you like smaller schools, I have at least a dozen more. Cast the net further and deeper. Great record, now learn to use it. </p>
<p>Btw, my kid was in a similar situation and she had a great 4 years at Rhodes College but also got the highest merit awards at Miami and Case, among others. Wider, deeper. Lots of great schools out there. Lots of hounds, too.</p>
<p>^The same experience with Case. D. got $27k (out of $33)/year. She has chosen another UG (Miami - OH), where she was on full tuition+ Merit awards (about 10 scholarships). However, for us both of them are in-state. D. really liked both. Miami was absolutely best fit for her UG years, her experience went well beyond our expectations.</p>
<p>lasgna, you are in great shape for a merit award at any school that grants them. There are just not as many slippers as there are Cinderellas. Objective criteria are necessary but not nearly enough. There are very few guaranteed by-the-numbers merit spots and other than USC most are at schools several steps below those you named. </p>
<p>Search on my name and merit aid and you’ll find hundreds of posts on how we approached the hunt in our family. She worked very hard and I worked very hard for her. She was very successful but had we underestimated the challenge, she would have been sunk. Do some reading and then pm me for more help. But do the reading first, please. I’m old and increasingly curmudgeonly. ;)</p>
<p>^Well, aside from academics, D. did not really put much effort into searching/selecting schools both UG and Med. Schools. However, she was very particular and stuborn about her own #1 criteria and did not listen to anybody. If school met that criteria, it was on her list, just that simple. She also was never aspired to apply to Ivy’s or other elite schools, this could have made her application process more streamlined and easier than some other applicants. Another aspect, visiting and meeting current students was crucial in her decision making. She has changed her mind, flipped her decision in regard to Med. School after Second look events at ##1,2 of her choices.<br>
The only advice I have, listen to yourself much more than you listen to others.</p>
<p>Well, miami, your D’s search was far more limited geographically. lasagna’s is nationwide. Your D wasn’t interested in elite schools while </p>
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it appears lasagna is. My advice is : gain knowledge about all of your choices before choosing. Then it’s safe to listen to yourself. ;)</p>
<p>It takes an enormous amount of work to do this right. Get busy.</p>