<p>undertheradar: Unlike Penn CGS, HES gives a student and opportunity to prove themselves before applying for admission. Something that Penn CGS doesn’t until that student is admitted.</p>
<p>Hello,</p>
<pre><code> I feel like I fool. I was wrong about HES. Totally. I wish I could delete my post. To make a long story short. I have had some experience with other grad school sense my last post and HES makes them all look like garbage. I will be attending HES as soon as I finish my bachelors.
</code></pre>
<p>I’m considering the same. Not sure about these proseminar classes…</p>
<p>But I’m 35, and just graduated from Tulane Univ. cum laude…and while trying to study for the GRE I’ve discovered it isn’t a test for me.</p>
<p>So I’m in the middle of oweing $50k in loans…but seemingly unable to move forward without a Master’s degree.</p>
<p>I was considering HES or staying here for Tulane’s SCS MLA program.</p>
<p>Harvard Exetension is Legit
Good and You?</p>
<p>Hello,</p>
<p>I am a current Extension School student. One user complained that this thread was “outdated” so I thought I might chip in some helpful information for prospective students.</p>
<p>First of all, it is absolutely critical that you understand that Harvard Extension School is NOT Harvard College. Yes, it is true that you can downplay your affiliation with the Extension School on your resume (you are permitted, though not necessarily encouraged, to simply write that you received an ALB from Harvard University). There are two reasons as to why this is a bad idea. For one, employers and graduate school admission officers, if they catch it, will view you as a dishonest and subpar candidate who took a circuitous route to get into Harvard. More importantly, your implicit embarrassment of being affiliated with the Extension School corroborates the stigma and further damages the reputation of HES. I really cannot understand why so many HES students and alumni are so embarrassed of this affiliation. Although HES is not Harvard College, an honest representation of your HES degree will be an asset, not a liability.</p>
<p>So why do I mention this? Because if your only reason for wanting to come to HES is to add the Harvard name to your resume (and especially if you plan on being one of the HES alumni who downplays his affiliation to the Extension School), you really ought not to come. Harvard College students, who went through a much more rigorous admissions process, have that right; Extension School students do not. You are always welcome to apply for freshman or transfer admissions to Harvard College if you wish to be part of the former category.</p>
<p>That being said, there are many excellent reasons as to why you should come to the Extension School. First, you have the opportunity to study with Harvard faculty. Professors from the Divinity School, Law School, Medical School, and Kennedy School have all taught courses at the Extension School. You have an unprecedented opportunity to receive a first-rate education for a relatively inexpensive price (about $925 for a 4-credit course). If admitted, you will receive an ID card, and you will be able to take advantage of many Harvard facilities: libraries, museums, practice rooms, et al.</p>
<p>It is true that most HES courses are open-enrollment, but it should not be assumed that these classes are a “joke” by any means. Most of them are actually quite challenging, and you will need to work very hard if you want to get good grades. High performing HES students can petition to enroll in Harvard College and even GSAS classes during the daytime (although you will have to pay College/GSAS tuition). Although the admissions process is much less rigorous than its College counterpart, it is not “guaranteed admission,” as some mistakenly believe; you need to receive at least Bs in three courses and write an acceptable two page essay before you can apply to the program. As the average age of the ALB student is 35, high school performance and SAT/ACT scores are non-relevant factors in the admissions process.</p>
<p>Demographically speaking, this is not the ideal school for teenagers coming out of high school. HES is a nontraditional school aimed towards the working adult population. They are, of course, welcome to apply (and yes, there are younger students, including myself, at HES), but my advice to them would be to carefully reconsider before coming here. Social life for HES students does exist, but it is quite limited and may not be the most hospitable environment for younger students. However, for younger students who are mature for their age and are more concerned about academics than social life, HES is an excellent alternative.</p>
