<p>Our son got 7 official visits-basically everyone he filled out the recruiting form for-Out of 30+ kids on the “official visit”, one coach told us he had 4 “slots” Those were the ones he could guarantee(DIII) at his institution. The other kids need the ECs to make the “tip” more likely. Another Coach told our S that he had used up an extra “slot” the year before, so he had fewer this year.
Again, agreeing with the general thread, just adding to the albeit somewhat hazy knowledge base here of actual experiences.</p>
<p>It might be because my son is at a prep school, but the kids find out very early if they are going to an Ivy (I have already posted an article, printed in Harvard’s school newspaper, confirmed by the coach, that a basketball player from my son’s school had committed July before his senior year). My son’s classmate, currently a junior, has committed to Brown. The basketball coach announced it at a school meeting. There were similar early announcements for Ivies and even MIT the past couple of years…and they all materialized. So…I think it really depends on the sport. And…EC’s really don’t matter that much if you are a recruited athlete to an Ivy. Of course the teams do community service when they get to the school - Yale’s community service program for the football players is not unique; that is pretty standard in collegiate athletics, but it doesn’t mean they were expected to do that before they were at Yale.</p>
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<p>I am surprised to see this about MIT. They are quite firm that they don’t do earlies. Following quote is from an MIT adcom earlier this week on another thread:</p>
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<p>Now what the adcom says about the process doesn’t actually preclude the original comment, just that the app doesn’t get looked at until EA time and he wouldn’t find out until mid Dec. It may be that the coach knows well enough that the kid will be admitted but <em>not until EA</em>.</p>
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Jesus…Has he even taken the SAT and fulfilled his subject test requirements yet? Thought the only kids who committed this early were athletes at bigtime D1s, i.e. LSU, Alabama, etc.</p>
<p>^^I know. This happens a lot from my son’s school for one particular sport. Still, I would think they need his SAT scores (although my older son had a friend who went to Brown with a 900 total SAT (after three attempts)…there was a language barrier, so I guess they made a concession, but still…). I guess the schools are quite familiar with my son’s school and the rigor/quality of education. Plus, Brown does lower the standard…a lot. My daughter has a teammate in a “soft” sport who went. She was admittedly a “terrible” student and “hated school”. She only went to school until noontime each day because they trained 6 hours daily. Eventually, she stopped going to hs altogether so she could train double sessions. Common in her sport. Def. no other EC’s (of course her international level involvement - olympian - in her sport precluded it). </p>
<p>The MIT kid…all I know is that everyone at the school was saying he was going there in September. My son said, yes it’s true…and it was on our school’s website in the athlete news section. And he went.</p>
<p>That really is amazing, the first semester junior who knows he is going to Brown & it has been announced, with possibly no SAT scores to present, etc.
My D also goes to a highly regarded prep school, and as a first semester junior, just sat for the SATs last weekend at the encouragement of a D1 ivy coach. All the coaches who she has been in contact with tell her they are pleased that she has taken it so early. They will learn her initial scores earlier than the majority of her peers. I think that is just so they know whether or not she will be a feasible candidate for their admissions office, and better to know sooner than later if you want to keep this athlete on your radar. D has had a very high amount of interest within the last 6 weeks (since she sent out initial contact letters) but I keep telling myself it is still all so early - although maybe not for Brown basketball?! That is amazing - congratulations to your son’s friend!</p>
<p>^^I think sports like basketball, football, and hockey scoop up recruits very early. The whole Ivy basketball thing is pretty funny because it is not like they are basketball powerhouses or anything, but evidently they still take it quite seriously. </p>
<p>What sport is your daughter involved in?</p>
<p>“first semester junior who knows he is going to Brown & it has been announced”</p>
<p>No NCAA sport can make offers prior to July 1st of an athlete’s senior year. A kid or a high school coach can “commit” and “announce” all they want, but nothing is real until after July 1st for rising seniors. This is the case for D1 football, basketball, track, volleyball, soccer, etc, etc. My understanding is that most D111 and non ncaa leagues follow the same rules</p>
<p>Sure they can. It is not uncommon at all for gymnasts, for example to commit as sophomores. Sure, it’s not binding, but it happens all the time. My daughter’s two teammates both committed in the spring of junior year. It is extremely competitive and coaches can let their interest be known either by telling the athlete’s coach or telling the athlete if on their (the coaches’) campus. Happens in soccer, too. We have a handful of kids on my sons academy team who knew in advance where they were going. It might not be “real”, but all the cases I have known have materialized in the end. Even the girl who tore her achilles at nationals got to keep her spot.</p>
<p>There are the printed rules and then there is what actually occurs.</p>
<p>Pacheight, you are correct. I suppose you can verbally commit to Harvard when you’re in second grade if you want. It won’t be reciprocal until your senior year.</p>
<p>Again, I agree. Pacheight is correct. However, early verbals are not uncommon. More so in some sports than others. Also, an “offer” is a moot point here as Ivies don’t give athletic scholarships.</p>
