High school musicals

Parent Cafe
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<p>No, not a thread about the Disney movies. </p>

<p>Our drama club stages a musical every spring. In the past, the pit band has consisted primarily of students, supplemented by paid professionals as needed. Last year, the band had a new director, and it seemed like there were fewer students in the pit band. This year, there are less than a handful; the majority of the pit band will be paid professionals. He claims that the role of the pit band is to support the drama club and as such should not be viewed as an musical/educational opportunity for the band students. The drama club supplies the funds to pay the professionals, but plays no role in selecting the musicians.</p>

<p>If your child’s school stages a musical, do they recruit students for the pit, or do they rely mostly on professionals?</p>

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<p>our school has only used students… never professionals.</p>

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<p>Our school uses only top student musicians from our high school (and they are asked to play…it’s not something any student can ask to do) and supplements them with paid other musicians. It’s hard work and very time consuming working on a musical score.</p>

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<p>When I was in HS, our pit band was only our school’s students. I played in it for 3 musicals and it was such a great experience. Played a lot of good music and saw 3 great shows.</p>

<p>In my kids’ HS, they only use professional musicians and I think that is a real shame. The HS kids should have that chance. There is plenty of talent among the band members, so I really don’t understand it.</p>

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<p>I was very happy for our kids when they did Chicago, and they had the pit actually up on stage on a tiered platform, the whole time. It gave them much more recognition.</p>

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<p>At my daughter’s school, it varies. It depends on the musical. She was lucky to be in four of these in quick succession, then they dried up. Some of the schools in our area hire professionals, some recruit students. I think that if there is enough interest at the school, and if the students can keep up and do a good job, it should be offered to them. It’s a great development opportunity. It is probably also a lot of work for the band director.</p>

<p>My daughter was so disappointed this past season when a professional pit was hired, and the only student in it was a percussionist. The musical had an unusual score, and it was justified.</p>

<p>My daughter’s school also uses something called “orch extra” on occasion. It fills in missing instruments in the band, and makes it sound more professional.</p>

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<p>Our school sounds more like thumper’s. We have an excellent music program, by the way. The school musical uses student musicians in the pit mostly but it is supplemented by professionals but not in lieu of using students. I believe the professionals in the community are filling in spots that are needed (not every musician in the school is involved in the school musical so I can see if certain needs are not filled in the pit orchestra). But those adults do not participate in LIEU of using students. Students definitely participate and it is a big commitment on top of the other music committments they have at school.</p>

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<p>Our band director, as well as one of the choir teachers, are paid a stipend for doing the musical. But the bulk of the show falls on the school’s theater director.</p>

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<p>By the way, the “playbill” always has a bio in it for any graduating seniors in the musical and this includes any in the cast, the pit orchtestra, or the crew.</p>

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<p>Our hs is really, really competitve in this - but nearly all the musicians are students. There may be a pianist who is an adult, but the school musical is a school production… It’s a great way for kids to be involved . OTOH, students have had to put up with band directors who were young guys staging what may have been the best program of their young career and a base that they would be judged against… Can you spell things that aren’t in the student’s best interest?</p>

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<p>My son’s school just put on My Fair Lady a few weeks ago. The musicians were from the school orchestra and did a great job. The only paid person was the pianist. The theater, choir and orchestra booster clubs pay for expenses then split any profits from ticket sales. I’m in the choir booster club and I would be upset if all the money were spent on professional musicians. Plus people come to see their kids, grandkids and friends perform.</p>

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<p>I think a lot will depend on the quality of both the musical/stage performers, and the orchestra.</p>

<p>Son’s public hs had a long tradition of high quality hs musicals, and over the years have sent a few musical theater kids to conservatory programs. A few have gone on to pro careers in stock, movies and on/off Broadway. Fortunately, the music program was also highly supported, and had a good to excellent crop of kids, many also on a high level extra curricular path of precollege conservatory, summer immersion programs, local and regional competitions and an outstanding youth symphony.</p>

<p>They rarely hired ringers. A quality piano accompanist if a student wasn’t quite “there”, an occasional oboe or bassoon. Most instruments were fairly well played and an average of 3 a year ended up in conservatory level programs, another 3-4 followed music ed paths as undergrads.</p>

<p>Our geographic area was fairly similar for neighboring towns, in that the music departments were normally well funded, well populated with talent. Some of the other locals with smaller student bodies would flesh out their needs with talent from other high schools or local pros for the pit.</p>

<p>As a conservatory student, son had a number of gigs where he did pit work for high schools in the vicinity of his college.</p>

<p>As a graduate (and a paid professional performer with a tenured orchestral chair position) he still gets calls for an occasional hs pit gig.</p>

<p>Things may have changed with the new orchestra director in your situation. He may have higher standards, or be too tough a task master. It’s possible the program is not well received or well funded, or the kids aren’t “into it.” The size and quality of the the section needs for the orchestration should be met.</p>

<p>Perhaps the internal focus is the drama/mt aspect… some kids actually do orchestra and theater and the draw is to be onstage rather than in the pit. Perhaps there’s a few that run the drama club who want a “pro” quality production. There are any number of reasons to flesh out an orchestra, but the norm that I’ve seen is that in most cases the talent level of the mt and orchestras tend to be on similar levels.</p>

<p>I would want to see a high school production for the kids, utilizing outside talent only when absolutely necessary. If for some reason the orchestra is unwilling or unable to perform to the accepted community/program standard, or drags down the mt performance, the choice may be to curtail the show, or use pro musicians if funding allows. If the mt program is functioning and talented, I see no reason to cancel a show if the in house instrumental students are less than enthusiastic if the funding allows the show to go on. </p>