<p>Like any nontraditional programs, HES has its ups and downs. I will be eternally grateful to HES for the opportunities it has spawned for me. But the MOST, MOST, MOST important and overriding factor is what you make out of your HES education. Ultimately, whether you come here to HES or attend a random state school that no one has ever heard of, the most important thing is what you make out of your resources. HES ALB alumni have gone on to study at Yale, Columbia, Oxford, Cambridge, and professional and graduate schools at Harvard. If you are willing to utilize the resources given to you to your maximum ability, HES definitely has more leverage over any state school. But to the avaricious, dishonest, unqualified, and lazy narcissist who only wants to come here to boast of having gone to a good school, I say…keep on looking (and I mean this sincerely, that you are such a person, you will be wasting your time and money).</p>
<p>I am just about to begin my first open enrollment course at HES.</p>
<p>With a Bachelors and 2 Masters’ degrees from other institutions (obtained through the traditional admissions process route), I did quite a bit of research on HES before enrolling. I was somewhat deterred initially, becasue of the degree to which HES is bashed by people (some on this site). </p>
<p>I am very proud of my other institutions (and the degrees obtained there) and would never want to give the impression that I earned those credentials anywhere other than where I did. I also would NEVER trade the degrees I got for Harvard degrees.</p>
<p>[In fact, for my other degrees I specifically chose NOT to even apply to Harvard because Harvard (by its own admission) did not offer academic or professional experiences geared towards the goals I then satisfied at the other institutions].</p>
<p>Now I reach a juncture where both Harvard, and extension school make sense. I don’t want a PhD, dont’ need another “traditional” masters’ – but, living in the Boston/Cambridge area very much would like to continue to broaden my intellectual and professional horizons, building on past achievements. </p>
<p>I have finally concluded that detractors of the Harvard Extension School either (1) are bitter against Harvard because of their own failures with the more competitive limited-enrollment programs want to pick on the extension school to get even (or at least make thier own failure seem ‘noble’ in some way) or (2) simply haven’t achieved enough degrees/credentials with selective institutions to recognize that the admissions process is only a necessary element of any limited enrollment program, and not part of the quality of the academic curriculum itself.</p>
<p>I have concluded (after having read extensively on the criticisms of HES), that I do not NEED Harvard on my resume, do not want Harvard to “overshadow” any other credentials I have and will not be stigmatized by anyone who matters if I now choose to enhance my career with work at HES. I have also concluded that as I enter into HES, I bring a contribution from my non-Harvard degrees, professional institutions and experiences that I hope will enhance Harvard’s academic and intellectual envrionment, and make the Harvard experience for better others (whether HES or otherwise) than it might have otherwise been.</p>
<p>From my initial consults with the HES faculty, I am convinced that Harvard (collectively) knows that the Harvard culture (and academic offerings) are only one part of a much larger global academic community. Harvard spends significant resources bringing visiting scholars, lecturers and students from other insitutions to offer things that are simply not a regular part of Harvard College (or other academic units of the university). Harvard, from all I have seen, has always welcomed people from “beyond the yard” to bring what they have to offer, and gain some of what Harvard has to give. </p>
<p>I would offer that the extension school is valuable to Harvard precisely because its attendees are NOT over-achieving high-school kids fresh off the bus and ARE from other institutions, from the professions and from other walks of life that simply would not “fit” anywhere else in the Harvard student community.</p>
<p>To have within the University student body a contingent of mature adults actively engaged in the professions on a full-time, daily basis is a tremendous asset to Harvard as an institution. Furthermore, to have students who continue to invest in their education and in academic pursuits well after having earned their way into their respective professions provides both an example of “real world” success and a vital link to the world beyond the yard that the students of Harvard College – or other units in the university might otherwise lack.</p>
