Help: how to verify the correctness of the official transcript sent to colleges from HS

Parents Forum
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<p>Today, we just found out that my son’s transcript could be wrong and sent to colleges he applied.</p>

<p>In his HS, the valedictorian is typically voted by the graduating seniors. The school takes the top 30 students based on weighted GPAs and send to senior class to vote. My son is currently (as of end of the first semester) ranked 2nd. We would expect him to be on that list. However he was not on the list. What worried us now is that his official transcript could be wrong both in classes or grades, which in turn calculate wrong weighted GPA and ranking.</p>

<p>He applied four public schools outside commonapps. these schools did not require official transcript and rely on applicants to enter the correct info on classes taken and grades. If admitted, an official transcript needs to be sent to the college once he or she decides to attend. He got accepted to all these schools (UCB, UCLA, Illinois and Washington). All in computer science or electrical engineering majors. Since he is seriously considering UCB, we need to make sure the transcript is correct. We have sent an email to the school and will find out.</p>

<p>My question would be there is no way to verify if the school sent the incorrect transcript to the Commonapps and then feed into all other schools he applied. Since he did not have really good successful rate of admission, I am starting to think this might be the case.</p>

<p>He applied Harvard, Princeton, Columbia, Stanford, Caltech, Upenn, Dartmouth, NWU, Brown, Cornell, Rice, USC, Michigan, Georgia Tech and Case Western.</p>

<p>He got rejected by all Ivies, Stanford, Caltech, NWU. Waitlisted by Rice, Michigan and Case Western. Accepted by USC and Georgia Tech.</p>

<p>His stats:
SAT1: CR 680, M 800, W 710, 2190 one sitting
ACT: C 34 ( E 35, M 35, R 32, S 35) one sitting
SAT2: M2 800, Chem 800, Bio/m 800
GPA: UW 4.0, W 4.35
APs: Phy B (5), Chem (5), Bio (5), Calc BC (5), Calc AB (5), Eng Lang (4), Computer Sci (5), USH (5), Stats (4)
Senior year courses: AP Physics C, AP Micro/macro, AP Eng + Lit, AP World History, AP Environ Sci, AP US Govern, Spanish IV.</p>

<p>ECs: Competitive swimming (5 years), timing near the bottom of the division I school programs, Varsity swimming (4 years). Last year, team captain. winning State team title two years ago, third place last year. Individually, he place in the top 8 for a couple of events.</p>

<p>Three years in the Academic Decathlon competition. Although he is strong in math and science, he is really interested
in literature, music, language, social science, economics, interviews, speeches, essays. In these three years, he spent lots of time in preparation for competitions, in addition to his time spent on swimming practices (10 to 12 hours per week). He is in the honor section of the team. he always placed in the top three in most of the individual events and overall in the top three also. He and his teammates from his school have won the State title in the last three years. He went to the nationals in all these three years, winning 8th place in sci, and 2nd place in prepared speech, and generally place in the top 30 in a few events in the field of 450 or so participants from other states and UK.</p>

<p>Through rigorous online learning and competition, he and other 80 or so participants were selected by my state to spend one week with NASA summer camp. He was chosen to be the team leader to lead the team on rocket team to work the process to get a rocket into Mars. His performance was really impressive that a Harvard professor on the program volunteered to write a recommendation letter for him for his college applications.</p>

<p>He also participated in Science Olympiad competition for two years, and some volunteer work. Since he is primarily in swimming and academic decathlon, he did not spend too many hours in community services. He is involved in NHS and its volunteer work activities.</p>

<p>Award: no major academic awards, typical AP scholars</p>

<p>His essays are considered good by the people who read them. Teacher recommendation letters should be good although he did not read them. On the parent teacher conferences, several teachers praised him a lot and even offered to write recommendation letters for him if he needed. The general comments on the progress report are always very positive like leaders in the classes.</p>

