I’m not a bad student, I’m doing well in class and was considering taking AP. However, I am interested in engineering, not learning a foreign language. I don’t want to waste my time taking a foreign language when I could be learning something I actually care about. I’m aiming for acceptance into MIT, Cal Poly, UC Berkley.
The three universities you named recommend or require at least the second or third level of high school foreign language (or equivalent proficiency shown by testing for the California public universities) for frosh admission.
usbalumnus, really? MIT requires a language? That surprises me. Well I see you say recommend. That is different. I would guess that a student choosing a STEM class over a language would not pay a price for it.
Cal poly and UCB require a minimum of 2 years of a Foreign language but 3 years is recommended. If you do not meet the minimum, your application will not be considered.
Top schools are looking for well rounded students, even STEM schools.
I disagree that top schools are looking for well rounded student, even STEM schools. In fact, MIT has many blogs about that very topic.I will clarify by saying if well rounded means you took the same courses everyone else did and always took language, science, history, english and math each year.
I agree with you 1000% TC. I am an engineering applicant myself, but I have no foreign languages. A lot of people here most likely never taken all Calculus courses, Differential Equations, and Calculus physics 1 and 2 to know how much work all of those courses take. It literally takes 2 years in college just to complete those courses I mentioned, which is how long one stays in a community college for to getting their associate’s degree. Maybe if you were majoring in liberal arts, communications, or women literature, then it would be plausible to study a foreign language. But most of the people here will not be rational since a lot of them are elitists.
As for your question, I know for a fact that Berkeley does not require foreign language for engineering applicants. I know this for a fact. I am sure MIT and Cal are the same way as well. But beware of some universities who make it a requirement even for engineering students such as UF. That is the main reason why I did not waste any time applying to that university. Anyways, good luck and I hope this helps.
Recommended (not required) by MIT: http://mitadmissions.org/apply/prepare/highschool
However, the typical applicant on these forums, from a high SES background in a well-resourced public or private high school, is generally advised to treat recommendations as requirements (the colleges may be more flexible to first generation, low SES, and other similarly disadvantaged applicants who may not have the opportunities or the advising to complete all of the expected recommendations in time). Frosh applicants of all potential majors are expected to have the well rounded base of typical high school college-prep course work, with more advanced courses and/or additional academic electives in the areas of interest added on top of such a base.
Not for engineering transfer applicants. However, all UCs and CSUs specify a minimum of level 2 high school foreign language or equivalent (e.g. through testing) for frosh applicants.
http://admission.universityofcalifornia.edu/freshman/requirements/a-g-requirements/
@thewizekid: See the a-g course requirements link that in post #3. 2 years of a FL is a requirement for in-coming Freshman for the UC’s but you can fulfill the requirement in different ways:
For Engineering majors to graduate from UCB, there is no foreign language requirement.
This poster is a HS student asking about taking FL.
SAT Subject Tests:
Score of 520 in Chinese With Listening Score of 540 in French/French With
Listening
Score of 510 in German/German
With Listening
Score of 520 in Italian
Score of 510 in Japanese With
Listening
Score of 500 in Korean With Listening
Score of 530 in Latin
Score of 470 in Modern Hebrew
Score of 520 in Spanish/Spanish With Listening
Scores listed above satisfy the entire requirement.
AP or IB Examination AP score of 3, 4, or 5 IB HL grade of 5, 6 or 7:
AP Language & Cultures Exam in Chinese, French, German, Italian, Japanese, or Spanish; or Spanish Literature & Cultures, or Latin or
Any IB HL Language B (formerly A2) exam satisfies the entire requirement.
U.S. Regionally Accredited College/University Courses
3 or more semester (4 or more quarter) units required
Grade of C or better in any UC- transferrable course(s) (excluding conversation) equivalent to two years of high school language instruction.
As usual, for top schools, you treat anything recommended as required. Note that they have plenty of qualified applicants to choose from. Many schools do require 2+ years of foreign languages. In many states and school districts, 2 years of foreign language is required for high school graduation.
If you come from a school that only offers two years, you won’t be penalized for having 2. However, the expectation at top schools is Level4 or AP. Level 3 is basically the lowest they’ll look at. At UC’s they’ll chuck your application if you don’t have 2 years, but realistically if your school offers more and you’re applying to UCB, UCLA, UCSD, and even UCSB, taking 2 years when your school offers 4 will need something pretty exceptional to be seen as okay.
(Keep in mind that foreign language is a “marker” of academic ability or intellectual curiosity, just like Math is.)
You may, during senior year, double up in science instead of taking level 4 in a language, but even if yo’ure a “well-lopsided” student, if you don’t have the basic foreign language level (2 for UCs, 3 for other top colleges), it’s as if you were a teenager stating “Well, I can add and subtract and draw circles, and I want to major in Literature, so why should I take Algebra1, let alone Algebra2?”
What are the odds that kid would get into a very to highly selective 4-year college?
The answer to the question above is triple, by the way: first, because it stimulates different parts of your brain, that you need to make it function at top level; second, because the goal of education is to have an educated person, and acquiring knowledge in a variety of areas is indispensable to being educated; third, because colleges want students who display intellectual curiosity, find learning “cool” or can at least get over the idea they should only study if they like what they’re learning, students who can push through the boredom and still excell.
However, you may look for colleges that do not require foreign language proficiency (or a low level of it) for college graduation requirements.
I think schools really look for 4 years in a foreign language. Your best bet would be to call the schools and ask what their standards are.
Note that many schools just say “strongly recommend” 2+ years of foreign language instead of “require” simply to leave a leeway for them to admit certain students they really want (e.g. recruited athletes).
You can look at the recommended/required classes for any school you are considering. They are typically found online pretty easily. You should take coursework that will meet the recommendations for each school. While some leeway may exist as noted above, it is best to have your classes in line with the recommendations unless you are a recruited athlete, the child of a huge donor, Malia Obama or someone along those lines.
Thank you to all who replied! My school only offers 3 years of foreign language so 4 is out of the question (Spanish 1,2, and AP). I decided that I’m probably just going to go for AP since Spanish isn’t even that difficult and just so I can be on the safe side. Most of the alumni who went to Ivies to major in engineering (nearly all of them because I go to a STEM school) took AP Spanish.
AP foreign language is usually considered equivalent to level 4 or higher. Assuming that students completing the AP Spanish course score reasonably on the AP Spanish test, that means that your high school’s Spanish courses are somewhat accelerated compared to those at high schools where AP Spanish is level 4 or 5.