<p>I’m in an unusual situation. After I graduate, I will be joining the Army as an officer for at least (typically) four years. I then plan (assuming I’m the same guy with the same mind) to go to graduate school to earn a PhD in Mathematics (I want to be a mathematician). </p>
<p>Right now, my cumulative GPA is at 3.65 (which is probably enough to get the Cum Laude honor if I maintain it), my Mathematics GPA is 3.5 / 3.8 (upper division only), currently doing research with a faculty member, and know several professors who are willing to write me recommendations. Also in two honors program, Mathematics & General, been in Dean’s List several times. Haven’t taken the GRE yet.</p>
<p>I was wondering how would graduate school admissions look at an applicant who had a four year educational gap after his undergraduate years? </p>
<p>Along with how the admissions people will look at me, I’m wondering when is the best time to get the recommendation from professors: right before I graduate with a B.S degree (and save them for several years) or after I retire from military service assuming I maintain constant contact with them? </p>
<p>As for research, one of the beauties of mathematics research is that you really only need pencil, paper, a book or two, and the Internet to get things done. Right now, I see those four years without having to worry about school and money as an opportunity to do independent research with the collegemates and the professors I know…assuming if I even have any downtime during my service.</p>
<p>There’s also the option to do military service after I complete graduate school, but that idea was never appealing to me at all as I’m extremely looking forward to serving, and maybe having some academic achievements within the military will give me a boost in graduate school admissions.</p>
<p>well unless you are doing the things that you have studied in undergraduate study in military, you can’t put that as work experience for graduate school. Graduate school will overlook on GPA and other factors if you have long work experience IN THE FIELD YOU ARE PLAN ON STUDYING IN MASTER, but I highly doubt shooting guns in military will help you get into good mathematic master program in any graduate school. Study GRE math, get above 700 and apply to master program if you truly want to become master or PHD in mathematic.</p>
<p>Bird, don’t sweat this too much. I will not argue that your service will aid your application - it won’t - but it won’t hurt it too much, either. The general expectation is that if you were able to perform at a certain level in undergrad you should be able to come back up to speed relatively quickly in grad school. Plus, you may find the discipline you acquire in the service to be attractive to some adcoms. You will probably rank a little better than a new undergrad, but perhaps not as highly as someone with more experience in your field.</p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
<p>I won’t address the military issue, but you should get the professors you like to write you letters of rec now, when you’re still in high contact with them. You can always get your military commanders to write you additional ones in the future (might be good, speak to your leadership skills, personal maturity, etc) but I would get the academic ones now. I don’t think you can ever have too many LoRs. My UG had a LoR library service: you got your professors to upload their letters to a server that archived them and then you just contacted the library people to send them out when you needed them for applications. That way you didn’t have to worry about the profs losing them or accidentally deleting them.</p>
<p>variola - sage advice!! One of the biggest problem people have applying to grad school after years away from school is getting quality LOR’s.</p>
<p>Thanks for your thoughts, I’ll definitely get my professor recommendations before I graduate here. Also, just in case, I never thought that being in the military would help me in graduate admissions. I knew military and graduate school in mathematics were mutually exclusive unless by some unbelievable luck (or misfortune; I didn’t want to be in the Army to be behind a desk) I end up in agencies or organizations in the military that involves mathematics.</p>
<p>I knew a few people that were in the military either due to ROTC or other commitments and went to grad school after finishing their tour. They generally were able to focus on doing their work much better than the typical grad student coming straight from undergrad. </p>
<p>If I was looking at two equally qualified grad students, I’d definitely go for the one that had some time in the military.</p>
<p>May also wish to see if there are ‘applied’ online programs could utilize and add to your math skills and use military benefits. Example: master level programs in operations research or logistcs, etc… that would allow to build upon math skills and study applied areas that the military appreciates. Once assigned to a base, check with the local base ed center and see what is taught on base or look for quality online program that can complete while in military and use tuition assistance available.</p>
<p>gtgblows - there’s more to be done in the military than “shooting guns,” especially as an officer. There are a lot of technical fields in the military that are related to mathematics, although more applied mathematics than theoretical.</p>
<p>In answer to the question, I’m not in math but most of my cohort has some kind of work experience between undergrad and grad school. Some of it is very related and some of it is less-than-related. I don’t think it will be a problem - the military probably won’t HELP you get into graduate school (unless you had a position where you were doing theoretical mathematics research - or applied math research if that’s your interest) but I doubt it will hurt you.</p>
<p>Doubt it will hurt you? If you look at the statistic of how many people join the army to get funding for college and never end up going to college, you wouldn’t be saying this. After military work that is not related to his major in army, he will forget all fundamental knowledge he require to continue masters. When your brain power is still fresh, go back to grad school. Get loan if you have to. That is my advise to you and whether you like it or not. going to army and not doing your major work will not help you if you plan on going back to grad school.</p>
