<p>Since OOS students have such a hard time getting into UNC, their stats have to be top notch (4.0+; 2250+ SAT; top 3%; tons of extras, etc etc). But the mid 50% of instaters are 1210-1400 SATs (UNC figures). That means ~25% are BELOW 1210 SATs!
So I’ve got to ask, how do some of those in the bottom quartile even graduate? And what’s the academic disparity between OOS and a good portion of instaters during class? Not to say a good portion of instaters aren’t solid students, but there are indeed quite a few who certainly are not (or at least are far below the typical OOS). So, you might have a class with some pretty lame 1050 SAT’ers right next to OOS 1500 SAT’ers. Quite a discrepancy!</p>
<p>How does that shake out in classes? If you were at an IVY for example, there would be no more than 3% who are below a 1350 SAT, I’m guessing</p>
<p>so…you just said people with SAT scores before 1210 can’t graduate? that SAT score definitely does not make you stupid.
that’s an awesome assumption. i, however, am going to assume you’re out-of-state and recommend that you stay there. attitudes and assumptions like that will not fit in at carolina. by the way - in-state students still have to be awesome to get in.</p>
<p>I’m an out of state transfer student and my SAT is what led me from not applying as a freshmen. However, I can tell you that I keep up fine with students who got much higher SATs than me and the same could be said for my old school, UMiami. The average SAT fell in between a 1300-1400 and I was below that and got higher grades than most of the kids so your logics do not make sense. </p>
<p>SATs are not precise indicators of someone’s performance. I know people who got 1100 and had a 5.0 HPAs.</p>
<p>Yikes; sorry didn’t mean to bend any noses out of joint. Let me soften it some and I agree that SATs aren’t the only predictor of college success. However, anyone would have to agree that it’s much easier to get into UNC instate rather than OOS. Given that, the lower quartile of those instate would probably not have been accepted had they not been in state. And given that, do they tend to struggle, since their academic performance has not been as high as most other accepted freshman? </p>
<p>My point is that there must be a discrepancy between those of the bottom quartile IS, and those from OOS clawing to get in (taking into acct GPA, SAT, rankings, extra-curriculars, etc, etc)</p>
<p>It’s true not everyone at Carolina is a genius, (I’ve had classes with some real boneheads) but the smartest and most successful people I know here are in-state kids. Many in-staters crack down on the books once they get here and perform at a very high level.</p>
<p>I think that most of the, we’ll call them, boneheads graduate because it’s very easy to make a C here. If you spend any time at all studying or do the work you can make a C, but it’s very difficult to make As. I have a history class where the lowest grade in a class of 120 kids was a C- but there were only a hand-full of As.</p>
<p>Wow I’m extremely offended. So people with a SAT score below a 1200 are stupid huh? And you think it’s lame to get a 1050? I sure hope you don’t go to college.</p>
<p>Just because it’s easier for us to get in doesn’t automatically make us stupider or less capable of performing at the college level.
And as far as your question goes, I honestly have no idea who’s in-state and who’s OOS in my classes, unless we’ve actually talked about it. So no, the lower scoring in-state kids aren’t drooling idiots and the OOS overachievers aren’t teaching the classes.</p>
<p>mikey- thanks for your reply and for understanding where I’m coming from; not everyone gets the gist of my question.</p>
<p>LolyGAGHa and wjhsxc: You seem quite defensive. If you slow down and re-read it, my second/modified question doesn’t at all insinuate that those below 1200 SAT are ‘stupid’, or won’t graduate. The entire premise of my question is around RELATIVE to the top students, be they in or out of state, how do others fare.</p>
<p>mikey’s answer was quite insightful; thanks!</p>
<p>jomass I have also wondered the same thing. I don’t think your question was out of line at all. wjhsxc I am sorry that me and Im assuming jomass are still in high school and do not understand what the college experience of a blending of a wide variety of people from all over the country is like. But, seriously don’t be rude.</p>
<p>look, i wasn’t trying to be rude, but yes i was defensive because i found the phrasing and attitude behind the questions offensive. but the answer’s still the same-there’s no difference in performance between the OOS and the instaters.</p>
<p>Yeah, its pretty wild here if you didn’t get above a 1400 on your SAT. They have special “not smart enough” dorms for those people, and make them wear jackets with their SAT scores displayed prominently on the back for all to scorn. No “dummeos” ever raise their hands in class, because they know that they wouldn’t be called on anyways. There’s also a special database that automatically lowers all of your grades by at least 10 points if you fall into the sub-1400 category. </p>
<p>Seriously though, there’s no difference. I’ve seen smart OOSers do horribly in classes because they go out every night and I’ve seen in-state kids who I thought were borderline ■■■■■■■■ pull As in classes that I struggled in.</p>
<p>You guys all make good points(SAT really doesn’t matter much…), but I’m gonna answer the original question as JoMass meant to put it.</p>
<p>The out-of-state students are, on average, smarter than the in-state students at UNC. Sorry if it offends anyone, but there is little question in my mind that it is true. </p>
<p>If you’re looking for a definitive GPA measure, however, you will be disappointed, as no such measure exists. I think the average in-state GPA would be around a 3.0 and the average out-of-state GPA would be a 3.5, but that’s pure speculation on my part.(The average GPA at UNC is around a 3.15)</p>
<p>As a student, I have noticed that there is a huge difference in student quality in most classes. There are brilliant people in every class, and more than a few boneheads. However, seeing as I have not attended another university, I don’t know if this is true only of UNC.</p>
<p>No matter how boneheaded, though, almost everyone can graduate. A 2.0 is not very difficult to attain, even if you miss most of class. That being said, a degree with a 2.0 GPA is almost worthless, as employers will almost certainly be scared off.</p>
<p>I hope I answered your question satisfactorily; otherwise, feel free to ask again.</p>
<p>I am going to amend your statement to read: The “average” OOS student is “statistically” smarter than the “average” in state student which I think is more accurate. As the parent of an OOS grad of UNC I know he would argue that the top instate kids were academically on par with his his OOS friends. It’s also important to remember that that things like SATs are not always good predictors of future success and are heavily influenced by environment, sex and race.</p>
<p>To the OP</p>
<p>Don’t forget that the bottom 25% at ANY school includes for the most part recruited athletes as well as URMs. The bottom 25% numbers should be thrown out of any consideration for admissions by an “average” student unless they have one of those “hooks.”</p>
<p>One thing you must remember when making any statistical analysis is the size of the sample group. UNC’s first year class is 3 to 4 times the size of some Ivies and other “peer” private schools. The top 25-30% of UNC’s annual first year classes can and does compete favorably from an SAT/GPA viewpoint with most Ivies, Duke, etc. What this means is that there are just as many really smart kids walking around campus as at the other places but not all first year students are at that level. It is also important to remember that there are many kids at UNC who have turned down Ivies and other “more elite” schools to accept merit awards at UNC not to mention the Morehead or Robertson scholarships which annually combine to add close to 100 top students to the incoming classes.</p>
<p>In the past we’ve seen people try to downplay the academic credentials and or rigor of UNC by using the overall stats of the freshman class when that is not a fair comparison. If you compare similar sample size groups you’ll be surprised at how close they really are.</p>
<p>I will agree that once on campus no one cares where you are from nor are you judged accordingly. Too much has been made of the instate/OOS issue when there really isn’t one except for during the admissions process.</p>
<p>Appreciate your comments back and that you took the time to understand the basis of my question, as opposed to others who got so defensive and emotional. Your feedback validated my presumption.</p>