Hello everyone!
This may seem like a silly question, but I was admitted SCEA to Yale and am looking at courses I would have to take in order to complete a major in molecular biology. One of them is calculus II – a class that I have been dreading for years. Can someone speak to how difficult calc 2 is at a school at yale? For context I took Calc AB my junior year and got a 4 on the AP.
Thanks!
There are a few tracks you can take to complete calc at Yale. I also took calc AB like you can got a 4, and did bad on the placement test so I’m in math 110/111 which is calc AB spread out over two semesters so it’s more in depth but also a slower pace. 110/111 is easy and well taught- I would recommend it. Math 112 is calc over one semester (less in depth but faster pace) and it’s harder but manageable. Math 115 is calc BC and I’ve heard varying reviews but it generally seems difficult, and it depends on what teacher you get.
Yes, calc at Yale is more difficult than calc at other schools (my calc prof told me), but if you work through the material enough and thoroughly understand it then you’ll be fine.
@salt123 - your response is what makes CC so great. You gave the OP real time information that will help him/her make an informed choice. Thank you.
@PSLifestyle , additionally, you should know two things:
There is a math lounge where tea & cookies are available at 4pm daily…but maybe that is supposed to be a secret! Math undergrads, grad students and profs hang out there and I am guessing any would be more than happy to help you with math.
@PSLifestyle - I’m not an exceptionally good math student, but placed into Calc II my first semester (fall 2017). My guess is that students who are very strong in math take the class, and that compared to them I was merely average. That’s tough for someone who always got As in high school to admit. Part of the problem is that there was a curve used to grade the 2 midterms, which led me to believe I was doing fine. But the final exam and final grade wasn’t curved… oh well. I think on the college level, math teachers aren’t very helpful except to students who are really advanced or gifted in the subject. What this means, I think, is that those of us who were at the top of all of our classes in high school have to deal with the fact that at schools like Yale, we are in classes with students who are truly gifted in their subject areas and that we have to be prepared to get lower grades than we are used to getting. It is humbling, but that shouldn’t stop you from taking courses that you want to take at Yale. Best of luck to you!
Ugh, there’s placement exams for Calc? What other subjects are their placement exams in?
I took Calc BC in 10th grade and got a 4, which is ok, but I completely forgot all the material I learned. Should I review Calc over the summer or something? I’m hoping to get Calc 115 done and over with freshman year (i hate calc >.<)
@amonaroll - At some point during the summer, all incoming first years are asked to complete the online “High School Math and Science Survey.” But, If you don’t want to take Calc at Yale, then you won’t have to take a placement exam for Calc. However, if you do want to place out of any intro level courses - including math, science, econ, language, music theory - then placement test results, (sometimes in combination with AP scores of 5) may allow you to enroll in more advanced courses beginning your first semester. As I wrote above, coming out of high school I was not an advanced math student, and placed into Math 115, essentially BC Calc, or “Calc II” - a class you completed in 10th grade (!). I think that with time to review over the summer you could place out of Math 112 and 115 and place into Math 118. But if you “hate Calc,” you will be able to fulfill your distributional skills requirement in quantitative reasoning in lots of other ways.
As well as office hours, Yale offers extensive 1-on-1 tutoring for math and science classes. Don’t be scared off by the form saying that you need to be getting a B- or so - this is untrue in practice. I was a tutor for this program for three years, and while I did have some struggling students, I also taught students who topped (literally came first in) the subject.
You will have to work hard at calculus if math isn’t your thing, because there are students who take 115 who should be in 120. However, there is absolutely no reason why you should get below a B+ if you make it a priority and use all the resources available. You may find you even do much better.
@exyalie15 - The OP asked “How hard is Calculus at Yale.” The honest answer is that it is very hard. I went to an extremely rigorous and competitive high school and never received a grade below A in any math course. I received scores of 800 on the math section of the old SAT and a 780 on the Math II Subject test. I placed into Intermediate Micro my first semester, (which was also extremely difficult). It made no sense to me that two midterms were curved but not the final exam, nor the final, grade. I thought I was doing well in the course based on those two midterm grades as well as my excellent problem set scores. But as I said above, there were many students in that class who (unlike me) were repeating BC Calc and who also, like you, were simply better math students than me. Unlike @amonaroll, I love Calculus and worked incredibly hard in Math 115.
