<p>Agree with the description of Richmond (we visited campus plus lived in Richmond for a few years), it is different in that it feels completely excluded, yet is really close to the city. The immediate surrounding neighborhood is as Faline said quite tony, but just past that are multiple shopping areas - high class mall, high class eclectic and in the other direction, chain eatery type places (ala Olive Garden).
Richmond does have some neat traditions that warmed this Southern belle’s heart, including a chance to wear a white dress, walk down the “Gone With the Wind” steps, and enter a dance on your Dad’s arm. It also has separate student governance of men and women (left over from the days when the campuses were completely separate), which to all accounts gave more leadership opportunities for women (at any rate the female students we talked with were gungho about it). They are pouring money and emphasis into science, as that has not been one of their strongest areas (business, leadership and pre-law).
The biggest downside to DD was kind of silly in retrospect - the extra multi-page apps that had to be completed for merit scholarships. DH and I were a little disappointed, because Richmond can be a great city to live in, even as a poor college student, you can road trip to DC, the beach, Williamsburg, the mountains - lots of fun.</p>
<p>Looks like our daughters may cross paths, curmudgeon! And it sounds like you need to dust off that extended cab for another road trip. New England in the summer is quite nice (and quite a change from Texas). Of course, it would be when gas prices are skyrocketing.</p>
<p>Curmudgeon,</p>
<p>I am glad your D likes Rhodes. I think it is a really extraordinary school, and get the strong sense that Pope is right about it being a college that honors values, but is cosmopolitan enough as a real city is right there. They have a wonderful merit program, and it sure looks like your daughter meets the criteria for GOOD money. I also have a sister and bro-in-law on the faculty at Hanover, and they are very happy there. Sounds like your daughter will have lots of great choices. Look forward to watching this unfold.</p>
<p>Carleton is NOT in a dry town (Northfield). It is located down the hill from the dry campus of St. Olaf. When the Ole’s want to get wet, they wander into downtown (and onto Carleton’s campus). BTW, my D chose Carleton for its strength in the natural sciences (esp. chem, math).</p>
<p>Mudge-arella, indeed. Thanks for a good belly laugh. Your mind is as quick as a whip. Must be all the rattler stomping that keeps you light on your feet. I have a vision of Mudgette with the boots laying down the law for M & D.</p>
<p>And now I am leaving you. My family has decided I need a break from CC. Just because I was preparing dinner while singing, “Mudge-arella, Mudge-arella” to the Disney Cinderella tune. I thought I had something going, but I see the nice young men in their clean white suits…</p>
<p>1.Hanover College,
2.Hobart and Wm. Smith Colleges,
3.Ursinus College ,
4.St. Mary’s College of Md,
5.Centre College,
6.Rhodes College,
7.Scripps College,
8.Hamilton College,
9.Colby College,
10. Bowdoin College,
11. Middlebury College,
12. Williams College</p>
<p>cur, rubbish this thought if you want to, but that’s a lotta apps with a ton of redundancies in the safety moolah (basketball?) category. </p>
<p>If it were my D, I might counsel her to revise the list upwards:</p>
<p>1.Scripps College,
2.Colby College,
3. Bowdoin College,
4. Middlebury College,
5. Williams College</p>
<p>With at least ONE sub-urban (taking advantage of the Rhodes exception) palace of wealth; ie Emory, Vanderbilt, Tulane, WashU. </p>
<p>I know, I know, it’s a curve ball–but I have been paying attention. I know she wants to be rural. I know she wants to play basketball. </p>
<p>Call this: “The Berurah’s S Influence”. The boy who PAINTED, BREATHED and DREAMED Duke may now go to John’s Hopkins because John’s Hopkins threw him a mightly golden curve ball. </p>
<p>So, consider putting in one palace of wealth. A bigger Rhodes. Look at it as something to wave in front of Williams when the day comes, because darlin’? That day is a comin’.</p>
<p>1. WASHU
2.Scripps College,
3.Colby College,
4. Bowdoin College,
5. Middlebury College,
6. Williams College</p>
<p>Based on what you’ve told us about her in the past, I strongly suspect that your daughter might prefer Wellesley to Smith. Both great schools but your daughter sounds more like a Wellesley girl than a Smithie to me (No flames please Mini, TheDad and other Smith parents, just calling it like I see it from Cur’s description of what his daughter liked and didn’t like on their college visits.) "</p>
<p>No flame here - I probably agree! (Smithies do tend to be quirkier, though there is a lot of overlap.)</p>
<p>Middlebury doesn’t have to try to be Williams. In some areas, such as foreign languages, it is notably better. (The student center hole in the ground is said to be filled by January 2007, though they found oil - not usable - on the site, and it has them a little confused. The library hole in the ground will be created as soon as the student center one is filled. Here are the pics - <a href=“http://www.williams.edu/home/construction/baxter/[/url]”>http://www.williams.edu/home/construction/baxter/</a>) If she fits at either of those places (my d. didn’t), you can certainly get a great education at either. They really are like peas-in-a-pod (though Williams math department has a bigger national reputation.) And neither has a national reputation for “quirky” (though they had to put up with me, though I was less quirky in the Dark Ages. ;))</p>