<p>We thought at least he should have some decent shot at his reach schools. It turned out none of his reach schools accepted him. We are really shocked by this outcome. There are several people at his school who got accepted to Chicago, Duke, Cornell. One of his friends whom my son did most of ECs together like Academic Decathlon got accepted to Harvard, Princeton, Stanford, Dartmouth and Williams. He is also ranked 2nd and took mostly humanity courses since he wants to become a think tank guy. Since they are comparable, it seems like he has way better luck than my son. </p>

<p>My question is that if his HS said the transcript is correct, is there anyway to find out if that is true. Can we contact the colleges he applies and ask for the transcript they received it? I am not sure if they want to share that. Is there anyone who has similar issue like this before? If indeed the wrong transcript was sent to Commonapps, is there anyway we can appeal the decisions since the decisions were made </p>

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<p>Order a transcript sent to your home address to verify that it is correct (up to the semesters completed).</p>

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<p>We did order one copy right after the end of the first semester. There were a few minor errors on the transcript such as 4 points assigned to a AP class. It should be 5. Other than that, everything looks fine. The rank was still 2nd. It just came as a surprise that he was not on that list. It made me wondering if something wrong with the transcript. It has happened twice before when the GPAs were calculated wrong after we ordered the transcript from the school last year when he applied for the state schools. It got corrected then. Then at his mid year report, we got hold of another copy. there were errors again. We asked them to correct them which they said they did.</p>

<p>We are going to go to the school tomorrow and see the transcript there. I am afraid that the school may show somehow the transcript is correct, just the ranking info is wrong. I have no way to verify independently if all colleges my S applied received the correct transcript.</p>

<p>Thanks for the reply</p>

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<p>Ask for his transcript, the college friendly one, from his high school and see what the colleges saw. But at this date, it’s not going to be the exact one sent to the colleges as the high schools print that at as needed and send it over. You can ask the colleges, but many of them discard the actual paperwork right after they input the data. It’s not like the schools have a file folder on each kid. Even before computer days, it’s more like an index card. But yes, it is possible that the mistake was made. My son went to 2 high schools and the first one, that had his freshman and sophomore grades, accidently sent a full transcript to the colleges instead of the college friendly one which has ONLY pertinent info on it. It’s not good when there is extra info, because the college can see the grade variations by quarter and the exam grades, and sometimes internal test results and comments as well as official test scores. IN my son’s case definitely NOT an advantage. I caught it, and made the counselor at that school contact the colleges and say the wrong transcript was sent and to flush it and send the college friendly one. I know of a couple of cases where the wrong person’s transcript or recs were sent. But at this late date, I don’t know if you can find out. Ask Common apps. Yes, if the wrong one was sent, you can appeal and ask for a redecision. Some school will do it. CMU, I know did this when such a mistake was discovered. Other schools might not bother. But you can ask.</p>

<p>For the very top schools, it’s not surprising that your son was denied. Without something that the schools consider truly special and useful to them, an app is just stuck in a stack with all the other such apps. As impressive as the Academic Decatholo may be, it’s not an EC high on the colleges lists, like being nationally ranked in Debate or a Sieman’s finalist . There is a list in an excellent book, “What it Really Takes to Get into the Ivys” that lists what these school consider excellent, good, average ECs. Sports don’t make the cut unless the kid’s a recruited athlete. The basic 2 part SAT and ACT are not top quality. Important because a lot of schools are ranked by the those numbers, and he just isn’t there in that department. A shame because the 5 part (full SAT plus 2 Sat2s are within the top range. But yes, the also look at that two part and the ACT. 34 ain’t gonna do it for the very top schools. I can look at our school’s Naviance and tell you that. NW, RIce, Case a bit more puzzling though I think Case does use that 2 part SAT heavily. That’s what I see right away. </p>

<p>So, grades/class rank=5, Academic Rigor=5, Test scores=3-4 depending on how the school looks at them, ECs=3, Essay=?, Recs= ?. Swing factor=0. One usually needs 28 min for the top schools, so I can see he likely did not have that. But not to make that second group, makes me concerned that perhaps he did not get “5” in the grades/ class rank area though with a 4.0 uweighted, it should have been an obvious 5. The UCs heavily count the SAT2s, so he’d be a natural in there. Michigan very heavily counts that transcript–how do they enter the test score…that SAT might not have made the cut. </p>

