Help choosing for twins: UMD [full ride for one], UPenn [$30k], Berkeley, UCLA, [Rutgers $22-29k] [students in NJ, divorced parents, one parent in CA and students can get CA resident tuition]

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1

Hello,

I have twins who are eligible for instate tuition in CA due to their father living in CA.

They got to many colleges (they applied to too many :)) and now they have to make a choice by May 1.

Twin 1:

  1. UMD full ride
  2. UCLA - CA in-state tuition, got into a fast track program with guaranteed research starting sophomore year
  3. Berkeley - CA in-state tuition, got into ECS department
  4. UPenn - $30K (got need based aid)

Twin 2

  1. UCLA
  2. UPenn - $30K
    They both also got into GT ($46K), UCSB (regent scholarship), UCSD. Twin 1 also got into Duke ($51K) and Rice ($55-$20 merit scholarship = $35K).

They are leaning towards UPenn (we live in Philadelphia suburbs), but my concern is my ex-husband changed the job in 2023 and his salary went up. The aid they gave us is much higher than I expected from NPC, but itā€™s not very reliable for divorced parents. For Duke and Rice the cost was closer to what NPC estimated.

What do you think is the best option for electrical engineering for each of them?

2

Did your twins go to high school in Pennsylvania? Did they ever live in California?

3

No, we are in NJ. They qualified for in-state CA tuition through Condit bill (confirmed with UC legal department)

4

I believe Condit Bill only gives them one year of in-state tuition. Is that correct?

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5

Let me ask you this - if your ex husbandā€™s salary goes up and aid goes down, is he willing to utilize that differential for Penn?

Otherwise - it is a risk and salaries are rising and I donā€™t know what type of role, but aid could disappear.

So if heā€™s got a big bonus potential or commission potential, I wouldnā€™t think Penn is the right school.

Can they go to separate schools? You canā€™t beat full ride and UMD is fantabulous for engineering. So are the UCs.

If #1 wants to be in Silicon Valley and itā€™s affordable, UCB would be tough to pass up.

#2 Penn and Rice both have the same issue so Iā€™d choose between UCLA, UCSB and UCSDā€¦ Ga Tech fine too but sounds like itā€™s over the budget.

Iā€™m making these statements on avoiding financial disaster vs. if Penn is truly right for them.

So you have to figure out when you say exā€™s salary going up - are you talking $10K or significantly, etc. -because it will smack you if it happens.

But if heā€™s got you covered, and you trust him, then you are ok at Penn.

Oh - I see what @lkg4answers wrote. If true - then UMD for #1 which is too good anyway and #2 becomes difficult.

But the UCs on OOS tuition are brutal.

In the end, youā€™re a budget driven family it seems so you have to work with those parameters - and frankly, having a full ride at UMD is amazing!!! Really itā€™s amazing at any school but UMD is strong to boot.

Youā€™ve got smart kids!!

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6

That is a good point. This is what I am reading on the exemptions page under ā€œCondit Billā€. I am not sure how these students could fulfill residency requirements for the additional years as stated here, but maybe the OP has more information:

A student who is a dependent child of a California resident parent (if the parent has been a resident for more than one year immediately before the residence determination date) may be entitled to a one year conditional resident classification. During this one year conditional resident classification, the student must fulfill the residency requirements by the relevant deadlines in order to qualify for a continued resident classification for subsequent terms.

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7

IMO, EECS is one of two programs at Cal that is worth the OOS fees, and if you can get instate rates for 4 years, itā€™s fantastic.

That said, Iā€™d recommend Penn, unless a child is considering a tech start-up or one of FAANG. Closer to home & private school.

(yes, FAANG can be easily had from Penn, but thereā€™s a big advantage in starring at the MotherShip than a regional satellite in Philly or NYC.)

8

Yes, there is a path to satisfy CA requirements on their own after one year on Condit. They have to ā€˜cut tiesā€™ with their previous state, such as apply for a CA driver license by the certain deadline, register to vote etc., they canā€™t leave CA for more than 6 weeks during this first year. I had an extensive email exchange with UCā€™s legal department. I donā€™t think they try to trick you.

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9

Are the UCs affordable even at the in-state COA?

It looks like Penn would be significantly less expensive, although I understand about the uncertainty of financial aid going forward.

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10

@tsbna44, thank you very much, they are very smart, but more importantly extremely driven and hardworking. In their group of friends from NJ Governorā€™s school (prestigious summer program in NJ) everybody got into one or more Ivy. I personally donā€™t care about any Ivies especially with what is going on on campuses now, but the financial aid offer somehow came much higher than I expected, I donā€™t know why. One of my kids talked to FA person at UPenn to make sure they accounted for my ex-husband income and they said they did account for it. I asked my ex-husband to call them and discuss his situation. My income didnā€™t change much compared to 2022 (maybe like $5K more). My other twin was a finalist for Ohio State Stamps scholarship, but wasnā€™t chosen. If they both got a full ride, I can see how I can insist on taking it, but itā€™s not our situation. UPennā€™s FA person also said that if only one decides to go to UPenn, when cost will be higher next year but she didnā€™t say by how much. Apparently there is an additional discount for two kids at UPenn

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11

Academic year 24-25 financial aid is based off of 2022 income. What happens when you (or your ex) run the NPC with 2023 income? Or is that what you asked Penn financial aid about?

12

This would be my concern.

OP had another thread where they said, ā€œtheir father is refusing to contribute to their educationā€ @Anna75 is their father still refusing to contribute?

13

@bluebayou, thank you very much for your response. He visited Berkeley and was a little bit overwhelmed by number of students and 3 anti-Israel protests going at the same time. It appears that we would pay in-state tuition.

14

Yes, he said he will contribute (his situation has improved)

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15

NPC results donā€™t seem to be accurate for our situation. He will be calling FA office to discuss using his 2023 tax return.

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16

fwiw: engineering is in Cory Hall, on the north east side of campus. Most of the protesters hang near Sather Gate and Sproul Hall (central-south), so students can easily learn how to move around and thru campus to avoid any commotion.

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17

Yes, UCā€™s are more than $30K definitely. But I believe UCs will give credit for more APs and you can potentially graduate earlier. Both boys have probably at least a year worth of AP credits with all As. Also, tuition is more predictable.

18

UCLA has the same number of students. Both UCLA and Berkeley have around 33K undergrads with approximately 4K in engineering.

If they want a smaller school, I would take the UCs off of your list.

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19

Tuition is very predictable.

However, AP credit varies between the UC campuses. UCLA, for example, does not allow AP credit to be used for General Ed requirements. https://admission.ucla.edu/admitted-students/ap-credit-engineering

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I donā€™t think they prefer a smaller school. I guess itā€™s because UCs only have one admitted students day, seeing so many people was kind of shocking. We visited OSU and UMD and didnā€™t feel it was extremely crowded, but I think they have several admitted students days