@zoebrittany thank you for the response, I guess I’ll review calc over the summer just to refresh my memory (I haven’t even taken math in 2 years…I’m actually really terrified of doing calc at Yale now…especially because I wasn’t even a bright math student to begin with >.<). I’d rather not do 118 and instead just stick with the easiest Calc course (I guess that’s essentially a year of Calc BC again?)
The only reason I want to take calc is because I’m doing premed, and although it’s not a premed requirement at Yale, I know that some med schools require students to have taken Calculus, and I’d rather not limit myself to certain schools just because I’m lazy and didn’t take 1 class
@amonaroll - I apologize to you and others who, after reading my posts above, are now are “terrified” of taking Calc at Yale. Math 112 and 115 - essentially Calc AB and BC, respectively - are one semester - not year long - courses. If you really hate Calc then you might want to take Math 110/111, as @salt123 helpfully suggested above. But you are probably underestimating your math abilities if you were able to complete Calc BC in 10th grade with an AP score of 4. And you may even find, given your natural aptitude for math, that you enjoy studying math with challenging teachers and similarly gifted peers. You will have lots of support if you aren’t too proud to seek it out. Tutors are available in every math and science subject and you will have the support and help of a pre-med advisor located at the Office of Career Strategy as well as one in the Health Professions Advising Office. Best of luck to you!
Zoebrittany, I’m not trying to diminish your experience, but it is not the norm. I spent three years tutoring introductory math and physics at Yale, and after receiving high ratings for tutoring, was assigned the very weakest students (ie bottom student in the entire pretest, junior who did not know middle school algebra). My experience was that these students had to work extremely hard to do well, but that grades above a B were accessible - the junior in question worked like mad and got an A on the final after a C or D on the first midterm.
I wanted to respond as I don’t want prospective students to be scared off by one terrible experience when it is not representative. After having worked with countless struggling students in these courses, I’ve been able to see first-hand what they can do when they get the help they need.
I agree with many of your points that students place into classes that are below their preparation, and that there are truly gifted math students at Yale. I’ve taught at another university, and the quality of the cohort is really not the same.
@exyalie15 - I love Yale. There is no other place in the world I want to go to college. My professors and classmates are extraordinary and always inspiring. But prospective students who cull these posts for insights into the academic and social lives of students can’t only receive white-washed information about the colleges they want to attend. I sincerely hope you pursue a career in teaching since you are clearly both a passionate and gifted math instructor. Unfortunately, my Calc professor and tutor were neither. Those facts combined with a strange grading system and my own shortcomings as a math student in comparison to my more gifted peers led to a very frustrating experience in Math 115 last semester. And I am not the only student who has had this experience in this course, despite your assertions to the contrary. But I can see why other students might not want to share such things publicly on this site.
My school no longer offers Calc AB and BC to students, so I am taking Dual Credit Calculus 1 instead. Given the extremely limited time period of the class, I´ve learned only the basics of derivatives and limits. I´ll probably be struggling in even the easiest Calculus class at Yale next year, but like the others said, there are extensive resources for students who need extra help. So what I´m saying is you definitely won´t be the worst math student, but you will struggle a bit and it will be okay. Just take advantage of office hours, TAs, etc etc and it will all be okay.
I didn’t take the class myself so I can’t really say too much but I did get some comments from my alumni interviewer. When I asked him about his favorite class at Yale he told me that he loved all of them…except for Calculus. He asked me if I had already taken Calc BC, which luckily I have, and he said that it was a good thing since it was by far his least favorite class. That’s just from his perspective though so it will probably be up to what kind of student you are.
I have a piece of general advice here–take the results of placement tests seriously, and if you are on the bubble between the harder and easier courses, strongly consider taking the easier one, even if it means an additional semester of math (or foreign language). You do not win anything for taking the hardest possible classes as soon as possible–to the contrary, it can be to your disadvantage to do this.
FWIW my daughter tested very high and was placed in what was supposed to be the proper level of math. She said that most of the kids in the class had already taken it in HS or Yale. She said that the teacher taught to those that already knew the subject and not someone new to the concept and she dropped it after a few weeks. Her dean told her that it was very common to have this happen and she should have asked around before just accepting the math placement. So keep that in mind. It is very common for students to take the same level they took in HS as a starting point.