<p>For your son, it was an unfortunate presentation of test scores. The SAT 1 should not have been shown, just the SAT 2s if possible. When shown, they go on record for the school. But that ACT just doesn’t make the top school cuts. The two part SAT is not good enough for the next group of schools either and some don’t even look at the SAT 2s. ECs are nothing that carry over to college, and though I know they are good, it’s just not ivy caliber. If the other kid has some interesting EC on top what’s there , some heavy duty comm svc, working to make some money, that’s it. That’ s my take on it. </p>

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<p>For what it’s worth, I would have given your son a pretty heavy duty pass due to that academic rigor and grades. My opinion is that the evaluatory systems did not give that the weight that it should have gotten. But those basic test scores especially the critical 2 pt SATs really brought him down. Yes, if his grades were not accurately reported, he’d have been sunk as they are the crown jewels of his profile. I would give him absolute top rank on the transcript. Still, he is not HPYSC calibre IMO. </p>

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<p>At the time, he thought his SAT is kind of low for top schools. His ACT is decent (high 34, one more point will tip into 35). Since colleges take the better of the two, his ACT is near 75% level for most of the schools even lower Ivies. That was why he did not take another shot at SAT. Look at some of the postings for accepted students at those schools, lots of them have their SATs or ACTs lower than his. Like you said, they may have some other amazing things that impressed the admission officers. Anyway, thanks for the response.</p>

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<p>To satisfy your curiosity I would get a copy of his transcript - ask for the version that was sent to the colleges but really at this point it’s not relevant other than to satisfy your curiosity…he’s got two great choices with Georgia and USC considering the ambitious list of applications he sent. </p>

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<p>Though the school say they use only one, they do often have their eye out for the other, and if the numbers there they can’t help but know it. These schools are looking for reasons to eliminate as they have far too many apps for each seat so any flag that catches their eye, and yes, it caught my eye can suffice. It may not go in the official countdown, but due to the holistic leeway, every little thing counts. </p>

<p>My one son with very low (under 1500 3 part SAT, lower 25% for ACT ) test scores went the Fairtest route. He got into every single school , Holy Cross, Gettysburg, Fairfield, Dickenson, the best record with them with grades not quite as good as a bunch of kids. I did not submit a single test score to the schools. They have to report them for ranking purposes if they have them even if they do not use them for admissions sake, and if you don’t think that does not play a role in the decision, well, I disagree. Yes, they are supposed to not take them into consideration, but if you know, it’s in the subconsious, and yes, the CR, which is often very much scrutinized did immediately catch my eye. </p>

<p>Why did he not try to work with the swim coach? Even if he did not get a recruited athlete bye in a special pool (no pun intended), low D1 times would often get a flag from the coach which would have elevated those ECs. Without that, the adcom would just check off that he’s a high school athlete and have no idea what level he was. They don’t bother a lot of times IT’s either athletic pool, an athletic tip or nothing–just another school EC, level three on the score card, and your son got the latter. I only know because one of mine is a national swimmer and with times a tad higher than yours, and got ivy accepts with a academic stats far, far lower than your son’s. His top test score was lower than your son’s lowest, he’s not even close. He only was an official recruit with all the trimmings at a few schools, but the note to admissions at others, really pushed his app consideration to the stratosphere. Not a single coach or admissions office would say that would or did happen, by the way, but you’d be plenty ticked off if he were a teammate and at your school, as others were at his when he went through the process. Yes, kids with your son’s numbers did not make the cut whereas my son was accepted with much, much lower ones because he could make the swim team (Not official recruit) and said he’d do it. </p>

<p>But just nicely ask the Guidance office for a copy of what goes to the college for your son, and see what they see. Really, everyone should do that --that’s how I caught the mistake for my son, because, yes, they do happen, and sometimes there is room to request something to be removed or added, depending upon the high school. Or for supplements to be added by the GC. </p>