<p>Therefore, to detractors of HES, I would have to say I’ve chosen to ignore you. Given the choice, I still wouldn’t go to Harvard College for undergrad, I’d go where I went and I dont’ enter HES with any sense that somehow my non-Harvard experiences and achievements are of any lesser value or worth than this new experience, which happens to now involve a unit of Harvard University.</p>
<p>I’ve never heard anyone from the Harvard administration ever suggest that research, education and acheivemetns at other institutions are of lesser value than those occuring at Harvard. In fact, it always seems to be the opposite (Harvard folks seem to like to collaborate outside of Harvard). With considerable encouragement from within the University, I am pleased to be enrolled in the extension school as a contributor to Harvard’s academic community in as much as I choose to become involved.</p>
<p>Ok, lets get this straight, if HES had the same prestige and caliber as other Harvard Grad Programs or the College, there would be NO need for differentiation. HES admits a majority of its applicants-whereas almost every other program admits less than 10% (sometimes even about 4-5%). HES is understood to be a resource for those who need it, but anyone who is familiar with Harvard will recognize that “L” in the middle of the degree abbreviation. It’s just a way for people who can afford it to “buy” some Harvard in their lives. </p>
<p>You are in NO way looked at as Harvard Grad/Undergrad students, you are not fully part of the Harvard Yard tradition, and no, HES students will not end up in the high ranking positions/Wall Street etc. that Harvard students are known for being in. How many HES grads are supreme court justices, politicians, presidents, etc.? I’m not saying a Harvard College diploma is a guarantee for success, but please be honest with yourselves. </p>
<p>Please do not knock on undergrads, obviously you envy the prestige that our alma mater brings to us, and you wish to purchase a bit of your own. Do not act as though it is impossible for non-traditional students to be admitted into the college. In the class of 2014 there is a man in his early twenties with a wife and child who has been in the military. I know a girl who just didn’t apply to college until a couple years after graduating high school. </p>
<p>Nobody is jealous of you HES people, anyone who can afford it can attend HES. Many of the success stories you hear have already even attended Harvard College and are going to get pre-med requirements etc. You are not extraordinary for attending HES, if you were on the same level as Harvard College, why are you forced to call your degree A.L.B. instead of A.B.? Do recruiters practically beg you to attend sessions weekly? Don’t try to act as though you are a full-fledged Harvardian, when you didn’t do as much work to earn your positions as true Harvardians. Accept your status as a person wanting to somehow become a part of an amazing institution who couldn’t do so otherwise. Accept your status as someone who can afford to pay for classes and get a simple degree from a secondary/pay-as-you-go part of Harvard. That is how we all view you.</p>
<p>There is no need to write long essays on how you feel you work as hard as real Harvard students, and describing how you are real Harvard students. Truth is, you don’t, and you aren’t. Of course, you are indeed affiliated with Harvard, nobody denies that, but you are known for what you are. HES is a secondary part of Harvard, never boasted or bragged about, they just want your money.</p>
<p>In reality, it doesn’t matter what Harvard tells you to lure you in, in terms of job searching, your degree is not held to the same prestige as Harvard College, plain and simple. It’s similar to students who do summer studies at Harvard, yes they receive an ID and are called students of Harvard, but they are not regarded as the true cream of Harvard’s crop. Harvard is anything but fair and impartial, so unfortunately the subjectivity that inevitably surrounds harvard and makes it great will turn around to haunt you.</p>
<p>“…You are in NO way looked at as Harvard Grad/Undergrad students, you are not fully part of the Harvard Yard tradition…”</p>
<p>I’ll remember that the next time I organise a business launch at the HCNY, bah! </p>
<p>Where were the College undergrads attacked in that post, you seem to have been spurred onto some sort of skewed and nonsensical rant for reasons that I cannot identify. All I can see is that the poster was “knocking” on those who feel bitter at being rejected, not on anyone at Harvard College!</p>
<p>I hate to bust your bubble starlight, but I’ve got one
of those worthless ALB’s, and I seem to find myself
in medschool. Maybe Admissions made a mistake,
I’ll go and ask.</p>