<p>gtg, you could make that same argument about anyone who doesn’t go to grad school straight from undergrad…and that argument is patently false.</p>
<p>I doubt your military service will seem like a true gap in your experience. Universities understand that many go to college through ROTC and then must repay their debt with service. Some enlist right after college to serve their country. Of all the not-related-to-your-field things you can do, this is the best. When you apply to graduate school, it will be equivalent to your applying directly from undergrad, except that the admissions committee is likely to see you as more mature and more disciplined, both good things. </p>
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<p>This isn’t the same thing. He has gone to college. He already has the basis for a graduate school application. Many who join the military out of high school later find that the benefits don’t pay enough of their college education or that they weren’t meant for academics or . . . well, a host of other reasons. The OP isn’t a statistic. He’s a person who has the preparation (I assume) for a graduate program in mathematics.</p>
<p>I’m reading between the lines, and I assume that the OP is part of ROTC, and has been given a college scholarship in exchange for serving in the military. He doesn’t have a choice about serving. I think it’s much better for him to do it now than to do it after he earns a PhD. Will he definitely want to go to graduate school in four years? Who knows? People and their goals change, even when they go directly to grad school from undergrad.</p>
<p>I’m going to disagree slightly about the LORs. While the OP should go to his professors now and explain his plans, he does not want the letters written just yet since they are supposed to reflect the applicant at the time of application. Plus, I doubt the professors will want to take the time to write them four years before they are needed. As an alternative, the OP may want to ask them to write drafts of their letters now, with the understanding that he will come to them with more information about himself when it is time to submit them. He should also take care to keep in touch with those professors via email at least once a year. </p>
<p>LOR letters should reflect the applicant as he is when applying to graduate school, and certainly those professors will want to talk to him before writing their LORs.</p>
<p>I am also in the same situation as Bird. I am currently an ROTC cadet getting an undergraduate degree in Biochemistry at UC Davis. I wanted to fulfill my four year service obligation as an army officer before going on to graduate school in genetics. I know the army has programs in which you can add years of service on to your enlistment in order to have them pay for graduate school and for you to attend it after you reach the rank of captain. This is known as a gradso, however I am pretty sure this program is only for people who wish to recieve an Masters degree. I want to pursue a PhD in Genetics so it would really appeal to me. I am also not interested in extending my enlistment. Therefore I’m in the same rut as bird, wondering when to get recommendation letters, and whether theres any way I can apply now and attend after four years. Like a four year sabbatical? Also Blair, I was just curious what branch of the army you were going into (infantry, armor, medcorps, aviation, etc.)? I’m trying to go infantry.</p>
<p>Many, many people do not attend grad school right out of undergrad. Most officers get a master’s degree somewhere along the way. My husband spent 27 years in the Army and the Army paid for his MBA, not a degree that civilians would think an Army officer would have. He got his master’s at about year 14.</p>
<p>You may like the military; you may hate it. But if you like it, you may have some great opportunities for getting advanced education. </p>
<p>It seems to me that people who get their master’s sometime after their BA/BS would get recommendations from people they work with like a commander. I don’t remember even needing recommendations for my master’s degree. I can’t imagine if a school requires letters that they would want four-year-old letters, and until you know where you are applying to graduate school, how do you know what they will want?</p>
<p>Do not request letters now. However, do tell your professors that you may wish to go to grad school after the military, and if so, you’d like to know if you may ask them for letters then.</p>
<p>Second, DO NOT plan on using letters from your military superiors if you do apply later. These will not be useful, and almost all graduate programs (except those in business and related fields) will not accept letters from anyone other than former professors.</p>
<p>There will be no problem with applying later. In fact, most of my best graduate students have take time off between college and grad school.</p>
<p>It seems like recommendation letters from my commanding officers would only help me if I was applying to leadership and management programs (like an MBA), I highly doubt it would help me if I was applying to a pure science graduate program like genetics.</p>
<p>I asked my husband if he even got recommendations when he went to grad school: nope. If you are applying for top tier grad schools, the requirements may be pretty strict, but right now, you don’t know. Often, where you go to grad school depends on where you live. My main point was that once you are in the military, different opportunities may open. Many young people go to grad school on the military’s dime, and they do not stay in to retire. It is very difficult today to know where or if you will be applying to graduate school in four years–or whenever your commitment is up.</p>
<p>MD Mom, most graduate programs require letters of recommendation. Your husband must have found an exception.</p>
<p>Mine didn’t require recommendations either. However, when you are in the military, there are schools that have agreements with the military. For example, if you are stationed at Leavenworth and are in public affairs (a branch of service), you can go to the University of Kansas for a master’s in journalism. They also have many agreements with both local and out of the area universities that cater to military personnel. Many of the military schools (e.g. Command and General Staff and War College) offer concurrent programs with universities. Twenty years ago, when we lived in Germany, we could have gotten degrees from the University of Maryland. It’s a different world in the Army.</p>