<p>Your son would not have gotten into the top schools from my son’s high school with those ACTs. I just looked. Doesn’t happen, the cluster points are pretty clear. Wouldn’t with his SATs either. Though the averages and ranges look like it can happen when looking at real data with each dot representing a real kid, the only kids who got in in the last five years at my son’s school that sends about 25%, maybe more to the schools your son applied to and more if you count the apps alone and accepts,as a kid can only go to one school, it would be very clear to me that if your kid were applying from my son’s school, wtihout a URM, Athletic flag, legacy or other special flag, he would not get accepted at those top schools. Hardly a chance. Nope. </p>

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<p>I disagree on 34 ACT being too low for elite colleges. Most of them have 34 at 75% or higher. Out of the schools OP listed, only Harvard, Princeton, Columbia and Caltech have >34 at 75%, and only Caltech has 34 at below 50%. URMs, donating legacies and recruited athletes do not add up to more than half of the student body. </p>

<p>One school’s Naviance does not determine general admissions rule on test scores. In addition to stats, each applicant is evaluated in the context of his/her high school. I do agree that 680 CR is a bit low for tip top schools, especially from unhooked applicants. With a 34 ACT, I would not have sent the SAT I scores.</p>

<p>I also echo the recommendation from other posters: request and check the transcript that was sent to colleges. </p>

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<p>OP’s son has a 32 in reading for the ACTs. It’s not just the average that is examined, but the individual scores as well. Also, I just checked the Naviance for our school.again. I know every single kid personally who got into HPYSMC in the last 5 years and some before that. 34 average doesn’t cut it for the ACT without a hook. Granted, more of them went the SAT route so the data is not as numerous. But if I stick the kid in there on the graph, he would be right outside the accept circle. Close, but not in it with those points. And I would not have sent the SAT 1 scores either. </p>

<p>But those top schools are such a crapshoot, that I wouldn’t ever try to figure it out. There are some kids with even higher scores turned down. What gets me is the next level down. UMich, CWU, NWU, maybe Rice. Not enough data for me to assess RIce, but he is securely in at those 3 schools by my cluster points. His transcript is truly stellar, one of the best I’ve ever seen. OP, your son is to be congratulated, and he wiil do well anywhere. I’d have taken him on that transcript. Rigor of courses, grades, AP and SAT2 scores, show a top notch knowledge of every bit of the most difficult courses kids can take. He has to have two 5s right there for transcript and difficulty,
but if that transcript were compromised somehow…yes, I can see it causing an issue. </p>

<p>OP, I’d ask the GC or principal to call some of the admissions officers at NW, UM, Rice, CWU to find out if there was some standing reason that led to his not getting accepted there. </p>

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<p>Even if this was an “error”, it would not have made an appreciable difference as more selective a school is the more they do not look at weighted GPA as there is already an expectation that the student is taking the most rigorous courses offered by the school and is doing well.</p>

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<p>The Ivies, Caltech and Stanford are reaches for everyone with students having perfect stats being denied admission. For most of these schools there have been between a 5 and 10% admit rate leaving 90 to 95% of the applicants out in the dust (just not enough seats to accommodate all of the wonderful students who want to attend) Since you or none of us know what the friend’s essays and recommendation letters look like, we have no idea as why the friend got the nod and your son did not (in fact having nearly identical applications may have hurt him more than it helped him leading the adcom to say that we already have one student with that profile from this school).</p>

<p>I think you need to ask yourself, what is the outcome that you are looking for. Do you feel that if there was a small error on the transcript and all other things being the same that the school should reverse their decision? Since the tribal counsel has already spoken, it is unlikely that is going to happen. Will any school be able to give out an answer that you will find acceptable? probably not. While it does sting (a lot) you must help your son move forward and get excited about the schools that he has been accepted to and look forward to his future instead of looking over his shoulder for what might have been.</p>

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<p>Honestly I would just talk to the guidance counselor and ask how the valedectorian list works and should your son be on it.</p>