<p>I am sure that President Obama or any public figure Starlight might admire would never speak the way he/she just did about people he/she doesn’t know. People like President Obama have class, humility, and respect and regard for everyone of every background. Starlight has reminded us that it is one of the biggest misfortunes of our country that Harvard ends up having to educate some people who are the exact opposite.</p>
<p>“In reality, it doesn’t matter what Harvard tells you to lure you in, in terms of job searching, your degree is not held to the same prestige as Harvard College, plain and simple. It’s similar to students who do summer studies at Harvard, yes they receive an ID and are called students of Harvard, but they are not regarded as the true cream of Harvard’s crop. Harvard is anything but fair and impartial, so unfortunately the subjectivity that inevitably surrounds harvard and makes it great will turn around to haunt you.”</p>
<p>To those who quote themselves as exceptions to this rule–well DUH, it’s not as though only Harvard undergrads can go to med school. Anybody who goes to school and tries can get into at least one medical school. I’m not insinuating that success is only for Harvard students, obviously that is not true, and I apologize if you took it that way. </p>
<p>All I’m saying is that you don’t and won’t receive the same perks and privileges (and not on paper, I mean socially, in terms of job search, etc.). It goes without saying that even if other schools academically can rival Harvard, there’s just something about that name that can open doors for a person…and unfortunately you won’t get that special Harvard pass. You’ll get the pass of any regular graduate of any school in America. It’s not fair, but that’s how the cookie crumbles.</p>
<p>P.S. Please do not judge my character, when have I ever stated that I had no regard for you? It is you who has passed judgement on me. I respect anyone who tries to better themselves, which I can assume you are doing. I never said the “ALB” is worthless, in the same way that a Univ. of Phoenix degree is not worthless. No amount of education is ever worthless. However, if a person is in the minor leagues, he can’t just say he is a world-famous professional baseball player by association with the MLB. Yes in a way that is true, but you won’t help but think he is in the minor league, and not the major. You may not want his autograph, and you may not want to see him play, but there is no denying that he does play baseball.</p>
<p>“Don’t try to act as though you are a full-fledged Harvardian, when you didn’t do as much work to earn your positions as true Harvardians. Accept your status as a person wanting to somehow become a part of an amazing institution who couldn’t do so otherwise. Accept your status as someone who can afford to pay for classes and get a simple degree from a secondary/pay-as-you-go part of Harvard. That is how we all view you.”</p>
<p>You have regard for HES students? Should I quote more?</p>
<p>The main takeaway here is that you shouldn’t assume that people who elect to pursue high quality ug/graduate studies want the same things out of their school that Harvard College undergraduates want. Some people use their college affiliation to make things happen for themselves, some people just make things happen.</p>
<p>“Many of the success stories you hear have already even attended Harvard College and are going to get pre-med requirements etc”</p>
<p>then</p>
<p>“To those who quote themselves as exceptions to this rule–well DUH, it’s not as though only Harvard undergrads can go to med school”</p>
<p>For a College kid, starlight*, you have a delightful debating style, we both know what you were implying in the first post.</p>
<p>Despite your comic lurchings, you and I can actually agree about the College’s prestige and importance, but when were these brought into question? There is no doubt that a freshly minted, averagely academic, College grad has relatively more options open to her than would otherwise be the case.</p>
<p>We also agree that for an average student, the Extension offers not much more than a normal University. But where we differ, and this is a point that makes the subject far more complicated than I have seen addressed, is with its upper quantile students. You have to be crazy to think that these students are not in a position to leverage the Harvard brand, and indeed Harvard bends over backwards in supporting these students (and I mean really supporting). For this segment, I’m sorry but our Harvard affiliation is not at all coming back to “haunt us”, you may not like it, but as you say, Harvard isn’t always fair.</p>
<p>What do you guys think about a high school student doing a HES online course for the fun of it? Is it worth the 1000ish dollars? Would colleges look down on me as the type of person who just throws money at things? Would simply taking a comparable course at the local community college be better?