<p>I agree that a few more “reaches” merit more serious consideration cause sounds like your daughter has a lot to offer any school …
women’s basketball in Maine is doing very well…Bowdoin had a great season this year, so I would definitely explore that closer…
Dartmouth came to my mind, Swathmore is supposed to be beautiful and their ED rate would be a shoe in for your daughter if only the $$ didn’t preclude her from ED schools… when it comes to $$ Tulane, Vanderbilt…the math department at Williams is awesome and was a huge draw for my son… I prefer the buildings at Middlebury to Williams though there is something more intimate about the layout at Williams… I can also say that I have never met anyone who went to Middlebury that I didn’t really like…they are fun, smart, hard working folks who are great to work with and have as friends… very alive…
congrats on the job you have done so far guiding your daughter, you done good!</p>
<p>cheers (and everybody else LOL.), I agree with you. She’ll have to lose some or the GC will have an absolute cow. But there are some very kid specific reasons that make some of the apparent safeties highly,terribly selective on at least one level. At two of the schools there are auto admits to med school (Ursinus and Wm. Smith), no mcat-and at one that auto admit is a full ride. Where is that “Power of Positive Thinking” tape ,BTW? I think I’m going to need it. LOL. And if she doesn’t get the top prize, they are appealing in their own right. She might swing for the home-run and get a standup double. </p>
<p>St. Mary’s is there cuz it looks like a resort on the website and appeals $ wise. And did I say it was pretty yet? and reasonably priced? And oh yeah-check out the Nitze Scholars program-too cool. Again, swinging for the fences.</p>
<p>So my point is these schools are safeties or safety-matches but they are also reaches for their “home-run” programs and/or scholarships. That was our plan-however delusional it seems once you see it on paper or on the board.</p>
<p>As far as matches,Centre just appeals to her on some level she can’t even quantify (it’s home, I think, and comfortable, and 80% study abroad) and Rhodes is her,too and everybody is OOS. The waiting room for the tour was 10 kids from 10 states. These two are very different and the same. Both appeal to different parts of her. “Who” will win? I dunno. Remember,these are top 45 LACS that are becoming increasingly selective, they ain’t chicken liver and they get everybody in to med school that applies. (I happen to like chicken liver-Carshon’s deli in Ft.Worth ,Texas was/is the best in these parts.)</p>
<p>Scripps and Hamilton are very highly rated and have at least a couple of merit scholarships, and D may be unique enough in their “stack o files” to get some attention for those rarest of rare awards-nobody else raises goats on a fairly remote ranch for fun and profit, at least no one who is a state level math and science competitor that plays the tuba (well) and might just make the BBall team. Or at least there can’t be THAT many. LOL.</p>
<p>So at first I agree it looks like a rather un-thinkingingly hodge-podged kind of list but-hey, “we gots to start somewhere”. I still haven’t given up on the WUSTLs but D did not like Vandy or Emory. At all. Way too much happening. But, I know they grow up a lot in this next few months. Come on now people. Work with me. Everybody hear Gloria Gaynor belting out “I will survive. I will survive-Hey!Hey!”. All together now! “Hey!Hey!”</p>
<p>Cmudge - </p>
<p>I point out, with some diffidence, that the specificity with which you have described your daughter pretty much eliminates her anonymity at this point to any adcom roaming the boards or to future classmates attending the relatively small schools on her radar.</p>
<p>Notwithstanding, I was pleased to see Williams at the end of the list. As I was reading her attributes, and having just returned from a tour of the school, I was muttering Williams under my breath. I think her twin-separated-at-birth was our tour guide.</p>
<p>Kate, that’s why I don’t tell anything but the truth. I’ve TOLD the adcoms what my screen name is at one of these schools and D has told another! We’ve laughed about it since. (We may be guileless but we are also guiltless.)</p>
<p>It looks thought out–but it needs trimming and a little juice. Just MHO and I am not Ms. LAC/Merit. I think she will get into her top choices. What do you wanna wave at Williams amd Middlebury, a big whopper from Rhodes–or a big whopper from WASHU?</p>
<ol>
<li><p>She has visited Hamilton? Love it because it’s the opposite of “way too much happening”? </p></li>
<li><p>Stop with the planning ahead to med school. That girl is going to get into med school. Are you kidding me with the hedging?</p></li>
<li><p>What does that mean–way too much happening? </p></li>
<li><p>Remember Marite’s mantra–pick a school where she wants to be when she is 22.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>cheers, your 4 , and in various forms from others before you, does have me worried, genuinely. I hope the kid will bump herself up the experience ladder a little faster in this next few months. She has several trips sans parents, and other great growth opps. Girls State will be a great program for her.</p>
<p>Curmudgeon,
