Help! Rising senior considering EDing to Columbia vs. Duke [MA resident, 3.85 GPA, 1580 SAT; finance, economics, political science]

Hi! I am currently a rising senior deciding between EDing to Columbia or Duke. I attached my Chance Me to this post. For context, I am interested in majoring in finance/econ/poli sci. I think I would like to go into the finance/government field.

I would love some clarity to help decide between both schools. Which one do I have a better chance in? Which one has better career outcomes? Which one has better opportunities for startups/entrepreneurship (something I’m interested in)? Which one has a better social life? What has a better alumni network? What has better classes? Etc. Any thoughts would be helpful!

Thanks

Demographics: East asian, female, upper middle class, legacy at Rutgers, private school in Boston area

Gpa: take the most rigorous course load, uw gpa of 3.85 (which would barely place me in the top 30% of my school)

SAT: 1580

EC’s and awards (strongest part of my application)

  1. national nonprofit for climate change (biggest EC, has received lots of media attention and is a defining part of my life)
  2. literary magazine internship and publications
  3. school newspaper head editor
  4. varsity fencing captain
  5. president of robotics team
  6. internship at government agency
  7. president of school research journal
  8. member of varsity softball
  9. IYWP summer internship
  10. president of school science club

Can’t list my awards due to transparency reasons but they are all related to my nonprofit and are on the national/international level

forgot to add that I go to a competitive college prep private school

Your chance me post had stellar advice from a lot of people who’ve been on College Confidential for a while. Almost all of them made note of the presence of your school’s college counseling office and encouraged you to connect with them to get guidance from them.

The question you’re asking here would be a great one for your counselor; they will be far more equipped to help you figure out the right slate of schools to apply to, including any ED options (whether Columbia, Duke, or somewhere else, or nowhere ED), and can factor in your specific ECs more fully.

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This would really depend on what you are looking for. Do you want to have a world class city at your doorstep with restaurants, museums, entertainment, and a thousand other things or would you prefer a more traditional college campus with Greek life and a big focus on college sports(especially basketball)?

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I think the obvious question is how did you narrow it to those two schools in the first place? They are pretty different in some notable ways, and you seem to have a lot of questions about them, so how did it become a list of just those two? Understanding your answer to that question may help guide our discussion.

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Which do you prefer? Not which gives you a better chance.

You can look up career outcomes.

Of course, geographically, Columbia will have higher #s due to its location - for kids who stay in the city vs. move to Charlotte or Atlanta, they’ll make more. And pay more to live.

What happened to your interest in sociology? Nothing wrong with changing but your new interests are very different.

Good luck.

You school college counselors at a competitive private prep school really should be your first go to. They know the track record of students from your high school who have applied in the past.

Columbia and Duke are both excellent colleges. I think you need to decide which one you favor the most…and that could be your ED choice.

And I agree…look at your other chance me thread…lots of good advice there.

Are Duke and Columbia affordable for your family. Maybe I missed it…but I didn’t see a budget for your college costs.

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Agree. I don’t think the OP is improving on her prior thread here. One of the main themes of that thread was “use the considerable resources available to you.” The other was to think deeply about what you want in a school.

Can anyone make a declarative statement that Duke or Columbia has “better classes?” OP, both have top faculty, and there will be instructors at both schools that students love and those they try to avoid.

Can anyone say that the alumni network at Duke is superior to Columbia’s? No.

OP, no one can break your tie. They is no objective standard to tell you one of these highly regarded schools is better for you than the other. You need to make a personal and subjective decision about which campus environment and programs would suit you best.

How did you land on these two schools? What kind of community to you want to live and study in for four years?

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I have been in contact with my school counselor and resources from my school, and I’ve narrowed down Duke and Columbia based on extensive research, but I am just curious to hear feedback from members of this community who might have experience with these two schools, particularly for someone interested in the fields that I am. My school has been helpful with admissions advice, but hasn’t provided much insight into the experience that these colleges would offer.

I consider myself an independent/entrepreneurial person. I would like to be in a mid/large sized city. I enjoy taking on projects outside of just academics, and would like a school that supports this type of learning.

Both Duke and Columbia seem to be the two best schools in this aspect, and I’m having difficulty choosing between them. I posted this thread looking for people who might have experience with one/both of these schools and could provide extra information that might be helpful!

For all students, I strongly recommend that they visit a school’s campus while it’s in session before selecting an ED school.

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" I would like to be in a mid/large sized city. "

The immediate environment is like night and day - or like Morningside Heights (in Manhattan) vs. a few miles from Downtown small city.