Is the curriculum of these courses of a high harvard-ish quality? Or is it just like the HSS program, something designed just to get money out of people?</p>
<p>I like how some posters on this forum have deliberately avoided certain points in my argument regarding the prestige/difficulty of HES versus the college and graduate schools. You insist on avoiding the truth of the matter, HES is not the same in terms of prestige, no argument can dismiss this fact. Yes, education is not simply about prestige, but then why does the Ivy League garner so much international recognition-there is just something about having an ivy diploma. </p>
<p>So despite your specious arguments that describe how you are indeed the creme de la creme of Harvard, the truth still remains that you are NOT. Why would Harvard separate you from the college if you were truly qualified? You are rather lucky to be able to afford the extravagant costs per course. Please do not bring up that “real-world experience” rubbish, there are individuals in both the grad schools and the college with experiences, wives and husbands, children, and “adult” lives of their own. You probably could not have been admitted to Harvard normally, and do not even begin to claim that HES admissions are anywhere near as competitive as the rest of Harvard.</p>
<p>The fact that this discussion even is occurring is further support for my argument in and of itself-the fact that there are key and obvious differences between Harvard and HES reveals that the two are very different, and are regarded as such. Harvard Business/Med, etc. and Harvard Undergraduate College are one thing, HES is another.</p>
<p>And does Harvard really support you in ways that any other university, including online universities, wouldn’t? Do they support you to the same extent that they support college and grad students? Please tell me just one opportunity that is just so exceedingly extraordinary…and I’ll immediately retort with one that quintuples it.</p>
<p>Starlight, could you please read my last post again and relate it to yours. Nobody has deliberately avoided any issues, nobody is saying the Extension is better than the College, and nobody is saying that the Extension students are the creme de la creme of Harvard. I honestly don’t know were you get these ideas.</p>
<p>You refer to the Extension’s “extravagant” costs, could you please do some research into that statement. If you do then you would find that the cost per course makes the Extension anything but the money making machine that you insinuate it to be. As far as the Extension’s difficulty is concerned, the official line from Harvard is that the Extension’s standards meet those that one would expect of the Harvard brand and its students are held to the same standards as the College. I have had the occasion to have this sentiment confirmed by two College professors, one who also taught a course through the Extension and another at the College when I was admitted to take classes at it, alongside the College students (you see the separating line is not as clear cut as you make out). </p>
<p>In my last post I did in fact address the issue of prestige and stated that simply graduating from the Extension does not bestow you with any entitlements. But the reality of the matter is that excelling with LORs and personal recommendations from Harvard faculty simply does! This is an issue of shades of gray and not easily consigned to black and white thinking.</p>
<p>In case you are for some reason mistaking me, I personally hold massive respect for the College and its students. I will freely admit that the Extension plays tag-along to the College’s actives. But this doesn’t condemn it to the abysmal depths that you would have it. It is a serious part of Harvard and this view is backed up both publicly and privately by the Faculty, including President Faust who proclaimed it a “critical part of Harvard” . </p>
<p>I think we have all got a bit carried away with this issue. A message board is not the most conducive place to discuss such things since there runs the serious risk of unintentional misunderstandings.</p>
<p>The extension school does not offer the kind of depth in a major (concentration, at Harvard) that most any “regular” college offers. That is why the degree is in “liberal studies.” For this reason, I chose UMass Boston over HES. Anyone choosing Harvard Extension is going for prestige versus substantive study in a particular academic area.</p>
<p>Hi compmom,</p>
<p>I agree the HES has less options, but you can in fact pursue
several subjects in depth. I did my field of study (major) in computer
science and had to take numerous course at grad level. Other programs
offer more, but I was prepared by my studies for a theoretically intense
Msc at a highly ranked UK Uni.</p>
<p>The liberal arts nomenclature is totally crazy since they are increasingly
becoming professionally focused.</p>
<p>Now that I have actually attended HES for a little while I feel I have some more perspective here than before.</p>
<p>What really struck me when I got into the sustainability course was the quality of the students. It actually floored me. A plurality appear to already have masters’ degrees or PhD’s from other programs [including highly reputable and selective programs – even GASP! Harvard staff and graduates of limited enrollment Harvard programs who now (years after graduating from other Harvard Programs) are enrolled in extension school to expand their knowledge in the field]. </p>
