We are dealing with this but from a slightly different angle. D24 got into PSU Up for psychology, no money (which i knew wpuld happen, and GMU honors psychology with $20,000 offered for 4 years each. Both are out of state for D24. PSU is suppossed be a great school for psych but GMU, lower ranked but moving up, has great DC connections so working as a lobbiest for mental health would be within reach. Its also the youngest R1 university. She got into a ton of other great schools. These decisions are hard, but that means we picked the right schools for her to apply to.
Are both within budget (ie., no parental loans) and is there a difference in net cost (ie., tuition fees room& board minus scholarship/grants)?
Which does she prefer?
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We still have to do the Penn State visit late March. Also, I updated my info regarding GMU because I was sloppy. Without any money, they run around the same costs for OOS on campus. Roughly ~53,000 tuition, room, board. She was offered honors at GMU (did not have the time to write 8 essays for Schryers Honors at PSU UP) and $20,000k a year in merit. So that brought all that down making it ~33,000 for GMU and still ~53,000 for PSU. Here are some other kickers: I heard Penn States tuition goes up for Juniors and Seniors (apparently this is a thing now with some state schools) and GMU charges extra per credit over 15 credits (though not enough to make up the $20,000 a year gap). It is a really affordable option.
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Shoot, thank you so much for pointing that out, as I hadn’t realized, and that might be a deal killer for us…
Penn State Tuition Rates Fall (psu.edu)
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You can compare both majors (requirements, flexibility/elective choices, opportunities)
GMU honors offers solid perks: priority registration (=no class with a known bad professor, classes at the time you perform best), Honors dorm with guaranteed housing, a more compact set of gen ed that leaves more space for a minor or double major, resezrxh opportunities, etc.
Based on cost and offerings, I’d go with GMU.
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She has few other options as well she is comsodering, but i definitely agree that GMU seems to be a better option. Especially of she plans to get a masters and phd somewhere. That gets expensive.
If she wants/needs to get a professional Master it’ll be costly.
However an “academic” Master en route to a PHD should be funded (no tuition, sometimes a stipend in exchange for grading tests or being a TA).
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Tell me more. I have my masters and now I feel silly having paid for one.
If you didn’t want a PHD then you had no choice🥺. Same thing for professional Masters – for teaching, working as a clinical psychologist, OT, PA etc.
But if your daughter wants to have a PHD, being funded is considered necessary and the Masters degree has to be awarded “en route”, before the PHD. When admitted to the program the student has funding for 5 years, typically full tuition (+hopefully a small stipend to live on in exchange for grading or being a TA, and/or a research fellowship depending on research experience. )
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So am I understanding that she would get funding like a TA job and be on a track to get her masters and phd at the same school. 5 year program. But, that means she wouldn’t be able to work as a professor or clinical psychologiest? Her plan is ultimatly research on mood disorders and educating people on that (and perhaps effecting law), but she had assumed to pay for her phd she would have to work as a clinical psychologist and then after that as a prof. She does want the ability to prescribe. Man, so much more to learn about here.
The Master for Clinical Psych is costly (and very selective) - basically, Masters that lead to improved position&salary cost money, sort of as an investment.
I believe that with a PHD one can also prescribe but you’d need to check.
Typically the Master&PHD are done at the same school, NOT the same university as for undergrad for cross pollination purpose (ie., meet new professors, discover different research projects, study with different approaches…)
A PHD that is not funded is not “serious” - if they see professional promise they’ll fund you. A PHD is full time work - very long hours. There’s no time to work on the side.
To work as a professor you need a PHD (though with a Master you may give 1 class at a CC as a professional -but that would be a VERY poorly compensated side-gig).
^ totally!
Forgot the original topic… 
GMU may be better than PSU for the undergraduate study of psychology.
No worries. The original topic was hijacked, but all good now that this is in its own thread.
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Phd psychologists cannot prescribe medication in most states. I believe there are 7 states where they can.
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So basically in most states only MD or DO (DOs I suppose) can prescribe?
I guess college is enough time to figure out which way to go: therapy/policy/advocacy/research, or med school (DO/MD/MDPHD).
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Nurse practitioners and physician assistants can also, I believe, write Rxs.
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For this student who wants to research mood disorders and work in health education/advocacy, I’m not sure NP or PA would be feasible because the pre-reqs might not match with what a student needs to do for a Master in clinical psych or a PHD. So this student would have to decide, after sophomore year, whether they’re going the “want to prescribe” or “want to counsel” route?
@MotherMother1
Based on what you’ve shared, I’d think Honors at GMU would set her up better for her goals, with more opportunities for research and smaller classes meaning more contact with professors for letters of rec.
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There is a psychiatric NP but it doesn’t seem that this student wants to go that route.
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I think the “wants to prescribe” is something that can be ignored for now.
First of all- none of us know what the scope of practice will be in 8, 9, 10 years once the D is actually working in a health care setting. Their are older docs who are surprised how quickly some of the licensing regulations (in some states) have changed- and there is no sign that the changes are “done and done”.
Second- this is not a good way to pick a career in mental health or related. Many therapists work in a setting where they are part of a large team… so the MD (psychiatrist) might see the patient 4 times a year for a meds management check in… but that MD is reviewing the notes and diagnosis of the therapists on the team who may be seeing the patient once or twice a week. So technically the “signature” on the prescription is that of the MD… but the actual heavy lifting on diagnosis, identifying which meds have or have not worked in the past, working through the goals in sessions, recommending appropriate settings (group therapy, an in-patient unit, etc) is all being done by the professionals who “don’t prescribe”. Some psychiatrists are essentially “meds management” tools for insurance companies… but not a lot of long term and holistic support, treatment and healing.
Third-the journey of both a PhD in clinical pysch and an MD is long… and really is not something that a HS kid is prepared to understand. It’s great that the D has direction right now. The focus should be (IMHO) on finding an affordable route to a Bachelor’s degree in a place that has enough academic rigor to support many different paths afterwards- doctorate, master’s in one of the counseling fields, research oriented degree in public health, MBA focused on hospital management, etc.
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