Which do you want? To talk out the door and life is there.

Or to take a shuttle to your dorm/campus each day?

Depending on what you mean by “in” a city, these two colleges might be among the colleges that fit your description. But there are no obvious ways (to me at least) in which they are clearly “the best” colleges given your description.

And I am sure it feels like we are being stubborn, but it is really hard to give you meaningful insight into which would be a better ED choice for you without a more meaningful sense of what you are truly looking for in a college, such that your list came down to these two in particular.

Edit: Just to give you an idea why this is not at all an obvious list, here is Entrepreneur magazine’s list of the top 50 undergrad programs for aspiring entrepreneurs:

Not only are Columbia and Duke not at the top of their list, they are not on it at all.

Now obviously you do not have to take this one ranking as unquestionable, but I think they raise some interesting points in their introduction. As they point out, many have suggested it is not at all clear being a successful entrepreneur actually has much to do with school at all. And to the extent that, say, a college is really good at preparing students for academic careers, salaried professional careers, government careers, or so on, that doesn’t mean it is necessarily really good at doing whatever a college can do for an entrepreneur.

Which doesn’t mean no one ever goes to Columbia or Duke and ends up a successful entrepreneur. It is more just that they don’t necessarily stand out as being “the best” colleges for such ambitions.

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this is really helpful- thank you!

I appreciate that, but the questions you are asking are unlikely to solicit any real insights. Which of these schools have “better” classes or alumni networks? Questions like that are preliminary, overbroad, and unlikely to break a tie. Both Duke and Columbia have top faculty and well-placed graduates. If marginal differences could be identified through questions like that, they could hardly be dispositive.

So, the advice here is really to show your pre-work leading up to this ED choice by asking some informed and incisive questions. If you are at this point, you know some key differences. Probe them.

You know, for example, that these campuses are have very different settings and layouts. Duke is a sprawling campus of more than 8,000 acres with areas that are literally nature preserves. Columbia covers 36 acres in the middle of Morningside Heights, on the far reaches of the Upper West Side bordering Harlem. It’s compact.

Have you visited either place?

Regarding Columbia, you might also know that its signature academic feature is its extensive core curriculum. It’s a big deal and it takes up a lot of credit hours. It doesn’t teach you what to think, but it is Columbia’s approach to teaching students how to inquire and develop a worldview.

Duke, on the other hand, has some distribution requirements, which no one would confuse with Columbia’s pedagogical imprint.

So, as a self-described “independent” person with multiple areas of potential interest, what questions does this raise for you? Would you want your college putting such a strong stamp on your program of study? Might you be concerned that all those credit hours dedicated to “the Core” might limit your ability to develop a double major or a minor or two at Columbia? Maybe ask Columbia folks if this could be a challenge?

Socially, a lot of social life at Columbia will involve nights out in the city. That can get expensive. Duke, being much more contained and isolated within its metro area, tends to have a much more active on-campus social scene with a strong emphasis on Greek life and athletics. Columbia can’t get students to attend their games, Duke students have to participate in a lottery to get basketball tickets, and they get points in that system by attending other athletic events. Camping out overnight in tents in order to get a good seat at a big game is a Duke tradition.

But you are on the cusp of making an ED choice and you’ve done your research, right? Which place sounds more like you?

Are you paying attention to the news? If so, you know Columbia has seen a lot of unrest this year. Are you attracted to all the tumult and activism, or are you concerned about the trouble the campus has had in maintaining stability in its operations and administrative leadership? What questions does this provoke for you about Columbia? What might you want to know from people who have experienced this year at Columbia?

Is Duke as politically agitated? By all appearances, no. If you are a committed activist, is this where you would prefer to be? How about if you aren’t? Who and where are your people at Duke?

All colleges have opportunities to take on projects “outside of just academics,” so this doesn’t provide any real differentiation. Entrepreneurial? Just looking at Ivies, I might suggest Penn or Cornell before Columbia, but Columbia is in NYC, so I guess there is opportunity in the location.

Look, you do you. You have nothing to prove to us. But you might want to sharpen your focus to get at what the real differences are between these places. Good luck!

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I’m scratching my head here. Am I the only one willing to address the elephant in the room: the fact that Columbia just completed its worst year in over a half-century? Its gates were closed to the general public for most of the spring semester due to student protests; dozens of students were arrested for occupying a building; Commencement was canceled; its president of little more than a year has just resigned. Any questions?

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