your further explanations for why some of the schools are on her list are admirable… auto admit to med school if med school is their # 1 objective is an incredible consideration…my own personal regret is not being as familiar with what schools offer financially to get a talented kid to pick them over another great choice… not sure my son would have merited money and frankly I am not certain that I would welcome that additional complexity in final choice… but, I do wish I had spent more time on the threads that discussed $$ sooner in the process for us… definitely expect to be more savy in this area for S#2 in 4 yrs…
we did visit Pomona and I was impressed with the caliber of education available there… the Carlton consortium is very attractive and we drove from San Francisco to Pomona because we liked soo much of what we heard and saw about it…</p>
<p>I was also thinking Notre Dame, but looks like she really wants smaller and less hype. She may need a “university” more than a LAC… for the intellectual challenges she may crave… good friend has a son at McDaniel, also aimed at med school… doing internship alongside doctor at local hospital as a freshman… family is very big on their son’s experience there… can’t speak about $$ …</p>
<p>I have your D’s name: Mini Mudge</p>
<p>For matches I’d consider geographic areas that get few Texans:</p>
<p>St Lawrence
Lawrence University (also good merit aid)
Kenyon
Hamilton</p>
<p>To me these four are much more in the vein of Colby, Bowdoin, Midd, & Williams than other match/safeties mentioned.</p>
<p>Then add a rolling safety and maybe two “major merit” merit plays: WashU or Vandy… as cheers suggested. I would not go quite as low as you did or if you go that low only do one. </p>
<p>Don’t worry if your list is 12-15 because once other visits have been done it will shrink.</p>
<p>Final comment, many of these snowy/isolated schools are big drinking environments. Can be not so much to do other than frat party. Might be wise to add in a few near a medium sized city (like Lawrence U.)</p>
<p>Not to be a party pooper, but with your concerns about merit aid, are you clear what your EFC would be at Dart, Midd, etc? It might be really wise to crunch those numbers with a Fin Aid officer from one of these schools ASAP to see if they are even in your financial ballpark. </p>
<p>That’s where a Kenyon might really come in handy…</p>
<p>Or a weird thought: can you D hack Colgate basketball? Because I remember there was a merit award to a Colgate kid on another thread.</p>
<p>Cur…</p>
<p>I don’t know your daughter at all but my impression of her list is…</p>
<p>“why is she taking baby steps when Simon says take a giant leap”</p>
<p>isn’t she maybe ready for a bit more gusto?</p>
<p>(just one woman’s perspective)</p>
<p>
Sure, I’m clear. Based on what I know from countless hours of surfing and asking , our EFC will range from a manageable $17k to a nightmarish $37K. LOL. Clear as mud. Do you really think it would be O.K.to let the spring rush calm down and then meet with FA and get them to do a run through using this year’s numbers? I’ll be glad to do all the work if they’ll consider reviewing it as they would when it’s real.</p>
<p>What do you think? Would I get any takers or would the FA folks just say -“sure we love doing unnecessary work, bring it on”?</p>
<p>Curmudgeon, Your daughter’s list is sensible and cohesive. Needless to say, I’m delighted when Williams is on the top of any young person’s list, delighted for the student and the family because I know what a fine experience a Williams education can be. My son’s closest friends are all non to light drinkers and most have received some kind of financial aid. I don’t know all the details, but one or two have pretty much full-rides. If they accept you, the school is generous. My son’s friends are great kids – smart, friendly, talented, multi-faceted, down to earth. Your daughter will definitely fit right in.</p>
<p>I’m definitely one to over-insure, but even considering both selectivity and financial aid, I think the list is a bit too bottom heavy. I wouldn’t eliminate any at this point, but I would consider adding one or two more reaches – like Pomona, Swarthmore, Amherst, Wesleyan.</p>
<p>The only other school on your list that my son seriously considered was Hamilton and it was a top choice. I think that there is a fair amount of overlap culturally, although I would give Williams student body a leg up intellectually. I think the quality of education at Hamilton is excellent (and getting better) and the faculty are engaged and impassioned. One point that did make a difference is accessibility. As we know, Williams and Hamilton are both outposts in the polar wastes (Hamilton actually has a study abroad program in Antarctica which always brings a smile), but Williams actually has a village in the middle the campus, with restaurants, shops, services, motels/B&B’s, a theater, museums etc. It’s not Times Square but it’s sufficient for day to day needs. Hamilton has no town, except for Clinton which is not in walking distance. I am also a bit leery about Hamilton’s administration. The former president, whom I liked very much, departed under a cloud and the current president seems to be courting controversy. I think they are going in the right direction academically and wouldn’t like to see a change in administration affect that.</p>
<p>The other school with a similar feeling to Hamilton that my son was very attracted to was Kenyon. Similar ambiance and academics.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>See? momrath seems to think Mudge-ella will get into her top choices too. Here’s another list: </p>
<p>CC Parents Who Think Mudge-ella will get into Her Reaches:</p>
<p>cheers
momrath(?)
robrym(?)</p>