I don’t believe the Professor should have been arrested either and, as I said earlier, the officer is a professional in dealing with these situations so that’s the bottom line to me (that the officer should have never let it get to this point.)</p>
<p>I get what you’re saying about the candy, but if you believed the child to be in imminent danger such as running into the street or a burglar in the house, would you handle it in quite the same way? Frame of mind comes into play in both cases. Professor Gates has centuries of history in his mind, whereas Officer Crowley may be running on adrenaline and unsure if there is a dangerous person in the house. I can see both positions.</p>
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Isn’t part of that honor and kindness expecting to be safe in an emergency? I respectfully submit to you that I’ve never seen an emergency responder who wasn’t brusque and rushy (that’s my word) when they were dealing with a dangerous situation. I get what you’re saying, I really do. Professor Gates shouldn’t have been arrested, for sure, but when a professional is dealing with what appears to reasonable eyes to be an honest-to-goodness dangerous situation shouldn’t they be allowed TO deal and get to the bottom of it?</p>
<p>So you are saying the police should approach robbery suspects (or as zooser said, people in immediate danger) with the utmost love? Your example is irrelevant.</p>
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<p>Why do we have to say this over and over again, we do not know if Crowley instigated Gates’ response, or not. Wait for the facts before making such claims</p>
<p>Because those details interest me. If I argue against them, then they interest me. I may even agree with them, but argue against them nevertheless to see how it might go.</p>
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<p>Absolutely not! I have already acknowledged a belief that Gates was probably unhinged at the end of the engagement. But the cop has the guns and the might of law on his side. It is a responsibility that he should dispatch in accord with the Constitution. Gates did not have any such responsibility. This means Gates should be able to do everything within his rights, including mouthing off at an officer, without fear of being arrested by the government. You are just cutting your own throat and don’t know it with all this nonsense. You are actually helping to usher in the police state where cops can literally bash citizens simply for speaking their minds. Your nation is cursed, and you do not even see it.</p>
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<p>The officer was asked his opinion. Had he decided not to comment, it would have been tantamount to siding with Gates, since everyone would understand that he was not commenting because he did not wish to break with Gates. His fellow officers would still have hated him for failing to remain in the blue wall. If people here disagree with this, then marvelous. I literally have no care about it. I believe my view is superior to yours and will continue to believe this until you say something that is less puerile than the nonsense you have submitted thus far.</p>
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<p>I do trut cops. I just am suspicious until they demonstrate a willingness to help. I trust whites. I have white members in my family – lots of them in fact. I trust them with my life. I trust white society no more and no less than I do black society, depending upon what is at stake. I really mean this. </p>
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<p>It all depends upon what is at stake, of course. For example, if we are talking about love and transparency, I trust my wife. She is just the greatest human being ever to have lived on this wretched planet. If I had just fifty days to live and could be with anyone I choose on each of the days, I would choose to spend every single one of them with her, and die a very happy man. But, if we are talking about love of my soul and compassion enough to save it despite its sordid condition, then I could not even trust my wife there. Only One merits trust to that most profound extent.</p>
<p><a href=“%5Burl=http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/1062971591-post586.html]#586[/url]”>quote</a> …I said cops are wicked, not dumb. The black cop knows he has to keep his job, and that he has to endure his fellow officers, probably almost all of whom are white. Were he to tell the truth, the white officers would make his life a working hell, a hell of the sort that he could not prove. He likely knows this, and would rather simply maintain solidarity with the officers. It is a wise move because Gates gains very little by having the black officers support. And Gates loses little by having the black officer side with the white guy. But if the black guy sides with Gates, the only thing that happens is that black guy loses everything.
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<p>This rationale/‘logic’ may explain Mr. Gates’ rationale/‘logic’ for his behavior.</p>
I agree with you on this as a philosophical matter. I’m a conservative and governmental overreach at every level horrifies me.
But as a PRACTICAL matter what I see first and foremost is that when the officer came, Professor Gates should have been afraid that a crime was being or had been committed, until everything was cleared up. It’s not outside the realm of possibility that the door could have been broken or Professor Gates absence didn’t go unnoticed and his arrival scared a bad guy away. But I’m a woman and I’m always worried about physical safety.</p>
I think the cop was wrong according to the law and that there should be some legal recourse for it. I am not a lawyer, obviously. So I do not know what the options are. But it seems to me contrary to the law to have cops just arresting people on whim.</p>
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If it is a child, of course not. But if it is an adult, certainly! If I thought Gates was in danger, kindly asking him to exit and commanding him to exit would have precisely the same functional meaning,. And it would have radically different emotional meaning. There is really no excuse here to begin without kindness. Emergencies in this case is no cause to show disrespect.