<p>Typical students in the class I am taking are senior analysts, managers and executives in the energy industry, the transportation industry, the UN, the World Bank and other well known and highly reputable institutions. It is also very clear that they are involved with HES because they have a passion for learning a subject that is ever evolving – and recognize the need to continue building and EXTENDING their knowledge throughout their career.</p>
<p>The idea that any of them are trying to find some kind of a “substitute” for an undergraduate, professional or academic degree seems kind of silly given how established most of them are. Many look to me like the kind of people who HIRE Harvard College graduates (not the kind of people who compete with them). Overall the achievements of the HES students I see stands alone and speaks for itself, and would stand up just fine with or without the Harvard name.</p>
<p>By and large, the HES students I see dont’ need to impune (or co-opt) the achievements of others elsewhere in the University and seem to be confident in thier own quality and abilty. It is really sad to see people posting here who have been through Harvard’s limited enrollment undergraduate and graduate programs and apparently come away feeling as though the admissions process (instead of a prologue to the real achivement) still stands in their minds as the greatest thing they achieved with Harvard. It is as if HES detractors seem to think that Harvard exists to justify its admissions process – instead of the admissions process existing to support Harvard inasmuch as Harvard and its Fellows find they need or want such a process.</p>
<p>It is actually somewhat insulting to Harvard for an alumnus to say that the best thing they got from Harvar’ds limited enrollment program is a chance to be picked as part of a small percentage from a big pool. </p>
<p>Most of the people I know who have been through lmited enrollment programs at Harvard seem to love Harvard, and are proud of the University (Extension School and all) and wouldn’t come out online and bash any part of the University. Most also see the highly competitve admissions process of Harvard’s limited enrollment programs as an exercise they were glad to be done with so they could get on with the business of what they actually went on to accomplish at Harvard. Most seem to understand that getting admitted is only an invitation – and not the substance of whatever they did when they got there. – However not-so with this miniory who feel a need to come online and bash HES. </p>
<p>From the rants of some HES bashers here, you would think that Harvard is basically a lottery slanted by childhood (High School) accomplishments - and earning the degree, doing the research and making the grades at Harvard itself are just kind of an afterthought to “getting picked”. But Harvard is not just a PowerBall weighted by GPA, GRE and SAT – and Harvard has a right to offer what it wants to whom it wants how it wants. Anyone who respects what the institution offers would not bash the institution and its academic offerings simply to conserve some kind of notion of “purity” about the selective, but often arbitrary admissions process that cannot possibly admit even a substantial fraction of qualified applicants.</p>
<p>Is admission itself really the most valuable thing these detractors got from going thier limited-enrollment Harvard experiences? Is that really where they see the value of their experiences there? If so, I’m sorry – maybe they should have attended the extension school as well (HES would have given them alot more than just a chance to say “look at me I’m in the 5%!”). For the HES detractors here (those who have been through Harvard’s limited enrollment programs), – why not focus on what you achieved with Harvard yourself? Why not focus on what you did? What you learned? What you are now empowered to accomplish with the things Harvard gave you? It would seem as though that should give you more than enough gratitude towards Harvard to keep you from feeling any sort of bitter need to bash its Extension School. </p>
<p>This is the thing that I just can’t fathom about the HES detractors who claim to be Harvard Alumni. If in fact HES detractors DO believe that “getting picked” is the centerpiece of higher educatoin – it’s time to move on, time to grow up – and time to quit bashing HES and instead start looking for an achivement that speaks for itself with or without a committee to write you a letter and tell you you’re special.</p>
<p>Starlight’s argument is flawed.</p>
<p>“Why would Harvard separate you from the college if you were truly qualified? … You probably could not have been admitted to Harvard normally, and do not even begin to claim that HES admissions are anywhere near as competitive as the rest of Harvard.” </p>
<p>In particular these two statements. What relevance does qualification have to individual schools being separate from each other in Harvard University? This assumes when you wrote “college” you meant University. This is not simply semantics. If you meant Harvard College, well that would indicate it is obviously separate from the other schools in Harvard University. Being separate has no bearing on qualification; they are separate because they serve different communities.
