<p>They’ve only had like around a 100 year life…how did they become so prestigious, even more than all the ivies except HYP?</p>
<p>Money, money, money.</p>
<p>I don’t think Duke is on a comparable level of “prestige” as Stanford and MIT. Your statement about being more prestigious than all of the Ivy’s besides HYP is only applicable to S and M, and even then only somewhat correct.</p>
<p>Stanford because it became the Harvard of the West…Location
MIT because of it was the one of the first to be a Tech focused school…Specialization</p>
<p>Duke doesnt belong on this list</p>
<p>John, the question might be rephrased to - how did schools like Stanford and MIT get such top quality research going, at the highest levels in the world, above the caliber of what goes on at most other schools? I would add Berkeley to that list.</p>
<p>Undergraduate prestige, after all, is hard to change directly - undergrads surely heard “Harvard” and always felt a surge of respect for the longest time, far beyond what was felt for almost anywhere else. But one CAN change the appeal of a school to researchers - for instance, notice Stanford, MIT and Berkeley all happen to be the major tier 1 schools in the U.S. which also are amazing at <em>engineering</em>, and their faculty in engineering sports a totally different strength from HYP’s. </p>
<p>Following the advent of great faculty, a school does acquire a mystique, because when you hear that “crazy research” is going on at schools, there’s an attraction to it. Not everyone [most especially not many parents] distinguishes between that and “undergraduate strength” so much - just take how many foreigners view Berkeley, despite
the fact that many undergrads are subpar; it carries a godly name because of the strength of programs and the faculty are unmatched by any but the topmost tier schools.</p>
<p>My guess is Stanford and MIT might have partially drawn from this mystique to attract both grads and undergrads, and gradually increase their selectivity over time.</p>
<p>As for Duke, let’s make a note of its location - something which a lot of people would take seriously. Same with schools like Berkeley or Stanford - located in CA, much different weather. I think Duke could build a prestige quite independent of many Ivies.</p>
<p>Then take into account how immigrants view schools like Berkeley or Stanford or MIT, especially the CS and engineering-inclined…given their foreign origins.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Very concisely put, and these are important points which show up [in a jumbled way] in my post. In short, my point was you can have an entirely different set of appeals from raw undergraduate prestige drawing from years and years of “smart people” having gone to a school, swearing by its prestige and quality of education.</p>
<p>Times have changed a lot. Education is a lot more widely sought, and it’s no longer the rule that the smart kids go to so and so places. Everyone wants to get educated, and people realize there are incredibly prestigious places with different locations and different strengths now. People just seem to think more actively in this generation about the process than a lot of the older folks I know who lived in the U.S. longer ago, and had some more simplistic views like “the smart math kids go to MIT”</p>
<p>Look at John’s location, that is how Duke got on the list.</p>
<p>mathboy98, I realize you have a certain bias for your alma mater, but I wouldn’t put Duke or UCB in the same grouping in terms of prestige as MIT and Stanford.</p>
<p>Jersey, I believe you misunderstood - I don’t group UCB with those two schools for undergrad prestige.</p>
<p>I do, however, group it with them for academic prestige [faculty strength, research]. </p>
<p>One of the subtler points of my earlier post is that academic/research prestige can translate to undergrad prestige if the university can market itself sufficiently. It’s obvious that it did so for some private universities, but can’t for a public one, because the public one has obligations to the masses of its state, and is effectively obligated to accept subpar students.</p>
<p>^ My apologies, I did misunderstand.</p>
<p>And to those like catg - nobody needs to tell a CCer how HYPSM are glorified…so much that
this abbreviation is necessary to group these institutions, some of which are glaringly different, purely because they share some prestige. </p>
<p>Getting away from petty bickerings, John’s question is interesting to analyze - how these schools became so sought after, given American tradition places so much weight on the Ivy League name.</p>
<p>Stanford I think is a combination of location, money (attract and retain top researchers), and having started its life with high asperations – hiring a number of top Cornell faculty at the beginning.</p>
<p>MIT I agree is due to focus on the engineering and sciences, which became a differentiator compared to every other east coast school.</p>
<p>Duke’s ascent is related to a huge endowment from its namesake, and the use of some of these monies to, again, buy top faculty and award scholarship to top students.</p>
<p>But all that is really a verbose way of expanding on Grisam’s post: MONEY, MONEY, MONEY</p>
<p>Money = power.</p>
<p>eatalot, money = top faculty + top facilities + top students on scholarship</p>
<p>how do you change your location? sorry this is probably the wrong place to ask…</p>
<p>
It is. The correct place is the [community</a> and forum issues](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/community-forum-issues/]community”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/community-forum-issues/) subforum.</p>
<p>To answer your question:</p>
<ol>
<li>Click “quick links” in the main toolbar (next to log out).</li>
<li>Click “edit your details” under “user control panel.”</li>
<li>Scroll down to “additional information” and enter your location.</li>
<li>Click “save changes.”</li>
</ol>
<p>ok thank you!</p>
<p>Duke and MIT were founded in the mid 19th century…at the same time as Cal, Cornell and Johns Hopkins and before the University of Chicago. Those four universities also rose very quickly to prominence.</p>
<p>While Duke is a good school, it is not more prestigious than Columbia, Dartmouth or maybe Penn. Duke is certainly no S or Mit.</p>
<p>Yes, Stanford and MIT (and U of Chicago) are more in line with Ivy quality–not so much Duke, though it’s a solid school.</p>