<p>For example: Franklin and Marshall has D1 Wrestling. Colby has D1 Skiing. Johns Hopkins and Hobart has D1 Lacrosse. Colorado College, RPI, St. Lawrence, Clarkson, and Union all have D1 Hockey. These colleges had their D1 sports grandfathered in. I believe a D3 school can no longer add/change a sport to D1.</p>
<p>As far as EC’s and athletic recruiting: Every school has a different and unique way of looking at admissions. My S is a wrestler. Most, not all, coaches are THRILLED when they find an athlete who has everything/most things, including EC’s, going for them. The more the Admissions Personnel love the applicant, the better. The more the athlete/applicant is a solid member of society and has good strong character, the better (EC’s is one way to show that). </p>
<p>We found that coaches and admissions at LAC’s encouraged ED.</p>
<p>“verbal” or email, etc. chats between a junior-year athlete and a college coach about how much both want each other is happening a lot for the top junior-year recruits. That’s called recruiting! But commitments (verbal, written or other) and “announcements” don’t happen until Senior year, there are no exceptions to this except the occasional football or basketball coach who gets fired for doing so:)</p>
<p>Read Stemit’s new post and the attached article about a Duke BB recruit, for an example of worst-case scenario.</p>
<p>Another, from McCallie: “We are so proud of you, Clair!” Another: “Know that you ARE one of our future leaders.”</p>
<p>“one of our future leaders” is an exact quote on an email from an Ivy coach that I read when my junior-year daughter received it, along with ots of other similar phrases from a dozen top schools, including Duke. But all, including Duke, said also, you’re not “in” until your Senior year and “admissions” accepts you. </p>
<p>And the article shows no evidence that Duke actually said to this girl, in her Junior year, “you’re in” or guaranteed her a spot on the team. Although this is women’s basketball and Duke so if there’s a sport where they’re going to push the ncaa rule limits or interpretation, it’s basketball.</p>
<p>btw: another wake up call to athletes and parents, a lot of recruited athletes get benched or cut their freshman year…no guarantees out there!</p>
<p>my point is that there’s a lot of selling going on the junior year and understandably there are kids and families misinterpreting this “sell” as “accepted”. But at the end of the day it’s only recruiting and nothing is a done deal until the fall of your senior year.</p>
<p>That Duke article was very interesting</p>
<p>I know at DCs school
2 boys are signing for baseball
and 1 girl for rowing at the end of Nov…
I don’t know what they are signing/committing too–just know one of the student-athletes and about the ceremony. That student wanted a written offer before they would withdraw from other schools.</p>
<p>Alot of swimners in our area “know” where they will go to college by spring Jr yr–as well
but as I have read–and a coach has said, until you have something, you have nothing…</p>
<p>Expanding on Pacheights remarks, coaches are masters of the spoken ambiguity; masters of the vagueness of the English language; masters of the art of verbal hairsplitting. Coaches have done this to literally thousands of parents!</p>
<p>Parents, who are most likely rookies in the process, are proficient at interpreting recruiting coaches conversations about their fine athlete in a light most favorable to the athlete.</p>
<p>So, for example a conversation goes like this: Coach Your D/S is just the type of athlete, student and person we are recruiting. Parent [thinking, but not saying oh, this feels so good!]. Coach: I can see him/her really having an impact on the program. Parent [thinking, but not saying a starter as a freshman; all-league as a sophomore!] Coach: I can see him/her playing here. Parent [thinking but not saying it will be the proudest moment of our lives to see him/her in a _______ uniform!] </p>
<p>What did the coach really say? Nothing at all. Nothing except meaningless platitudes! </p>
<p>The parents, however, probably interpreted those platitudes as conveying a firm lock not only for a roster spot, but something closer to s/d will be the linchpin of this team!</p>
<p>You know, we may parse every word of the college essay so that the final product is clear, concise and understood; but, when it comes to understanding recruiting lingo we really need a special dictionary and maybe even a special hearing aid!</p>
<p>This is not in any way directed at poking fun at the parents during this process; it is really a call to pay ATTENTION really pay attention to the SPECIFIC words used by the recruiting coaches. If you think the words used do not convey a level of specificity that you want to hear; ask the coach to clarify. Keep asking until you have fleshed the idea out. Do not be afraid to ask the coach he/she will tell you if they cannot answer a question (for example, if the conversation addresses playing time, recognize that there is no guarantee of playing time once you are on the team. Playing time goes to the deserving; any coach who tells you other wises has not said what you think he/she said.)</p>
<p>Caveat emptor when it comes to recruiting. </p>
<p>And we are the buyer!</p>
<p>“still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest…”</p>
<p>Paul Simon</p>
<p>So how do you tell when the coach has changed from vague jargon to sbustantiated words expressing a genuine spot on the team? Is it only when the likely letter/scholarship comes in senior year?</p>
<p>^^ these phrases are generally good:) “you are my #1 recruit” or “if you come here I’ll start you” or if it’s football "we’d like to meet your mother:) The D1 football coaches close in the living room, with mama! They know who’s really making the decisions.</p>
<p>Coaches are good people and they really want the best for the kids. And most will always follow the pitch with BUT you still have to be admitted by admissions. As a poster above said, the athlete and parents gotta here both, the pitch and the disclaimer, to be level headed about what’s going on.</p>
<p>although it is true most recruits get in, because most coaches will have you pre-read (and approved) before they end up your living room or call you on a Sunday. BTW Sunday calls are a very good sign!!!</p>