Your second statement I can understand because it follows the train of thought you have established. But it is flawed as well. You would do well with reading this:[gladwell</a> dot com - getting in](<a href=“http://www.gladwell.com/2005/2005_10_10_a_admissions.html]gladwell”>http://www.gladwell.com/2005/2005_10_10_a_admissions.html)
If you don’t wish to read it:</p>
<p>"By the nineteen-sixties, Harvard’s admissions system had evolved into a series of complex algorithms. The school began by lumping all applicants into one of twenty-two dockets, according to their geographical origin. (There was one docket for Exeter and Andover, another for the eight Rocky Mountain states.) Information from interviews, references, and student essays was then used to grade each applicant on a scale of 1 to 6, along four dimensions: personal, academic, extracurricular, and athletic. Competition, critically, was within each docket, not between dockets, so there was no way for, say, the graduates of Bronx Science and Stuyvesant to shut out the graduates of Andover and Exeter. More important, academic achievement was just one of four dimensions, further diluting the value of pure intellectual accomplishment. Athletic ability, rather than falling under “extracurriculars,” got a category all to itself, which explains why, even now, recruited athletes have an acceptance rate to the Ivies at well over twice the rate of other students, despite S.A.T. scores that are on average more than a hundred points lower. And the most important category? That mysterious index of “personal” qualities. According to Harvard’s own analysis, the personal rating was a better predictor of admission than the academic rating. Those with a rank of 4 or worse on the personal scale had, in the nineteen-sixties, a rejection rate of ninety-eight per cent. Those with a personal rating of 1 had a rejection rate of 2.5 per cent. When the Office of Civil Rights at the federal education department investigated Harvard in the nineteen-eighties, they found handwritten notes scribbled in the margins of various candidates’ files. “This young woman could be one of the brightest applicants in the pool but there are several references to shyness,” read one. Another comment reads, “Seems a tad frothy.” One application—and at this point you can almost hear it going to the bottom of the pile—was notated, “Short with big ears.”</p>
<p>Another interesting passage:</p>
<p>In the 2001 book “The Game of Life,” James L. Shulman and William Bowen (a former president of Princeton) conducted an enormous statistical analysis on an issue that has become one of the most contentious in admissions: the special preferences given to recruited athletes at selective universities. Athletes, Shulman and Bowen demonstrate, have a large and growing advantage in admission over everyone else. At the same time, they have markedly lower G.P.A.s and S.A.T. scores than their peers. Over the past twenty years, their class rankings have steadily dropped, and they tend to segregate themselves in an “athletic culture” different from the culture of the rest of the college. Shulman and Bowen think the preference given to athletes by the Ivy League is shameful.</p>
<p>Halfway through the book, however, Shulman and Bowen present “” finding. Male athletes, despite their lower S.A.T. scores and grades, and despite the fact that many of them are members of minorities and come from lower socioeconomic backgrounds than other students, turn out to earn a lot more than their peers. Apparently, athletes are far more likely to go into the high-paying financial-services sector, where they succeed because of their personality and psychological makeup."</p>
<p>The take away from Ivy League admissions and Harvard is that they do not have a meritocracy, it is not simply the top 5 percent(or whatever percentage one wants to make of it) of the country quantitatively.
Another point which was made in an article I read was that the increasing amount of applicants, and subsequent reduced admission rate would reject many applicants that have superior numbers. They cannot accept everybody who had a perfect SAT score and was the top of there class. Combine this reality with the fact that Harvard does not select simply on quantitative criteria means this:</p>
<p>Not even current Harvard College students could claim with authority that they would have been admitted, if say we could go back and run the selection process over. </p>
<p>In regards to Harvard Extension School’s selection criteria, it serves non-traditional students. This is an eclectic group. Those who quit college (including Ivies), did not go to college, or could not go (for myriad reasons), and I am sure many situations I have not, or could not think of right now. Should the selection criteria be the same as the college? I don’t know. Would similar selection criteria be relevant? Possibly not. You can’t live off a perfect SAT score forever (some do try). Also those who work are automatically disqualified from attending Harvard College. They would have to quit work to attend. As it is Harvard Extension School seems to be a meritocracy, you prove you can do the work by actually showing you can do it. Which I should point out is one goal of the selection criteria at elite schools. </p>
<p>If we really wanted to accept only the cream of the crop at Harvard, we could do something like this: Have Harvard College have their own exam. Not the SAT. Open to everybody. Have the College hold night and weekend classes as well as their day classes, to serve those who must work. Take the exam and just take the top regardless of background, high school, essay blah blah blah.</p>