<p>Are the orchestra students disappointed by not participating? This is the key point.
Do they bring in ringers for stage work as well? Just curious.</p>

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<p>thump brings up another very valid point. Son’s hs pit was a very intense long
term commitment, on average 6 weeks with rehearsals 3-4 nights a week, plus at least one weekend day. Kids were all selected, or encouraged. It was not mandatory. The results were always amazing.</p>

<p>Not all are willing or able to commit to this intensity.</p>

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<p>Our high school is large, and we have a lot of particpants in the music/theater programs. That being said, I think it is also up to the theater director to consult with the band director (or whoever is going to direct the pit) when choosing the musical. A lot of the problems can be solved that way… pick musicals that are achievable and can be successful within the resources of a student-only band. The band teacher knows what each years’ crop of of students can and can’t do, just like the theater director knows what talent he has. Our theater director (I still keep in touch with him) told me he really wanted to do Rent this year, but knew he just did not have a deep enough or the right kind of talent pool for the guys’ roles. So they’re doing Fiddler instead. </p>

<p>I think in some smaller schools, where they just don’t have the quantity of students involved in band, etc., you are forced to look outside the school walls to complete the pit. When we did Chicago, though, we had so many band kids interested in pit that they ended up double casting the band for a lot of instruments.</p>

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<p>In the past, our school has been like Thumper’s and Soozie’s: good students selected because they were willing to put in the time needed to master the score, weekly rehearsals for 6 weeks prior, with nightly, 4-hour rehearsals and a weekend day the week before the show. Last year, with the new director, no rehearsals as a group until 2 weeks before the show, the students were expected to master the music on their own.</p>

<p>The mt program is decent, not spectacular: three or four talented kids surrounded by mediocrity. Last year was the first I can remember that we had a female lead (a freshman) who could sing. Lots of very good dancers. </p>

<p>My daughter has done pit for three years and this year was told she wouldn’t be needed because they were hiring someone who could play flute, sax, and clarinet (all one book). She only plays clarinet. The best student flute player is okay but not up to playing this score (Les Mis), says the band director, and the star sax player graduated last year, with no replacement in the offing. Band director says he can’t hire someone for 2/3 of a part, so D is out of luck. Yes, she is disappointed, and I was just wondering how common this extensive use of professionals was. As it stands, the only students playing will be 2 horns and 2 percussionists, and more would certainly have been interested.</p>

<p>When shows have been difficult in the past or students haven’t been quite up to snuff on an instrument, a professional has been hired, with a student doubling the pro. Four years ago (before my D was in HS), the show director wanted to do West Side Story and the band director agreed with the stipulation that the pit would be all pro with students doubling all the instruments, given the difficulty of that score.</p>

<p>No, they don’t bring in ringers for the stage work</p>

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<p>Ours is mostly students, but some professionals.</p>

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<p>This just baffles me; I don’t ever remember seeing any paid people in the pit at our high school. It’s always been students. If the CC people I know from our high school know differently (and are reading this thread), please correct me.</p>

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<p>Well, ours is a small high school, but again, we have many excellent musicians and the music program itself is strong. Coincidentaily, this year’s musical is West Side Story (my kids are out of high school now but my younger one was in all the musicals there).</p>

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<p>At my high school the wind instruments and percussion were from the band and the strings hired from the community orchestra as we had no high school orchestra.</p>

<p>I did 2 musicals, Carousel and the Wizard of Oz. The drawback is of course, I never, ever want to hear those musicals again (overkill).</p>

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<p>The perspective reflected by the band director in the OP’s original post is not all that different from what is often seen in the professional world - pit musicians exist to support what occurs on stage as opposed on stage musicians who are the “featured attraction”. Even in the former situation, however, a music director will still none the less engage only those musicians who are capable of achieving the director’s artistic desires and the needs of the performance as determined by the music director.</p>

<p>As applied to a musical in a high school setting, this approach doesn’t adequately take into account that even in a musical, the pit musicians are a part of the “featured attraction” for your typical high school audience - parents and other community members who come to see students perform. It also fails to consider that serving as a pit musician supporting a show is as important an educational experience for a musician as playing on stage and that the focus in high school should be on the educational value of performing.</p>

<p>That being said, an orchestra that lacks proper intonation and timing can horribly undermine a musical including the performance of the actors and vocalists on stage for whom the execution of the musical score is critical to their performance. Not all high schools can fill a large pit orchestra with student musicians of the caliber needed to handle the demands of the score and of the musicality and timing required to accompany vocalists/actors. In such situations, there may be no choice but to seek outside musicians. Even then, the importance of using students to the extent possible because of the educational setting should not be treated as deminimus.</p>

<p>My daughter attended a high school of 1800 students in grades 10 - 12. She performed in “big” musicals such as West Side Story and Guys and Dolls that had large casts and required large orchestras to have the full range of instrumentation. Even in a school that size, the music director used outside musicians to supplement the student based orchestra. Just as there was only a small handful of students who could handle the principal roles, so too was there only a small handful of student musicians who could really handle the demands of the score. Even so, the cast remained a student cast and the orchestra remained basically a student orchestra with outside musicians in the minority. Everyone understood that it was a high school student production and that therefore at times there would be compromises made. The educational value of having a student based production, from cast to crew to the pit to stage management, was what it was really all about. My daughter, who is now in a conservatory type program for Musical Theater, would not have wanted it any other way; it was an experience to share with her fellow students, not outsiders.</p>