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<p>I think the cop should have seen them too. In other words, kindness is a great tool to use, and I think he would have used it had Gates been white.</p>
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Perhaps. But perhaps not.
Absolutely. But it is inappropriate to, in getting to the bottom of it, assume that the homeowner is guilty until proven innocent. Gates rightly bristled against being treated like a criminal in his own house. The cop should have kindly explained himself and asked Gates to help out. I do not think he did, though the function of getting Gates out of the house would not have suffered at all. Even if there were a fire, he could easily have said “Sir! Fire! Hurry from the house!” and Gates would have instantly complied. Gates is a smart man. He knew the cop was being uncharitable and “coppy”, and I think that is what cause the thing to get off on the wrong foot.</p>
Aren’t you assuming right now that the officer thought Professor Gates was guilty of anything? It is entirely possible that the officer thought any occupant of the house was in imminent danger based on the 9-11 call and wanted to get the location secured. I kind of think that from the officer’s perspective, responding to a crime in progress would create a sense of urgency that might not be apparent after the fact. I guess I just don’t see what harm there would have been in stepping out of the building and letting the officer explain ‘cause what if there actually was an intruder? I still think that Professor Gates’ statement of acting on instinct is exactly what happened. His mouth got ahead of his mind and the officer probably took that to the bank. Reading his statements, it doesn’t sound like Professor Gates was too kind in declining.</p>
<p>I think we should look at this a different way. Reasonable minds can differ about various aspects of Officer Crowley’s conduct. But Gates was clearly way beyond the bounds of any notion of acceptable behavior toward a police officer who was just trying to do his job.</p>
<p>Now, I have no doubt that, because of his race, Gates was particularly sensitive to the situation. But he was also clearly throwing his weight around and NO ONE–white, black, yellow or purple should be allowed to heap that kind of abuse on a police officer responding to a 911 call. Where’s the outrage from Deval Patrick et. al.?</p>
<p>In any event, once he started berating Crowley and would not stop, Gates was subject to the Super Chicken rule–you knew the job was dangerous when you took it, Fred. He should also remember a bumper sticker from my insufficiently misspent youth–if you don’t like the police, next time you’re in trouble, call a hippie. (I know, I’m dating myself.)</p>
<p>You can call my comments whatever you wish, but at least I make sense. All you are doing is over speculating and complicating the whole issue so it fits with your inflexible attitude towards society as a whole. I guess everyone else’s comments are also puerile since they are not as lengthy and sophisticated as your own responses? </p>
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<p>In other words: see if I will fool anyone with my ridiculous, yet lavish, arguments.</p>
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<p>Exactly my point, you are the only one here that can’t admit that Gates overreacted.</p>
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<p>Or maybe because he did not want to get himself involved in the whole ordeal? </p>
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<p>Suspicion and distrust are practically synonymous. I love how you contradict yourself.</p>
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<p>Say your wife was a policewoman in this very specific situation. If she told you: “Gates overreacted and there was no racial profiling” would you believe her? I doubt it.</p>
<p>Care to share Prof. Gates’ history for creating a scene? Someone said Duke in the 90’s? Well then, that certainly ought to end all discussion…:rolleyes:</p>
If he lives in it, it’s his home. You can rent your home, you know. You don’t have to own it for the police to have to have a search warrant to enter.</p>
<p>I heard on the radio (Glenn Beck) that Gates was returning from China. I agree with Glenn Beck, Professor Gates came home tired and exhausted, his keys weren’t working and he probably became frustrated about trying to enter his home, then the cops show up and he probably says ***** now I have to deal with them. He was frustrated and the police added into his stress level, it escalated from there.</p>
<p>3bm, the property is owned by Harvard, so the police were also there to protect Harvard’s property. They got a call to respond to a b&e. What I was stating is that it was the property of Harvard, not Mr. Gates.</p>
<p>First of all, I am glad you are not a police officer. Second of all, you keep assuming that the officer “disrespectfully” approached Gates. To me, it looks as if, Gates disrespectfully reacted to someone who is doing his job in a normal fashion. Anyways, you nor I can assume anything regarding who instigated this conflict (until some facts come out). So, we should not be using that as part of our arguments.</p>
<p>Waitn, the quote I quoted was not from Drosselmeirer. Someone else said that Prof. Gates was the one lacking “credibility” because he had a history of “creating a scene” (something about Duke in the 90’s someone said). My response was laced with the sarcasm deserved of such a statement.</p>
<p>@poetsheart, I couldn’t imagine Dross saying anything like that. Prof Gates is his hero. Sorry I did not catch the sarcasm, I could just see this guy starting a scene at Duke.</p>