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<p>I think it is much more likely that the mistake was in leaving him off the val voting list and not that incorrect transcripts were sent out. Most of the scores would have been sent directly by the testing companies anyway, so if the schools saw a big difference they would have (at least ONE would have) questioned it to the GC.</p>

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<p>I think his reading score is the reason that he was not very competitive.
The transcript does not matter much.</p>

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<p>34 is good, the M800 is good- and the CR or ACT-R don’t shred a kid’s chances when they are going for STEM and have, in this case, a 4 AP score for English and the strong S2 numbers.<br>
The picture probably falls more into how did the rest of the app come across. Aca deca is good, as is NASA. But was Sci Oly in 11-12th or dropped by then? That could generate a “Why?” reaction that swim doesn’t satisfy. Were there any engineering-relevant other activities- robotics, etc? And were there questions he had to answer re: why he wanted engineering or CS? Did he come across as competitive for that, other than stats? Also any Why Us? questions matter, as well as essays.</p>

<p>And did the friend who got in also want engineering/CS? Because the review frame is different for someone wanting that vs humanities. Plus, how competitive are your HS and your area in general? That’s both rigor and the numbers of qualified kids applying to highly competitive colleges.</p>

<p>I can see where being off the val list makes you wonder. But we all have to remember any holistic reviews look at everything and for many of the schools mentioned, competition is fierce. Best wishes. Seems you have UCB, UCLA, IL, WA, as well as USC and GT.</p>

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<p>It does happen. A friend who I’ve known since college who is now a 60+ yr old physician told me that she found out–after graduating from med school–that her HS transcript was messed up and significantly understated a number of her grades. She only saw this when she had to get a copy of it for some licensing thing. She wondered if it explained some puzzling college acceptance results. (She transferred from a less selective school.) In her case, this was apparently the result of transferring during HS.</p>

<p>Certainly some of your S’s results seem surprising. Not the Ivies, we’ve heard too much about students with superb credentials being rejected. But some of the others. On the other hand, it could be yield protection on their part.</p>

<p>Does your HS report class rank to colleges? Because if he actually is #2 and he was reported as #30+, that could indeed have made a difference to his acceptances.</p>

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<p>My guess is that GC’s recommendation letter didn’t check off the right percentile for OP’s kid. In the form, it asks if the student is top 1%, 5%, 10%…If OP’s kid was not included as one of top 30 students, then it is not likely GC checked off top 1 or 5%. For those elite schools, I think an applicant would need to be top 5%.</p>

<p>After D1’s poor result, we made sure we asked D2’s GC how she was going to check off those boxes. D2 was ranked 2nd, so they would need 200 students in her class for her to be top 1%. They had 180, so we asked if she would be 1 or 5%. I think it is worth it to find out how GC is going to rank your kid on the LOR.</p>

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<p>@rader123 I tend to think the correct transcript was sent. Why? Because he got into Georgia Tech. He had to enter the grades in the common app and then the transcript was sent right? Well if the transcript didn’t match there is no way GT would have accepted him. </p>

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<p>Oldfort, I think now the CA asks for numerical position, not percentage. Eg, “2 out of 180,” which would be fine, unless #1 is also applying and a lot stronger in hs and in the app a kid pulls together. Plus, roughly half the hs where kids apply to tippy tops don’t rank. And adcoms look at the transcript. </p>

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<p>GC’s LOR specifically ask for the percentile - Below Average, Average, Good…top 10%, top 5%, top 1%
<a href=“http://www.ugadm.northwestern.edu/documents/UG_Admissions_SecondarySchoolReport.pdf”>http://www.ugadm.northwestern.edu/documents/UG_Admissions_SecondarySchoolReport.pdf&lt;/a&gt;
Look at page 2, they want the counselor to rank a student for:</p>

<p>Academic Achievement
Extra Curriculum Achievements
Personal Qualities and Character
Overall</p>

<p>Even for schools that do not rank, counselor’s rating of a student is very telling. D2’s private counselor told us that counselor writeup of a student is not as important as this rating because this is where a student is being compared to his/her peers. </p>